Father - baby bonding

[mines]

Another quick survey for all you mumsnetters. What are your experiences with father/baby bonding?

Talking to my dh last night he sheepishly confessed that at present he is jealous of me because I plainly love (or am obsessed by) our ds (four months old).

He's really worried, poor love, because he doesn't and finds both him and baby talk pretty boring. This is despite strenuous efforts on his part (he's changing, feeding, bathing, cuddling and smiling at ds as much as he can).

I've tried to tell him that this isn't uncommon with a first baby and he needs to be patient and keep doing what he's doing, but there's no doubting this was a bit of a shock to me (I had thought dh was getting quite keen on ds).

This worries me, too - plainly I would like dh to love ds as much as I do but maybe we will just have to wait until ds is older. Or perhaps I need to do something more drastic - go away for a weekend and leave them together?

What's other people's experience of father-baby relationships?

My little boy is nine and a half months old and my husband admits he's besotted for the first time since he was born! Now that ds is becoming a little "person" instead of a little baby, their relationship has blossomed. Dh has always shared the care and been a constant support, but admits he found nothing inspiring about newborns! I don't mind at all...he got there in the end!

My personal experience is of dp growing to love dd more and more, but certainly preferring her company now she is a bit older (2.5). He has always loved her deeply, but admitted that he found the early days frustrating and limiting as she was breastfed and I was a SAHM and tended to do everything for her. She's always been a real mummy's girl too and made it clear that she preferred me, which must have been really hard on him.

I think you are being very supportive to him, and you obviously both have a very good relationship - a) that he can openly admit his fears and b) that you sympathise with him.

I think going away and leaving him with the baby will help him to learn how to do the everyday things, but you can't force a bond/love between them, it will come naturally, especially if he feels that he can talk openly to you.

Mines, my experience is that some men do find that baby stage boring: hell, I did too! Although of course I love ds I feel that once he got older and started talking etc he got more interesting and fun to be with for me and (ex) DH. Certainly I feel that now he is over 4 it is DH's and dp's 'time'. i.e they love playing and talking football and sports with him and seem to understand him better in some ways since they are male too.

My cousin and his wife told me that they found themselves looking at first child (a boy too) when he was 4 months and saying: Cousin: "Do you love him?" Wife: "No. Do you?" Cousin: "No, thank god for that!" Of course they didn't mean it, but the first baby is hard and they certainly felt like it at the time. HTH.

Your DH sounds just like mine. DH finds little babies intensely boring, our own 3 included, but once they get moving (6m on) gets progressively more enchanted, certainly he is far better at rough and tumble/loud/throwing in the air games than me. I've heard other dads say similar things-they love the baby but don't find it as all-consuming as they feel they're expected too.

Looking at it objectively I completely understand that feeling, after all dads haven't got the hormones to help. I agree that your DH should carry on doing what he's doing, but perhaps say to him that he's got nothing to feel guilty/jealous about and talk up the future- kids can get a wicked sense of humour from 9m or so (IME). Sorry this is so rambling, I just think that the best thing you can do is reassure DH and try not to dwell on this too much. I don't think going away for a w/e would help much at this time as your DS is still fairly small. Honestly though, remember it doesn't mean he doesn't love your DS and he will find it more fun as the baby grows! DH is keen for no 4, not for the baby bit but because he loves the little people they turn in too.

Mines, I was lucky in that my dh was besotted with ds (and later dd) right from the word go.

However, he admits that when ds was tiny he sometimes felt very excluded and useless because I was breastfeeding ds and therefore was able to calm and look after ds in a way that he couldn't. He says he sometimes felt like a bit of a spare part.

This amazed me because to me he was totally necessary. I don't know how I would have managed without his care and support.

Reassure your husband how much you love him and need him. IMHO it is a very positive sign that he will talk to you about how he feels about this - many men wouldn't. It's also great that, despite his feelings, he's really trying to do his bit.

Also reassure him that what he is going through isn't at all uncommon, and as your ds starts to do more and show more character he'll fall for him. I loved both my babies to bits, but I can't say I found them terribly interesting until they started to sit up and take notice of the world. Just give it time and try not to stress about it too much.

Mines, my dh was in love with dd as soon as she popped out but that didn't mean he'd rather be with her than sit on the sofa and watch the cricket/ golf / football or whatever other sport was on telly on a Saturday afternoon ! Unfortunately ! However, have to say that now that dd is 9 months she is heaps more fun and he enjoys her much more every day and I'm sure when she's talking and able to hold a conversation he will never want to be away from her !

I also think that the bonding is far easier for mother than father because it is biological.

I spent my first night away from dd on Monday night in a hotel with Dh and I bawled my eyes out in the evening because I hadn't put her to bed and in the morning I felt sick when I woke up and she wasn't there and dh didn't feel any of this although he did miss her.

I agree with Tillysmummy that I find I actually physically miss DS when I'm at work (even though its a year since he started nursery) and I know DH is not like this. I left DS with DH for one night to go on a close friend's hen night last August and hated it. Finally persuaded myself to leave him with my parents for a wedding later this month.

Also DH did start to enjoy DS more when he could play and joke. They play really well together now - I'm more for doing activities although I quite enjoy the rough and tumble play but DH is great at just go with the flow playing following DS's lead.

One thing he said though was that when we had health problems with DS last winter because he had a granuloma on his face which kept bleeding heavily involving trips to casualty for cauterising and finally an op he really started to realise how much he really did love DS and how much he felt for him. Sometimes the love is there without them realising.

