No money, two children, no time, too much work, never speak... how do we get out of this one?

[bagofsnakes]

First off, I love my husband and I'd like to continue being married - that's the aim. That said, I feel completely overwhelmed at this point in our relationship and I've no idea how to change it... and change it we must because if we carry on like this, I'll become depressed beyond words.

I don't even know where to start... I'm typing this now as husband is asleep, he fell asleep putting our eldest to bed at 7.30. I've not seen him since then, it was the same last night. I'm lonely.

We have no money. He works in job where he is massively underpaid for what he does. I have to work my ass off around the childcare to make ends meet. We can only afford 21 hours of childcare a week so I work those hours but that's not enough money so I work evening and weekends to pull in more. So we have no family life.

He also has to commute 2.5 hours per day (total - by train) so he's out of the house 12 hours a day. And so it's me and two small children (18 months and just turned 4) for far too much of the time. We have no family close by (mine are hundreds of miles away, his thousands) so I'm kind of going crazy doing all of this shit by myself.

He really, really, REALLY needs to get a new job. Ideally one that is closer to home and one that pays more - but one or the other would be a start. He's complacent because he doesn't think that things are that bad. I've tried to tell him that they are but he just doesn't get it. I've been asking him for over a year to look for a new job but he just tells me that there isn't anything out there for him.

If I catch him watching crap on YouTube, messing around on his fantasy sports team or watching OITNB again instead of looking for new job, updating his CV or networking - I.am.going.to.lose.my.shit!

Because I don't have any fucking free time to do that shit. Nor can I fall asleep with the babies, because I have fucking work to do!

The fact that I work evenings and weekends really bothers my husband, he doesn't cope very well with both children by himself and he'd like us to be together as a family. So would I. I would also like to shower regularly and get some sleep.

I don't know how to even start another conversation with him about this because we've had it so many times. He thinks that I am pressuring him into earning more money... which I am. But he doesn't need to work more, he could work the same hours and earn far more. The only way I'm going to earn more money is by working more hours... and there just aren't any more to work. I'm freaking exhausted.

Exhausted wives don't want sex.

Yeah, that's another issue. There is no of that going on.

How do I make him understand? I need another angle.

Oh, and he's on at me to have a third child! HA!

You have to do it in a nice way. Start by telling him how you admire what a wonderful father he is and respect how he is working so hard. Sell it to him as you want to spend more time together and you want to work together to help you as a family spend more time together (even if that is spending more time together in bed sleeping it's a great start). Once he says yes ask him if he would be ok if you looked for jobs that might be suitable and closer to home. Do not mention wages. Men are funny when it comes to wages and low wage is a major blow to most men's esteem (this is a major reason why women earn less).

I would then plonk the kids infront of the TV if you have a computer at home and do a search for jobs. See what is out there and closer to home plus paying more. Aim to apply for 5 jobs a week. Each night go over the positions that you found with him and apply for them.

You have my sympathy. If he had a shorter commute you could work an additional 2 hours a day which is 10'hours a week. That is a lot of time.

I am in a similar situation. I feel your pain. You are dealing with it incredibly well. I agree with everything SuperMum just said. As someone who just lost her shit, don't. Try the nicely, nicely approach....it works much better. I hope things get better for you both x

admire him for being a wonderful father - are you having a laugh?

Bloody hell,I could of wrote that myself 15 years ago....that is fucking weird....

Trying to think how I could advise .......we ended up moving near to dh work to cut out his traveling time....I obviously lost my job...coz I couldn't travel 2 and a half hours to work....fuck me this is weird...so weird..anyway it was a disaster as he packed the job in a year after we moved...and it took me fucking years to get over the move and settle in a place I hate...don't suppose that helps much thou

Also.generally in my humble experience,they don't change .. Men I mean...the battles you are having with him now ,I bet anything will be the same ones you will be having in ten yrs time...accept it ,or get out while you can ,would be my advice...it's shit.and I feel your pain. X

I agree with smiling. Why are you going softly / nicely. He is not stupid, he knows that you aren't home with him a lot of the time, he can see you're exhausted and he knows you have no money. He also knows he's out a lot at work and that you want him to change jobs. He's making a choice, not only to not make your life easier, but also to put the whole stress on your shoulders! How is it fair that he keeps the job he wants when you work around him, organising childcare and squeezing in your work hours when you can to keep the family afloat.

Instead of going softly with him, take a serious look at what your life would look like alone - he would have access, so you would have a break, and he would be paying maintenance. Even if you don't intend to leave, pointing out to him that you could, and that there would be benefits for you if you did, may just shock him into getting his arse into gear!

