Is this abusive? Help me define it pls

[CreamTeaTotty]

I saw a similar thread the other day when I was lurking but it's disappeared...

I'm on the brink of separating from my DH for a variety of reasons. But a few of my friends have pointed out that he's been abusing me for a few years now and I'm either in denial or it's so subtle it's hard to see it as 'abuse' exactly.

My DH has had a long standing emotional affair over eight years which I'm now finally dealing with. As in - I just want him to leave.

He frequently asks me if I love him and if I fancy him, usually very early in a morning jabbing in the back me with an erection. I usually grunt something that might sound like a yes (half asleep). Then he attempts to have sex with me and more often than not I refuse, get out of bed to make tea or have a wee and not return. But sometimes I give in and allow it. As in - can't be bothered to resist. I take no active role in it, just lay there until he's finished.

On a couple of occasions I've woken to find him undressing me. So I've got angry and pushed him away. Then left the room.

Yesterday I was laying on the bed on my tummy texting a friend and he came into the room, started groping my arse, then lay on top of me and grabbed both my boobs and fondled them really hard (it hurt) so I pushed him off and left the room.

We are soon to be having an inevitable argument about why we are separating and I just need to get clear in my head what this actually IS.

Sexual assault for a start. He isn't waiting to see if you are willing, he's just pawing/assaulting you.

Does he know that you're going to separate?

Or are you looking for a reason to give him? You don't have to give any reason, just say it's over, you don't want to be with him any more.

He doesn't know yet.

We've been here many times before.
I don't need it as any sort of excuse, things are pretty awful anyway with the lack of respect he's shown me over the last eight years farting about with another woman.

I've never raised it as an issue before with him. My friends think I should.

Another question: is it normal in a marriage of 16 years to not kiss someone when you are having sex with them?

DO NOT engage in an argument. A man that entitled will argue you into a corner and you will end up doubting everything you thought you knew. (Has that happened before?)

How to approach the conversation: be as boring as possible. Blandly say, "it's not you, it's me." Repeat in reply to anything he says. Be monotonous.

I'm serious. You think you owe him an explanation, but how does the woman he doesn't respect teach him what respect should look like?

I tried to leave my h twice. The first time I gave him the explanations. We went in circles for months and I couldn't break free, basically because I couldn't find a way to end that conversation! No wonder: he was totally invested in keeping it going. The second time, i did what I'm suggesting you do.

The most important thing is getting away and starting a fresh life. Teaching him common decency isn't your priority. (As if you could, anyway.)

I had no kissing at any time. It makes sex pretty (ahem) dry in more than one sense. I've not heard anyone else say that: I thought it was just me and my dreadful technique...

I tell ya something: freedom and the single life are just brilliant!

It's abusive.

No matter how much you try and explain to him how wrong his behaviour is, he won't get it.

I second the circular conversations which end with you doubting yourself. Get yourself some Councelling, if you can.

Thanks Charlotte x

Being honest here my 1st marriage ended because of the same sexual aspects you have brought up , my second looks like going the same way because of the exact combination of issues you have. I have come to the conclusion I am just not that bothered about sex, I never have been really apart from 1st few months . Problem is both husbands have been expecting sex to continue as per the first few years and I am just not one of these people who can fake being into it however hard I try. Husband is good looking, not fat, well dressed , interesting job and I'm still not bothered. I'm 54 , but clearly it's not allowed these days to key that side drop, maybe some of us on here should set up a 'swap a partner' site!! Lol

Update...

So I slept in the living room last night. He woke me up at 4am demanding to know why I wasn't in bed. I quietly explained that because of this other woman he's been faffing with for 8 years. I just want it all to stop and that we are going round and round in circles. And that I don't want to sleep with him any more.

He basically blamed everyone and everything else, but mainly me. Feels rejected his whole life, by his parents, work colleagues, bosses, my parents...

If I loved him and showed him affection then he wouldn't need to keep contacting this other woman.

I spend too much time on social media (it's my job but also my lifeline, most of my friends live far away). And I've been having too many jollys going away at weekends with friends to gigs and festivals etc.

I'm going to stay in the living room at night.

NO IDEA how to get him to leave. He won't! He's stubborn and says he has no money to pay for anywhere to rent, has debts (which are my fault for buying kids clothes and birthday presents on his credit card).

Esoteric: In previous relationships it's been very different in the sex department, but the relationships ended for other reasons. Our sex life was actually OK for the first 13 years. It only went wrong just after my son was born and I was unwell with PND and a thyroid issue. It was at that point that he started looking for attention elsewhere. I was overweight and really not making the best of myself at that point in time.

Clarification on length of relationship:
Married 16 years, but together for 23 years.

So obviously it's over. You know that emotionally. You now have to take steps practically. No excuses. It will be painful, messy, financially difficult but the alternative is groundhog day for both of you ad finitum. In the words of Nike, Just do it.

It's time to talk to a solicitor to explore your options.

4am? That was thoughtful.

On the plus side, his tirade, designed to make you jump to attention and try to be better, has given you the perfect reason to block out any arguments with a tired "I'm not right for you. You deserve better."

Which, obviously, is total bollocks, but the more you can block him from your headspace the more you've got an advance on the freedom you're heading towards.

How to physically separate is tough. Could you leave? That's what I did. It was heaven to leave all his junk and mess behind and it even made it easier for the DCs to visit him in the early days, before they were used to spending time just with him.

He sounds just like my husband. Yuck. Can you contact Women's Aid? Whatever his problems are, they are absolutely not of your making and life shouldn't be like this.

Oh please get some support OP to help you get him out, do you have any strong men around, brothers, uncles?

He's been sexually abusing you, never mind the OW, you need to get rid and then get into counselling because this relationship is a zillion miles away from being normal or healthy.

Ta all - We've had words about him not approaching me or sleeping together.

I'm about to start a separate thread on the next steps x