I had kind of the opposite experience with dd and dh. Dh was close to both dd and ds from the very start, getting involved. He was great with newborn dd, would talk to her, smile at her and change nappies, etc. I, on the other hand, felt like I was just going thru the motions. I was very "numb" after dd was born, felt very detached and down (later realised I had PND but it wasn't picked up for about 6 months). It was very hard, and looking back now I feel like I was so awful, and honestly like I was a bit of a failure at the whole motherhood thing for about the first year of dd's life. I remember very early on, dh asked me if I loved dd, and I just sat looking at him blankly, then shrugged. I just couldn't say honestly that I did, I didn't feel it. That's a terrible thing, for a mother to not be able to say she loves her baby, isn't it? Dh was horrified and disgusted with me. I still feel so ashamed when I think of it. So it was fortunate that dh did bond quickly with dd, since I didn't.

When ds was born I was so worried it would happen again and I wouldn't feel anything for him, but thank goodness I did almost straight away. I still feel more of a bond with him to this day, although I would never admit it to dh or dd. Having written all this, I feel a bit silly now, since it's not really what your post was about. Sorry to "sabotage" it with my own sad little story, but I do want your dh to know it isn't anything to be embarrassed about, and for you not to worry, that it will come with time, esp once dd starts responding more with giggles, words, clapping hands etc. Before you know it, dd will have him wrapped around her little finger! It would be a shame if in years to come he has regrets or feels bad about his feelings (like me). I have heard that skin-to-skin contact helps the bonding process, so maybe your dh could try taking dd in the shower sometimes? HTH

My dh bonded with our ds straight away, he delivered him, put his first clothes on, gave him his first bath. He did feel awkward though as if I knew how to do everything naturally. He did feel a little left out with feeding as I breastfed but he did do everything first like bath and solids which helped. He also thought that as he was at work all day ds wouldnt know who he was and when he was newborn he did prefer to be with me and up until a few months ago would only go to sleep with me. Now dh has a little shadow that follows him everywhere every minute he is home, he cant go anywhere without him and he liked it when he got to the age where he could throw him around and rough and tumble with him. The newborn stage goes so fast that soon your dh will be wishing he can go to the loo on his own. Wait until he buys him his first football kit or something similar that he is fond of and watch him melt

I have to admit that with dd when she first arrived I was at a bit of a loss. I loved her in an abstract sort of way but this little person had suddenly burst into my life and I had no way of knowing what I felt.

Since then I know that I love her and would miss her if she was not there but I don't think I have bonded anywhere nearly as much as dw has.

DD smiles and giggles at us and you can see the love in her mothers eyes when it happens, I just think it is nice and she is cute but it isn't this overwhelming feeling that some people told me it would be.

Sorry mines, just realised I called your ds a dd...oops

Simon, what you say is very interesting. I have wondered for some time whether mums and dads love their offspring in quite the same way. My dh is a super dad, and totally involved with our ds and dd. I know that he loves them to bits, and if necessary would die for them, but he seems more objective about them and less self-sacrificing than me. I'm not sure he feels the same fierce visceral love for them that I do, or that he has ever had that actual physical need to touch them that I felt when they were babies. Maybe kids need the different qualities being loved differently can give them?

Mollipops and Sobernow - I can't tell you whether I favour one child over the other. At the moment ds is 4 3/4, and is my loving and affectionate golden boy, whereas his sister is going through the terrible twos with a vengeance and can be hard to like. This makes it difficult to compare my feelings for them objectively! I do know that I love both of them dearly - maybe I will forever swing from preferring one to the other depending on what phase they are going through? I feel more protective towards ds because he is a friendly little boy who is a bit oversensitive and can get very upset when others don't behave well, whereas dd seems a much more self-sufficient and self-confident little individual who I feel will make her way in the world very well thank you (dh thinks so too, so this is not just a mother's preference for her son!).

Azzie

I know that dw and I seem to love my dd in different ways. DW and I have discussed this sort of thing before and not just with the love for children but in general as well.

I think it may be a gender thing, I know my parents both loved me but as you say their love seemed to be different. Even now my mother still wants hugs from us but when my father was alive he showed his love more in the pride he felt in how we had developed and the men my brothers and I had become.

Mollipops, Its really interesting that you raised the question of gender, as I have been wondering about this re me and my kids. D.s (almost 7) was my first child, and tho I hate to admit it, I feel some special bond with him that hasn't quite developed with the other two yet. Maybe its more to do with him being the first rather than being a boy? I love all my kids to bits (as we all do) and could not honestly say I love d.s.1 more but perhaps I feel a bit differently twds him. Does that make sense? Also, d.s.1 is shy, quiet,usually considerate and I guess I feel more protective twds him than twds my d.d who is very outgoing, quite a character and generally, I can see exactly where she is coming from!! Baby is just lovely and has not yet, at 8 months, developed a strong personality apart from being cute!

Oxocube, re bonding : I think lots of it is to do with age, not gender. You have so many shared memories with your 7 year old. How can your 1 year old compete with this at the moment? I have a toddler and an 8 year old. I love both equally but have a different relationship with each. And yes, I do feel closer to my oldest right now.

But, I when my lovely 8 year old hits puberty and wants to keep mummy at arms length, I know I'll then have a second 8 year old's company to enjoy every bit as much as the first's.