I suggest going softly because the man is trying and he, by what you have said in your OP, is sensitive about his working status. He is working hard and trying and you have to commend him for getting out of bed each day and taking himself off to work when he isn't happy about it. If you tear a strip off the guy he is going to shut himself off further. You love him and no doubt he loves you too. The early years are so demanding. You don't need to leave. This is a man who has passed out on his child's bed, not infront of the TV after sucking down a 12 pack of beer. I've fallen asleep on my kids beds too many times over the last 5 years. It happens. it can be overwhelming when you are applying for a job in a country you are not from. I get it. I personally think he probably is paralyzed by fear and that's why he hasn't applied for other jobs.

Men don't think like us (it kills me to say it, they are different as much as i would like/believe us to be the same) talk to him. Tell him how you feel. Spell it out!!! Literally. If he don't get it....there are bigger problems

I agree withPetal ..my man hasnt changed in almost 30 yrs !!i feel your pain as we work a silly amount of hours over evenings and weekends and dh gets up 430 am and does a 3 hr commute for the same amount as me and i work 8 minutes away so all his time and money goes on travel.I feel your frustration.

(((hugs)))
What sort of job does DP do? What do you do? Is there any chance of you getting a better job?
Have you considered Home Start for a bit of respite when you have the kids?

" and you have to commend him for getting out of bed each day and taking himself off to work when he isn't happy about it."
You also have to commend the op for all the work she does where she doesn't get to do hours that suit her because she has to fit in around the man
As a pp said, why is the op the only one who sees this stuff?

I do commend the OP and I can only imagine how awful it is to be living in such a high stress situation. However she has tried the rational approach. It didn't work. That's why I'm offering an alternative solution.

snap.....work 12 hour night shifts, he works days.....hardly ever see him and when i do hes playing on the playstation or watching top gear or asleep on the settee.....bored shitless i am.....and will eventually lose my shit if i have to ask him todo one small task like empty the dishwasher and he says 'in my own time'.... bloody irritating that a 46 year old mans life revolves around a playstation (2nd one....1st one ended up smashed to bits in the boot of my car)

What worked with DH to make him realise the situation was to talk in numbers.
How many hours of work? How many hours of down time?

Be honest on both accounts.

I suspect that he is happy with the situation because he actually has more down time than you.
And yes he would prefer not to be on his own with the dcs. Which actually says that he doesn't see looking after the dcs as his responsibility (so I suspect if he had a job closer, he would have more time for himself and would be very happy to leave you with more of the childcare. Is that right?)
so I'm at the idea that he feels it's ok to moan about 'finding it hard'.

Re money how much more money would you need so taht you don't have to work evenings or weekends?

Thank you all so much for some insight:

Want2bSupermum You are right, he is an awesome dad and falling asleep with the boys is a testament to that - although it does mean that he's not helping with the house, talking to me or looking for a job, because he's sleeping. You're also right that it has to be a gentle approach, although I sometimes feel telling him that I could leave might be the shocker he needs... on the other hand, that could just make him sad, insecure and despondent... and I'm really not going to leave. But we could both become very unhappy.

Petal40 It's actually really reassuring to know that someone else has been through a strikingly similar situation.

HandbagCrazy You are right that he MUST know these things right?? Sometimes, when I am feeling really bad, I perceived his lack of action on the job front as his lack of care/love for me. Which makes me crazy sad because it's clear as to how much he adores his children but his feeling for me... not so clear.

cheminotte Thank you for the reminder that there are resources out there. I will look into the local Home Start (if they have any funding!) and see what there is. I could get a better job but it would mean going back to work full time and for about 18 months/2 years (earning very little after paying for childcare) before I'd get a big promotion. Even with a big promotion, I'd still be earning less that DH does now and our children would be in full-time childcare.

Lemonlady22 If he had a playstation, I would smash it, I know I would.

EverythingWillBeFine I know that his life isn't easy but I also KNOW that he has more free time than me. I feel guilty for spending 15 mins replying to all of your lovely posts instead of working. He's been watching something in the living room for an hour now.
We'd need an extra £5,000 or there abouts. We're actually about £15,000 down now I work part time but we live a frugal life (cheap tastes!) and so can manage without much of that... but not all of it. If he switched jobs, he could easily command another £10,000 a year, at least. If he was working closer to home we'd save the £400 a month he spends on train fare. It could all be so, SO much easier...

And thank you to those who reminded me that it really shouldn't be all ME trying to bridge the financial gap, organize childcare and keep everything going. But it is too often women that take this hit, right?