Please help, how can I stop giving the silent treatment

[PippinLost]

For background DH and I have been together 6 years and have 2 children - 4yo DD and 4mo DS. DH works long hours of varying shifts and I am on maternity leave.

I have a history of depression from a teenager that rears itself every so often generally when I'm finding things stressful. I have felt fine after the baby up until the past week or so and I'm wondering whether I could have PND or not.

I've hardly seen DH this past week due to his working hours and I've found it difficult with the children. This has resulted in me pretty much staying in the whole time which, in turn, makes me feel worse. I am struggling currently.

DH and I have had a couple of difficult days together, he's been working all weekend so we have maybe seen each other on our own for 4 hours at most.

I have been upset at him this weekend which was triggered by me giving him his Father's day gift on Friday (as he wouldn't see the children the rest of the weekend) and he didn't look at it. I spent a lot of time and effort on the gift and it wasn't cheap and I was really looking forward to him opening it and looking at it. I mentioned it on Saturday night and he said he would look at it but wanted us to do it together and I was just going to bed as was worn out after the children. I then asked him last night if he was going to look at it and he said yes but still didn't but proceeded to watch tv for a couple of hours then I went to bed. It's still sitting in the kitchen untouched.

Another issue is he dislikes his job and has done for a couple of years. He often mentions looking for another job. I spent hours helping him create his CV for him and looked online for jobs to help him out as he doesn't have much free time. I've sent him all these jobs but he's never applied for any of them. He is constantly saying he is going to look and has never applied for anything. He is miserable in his job and is always talking about it and saying he wants out. I feel like a broken record giving the same advice over and over but he doesn't do anything to change the situation.

I find it very difficult to explain how I'm feeling and have been giving him the silent treatment pretty much since Saturday night. I don't know how to articulate how I'm feeling without coming across as confrontational. I went to bed early on Saturday night then he was working all day yesterday. He text me from work and all was fine then he came in and went straight into how awful his day was without asking about mine. Then he, again, didn't look at the gift after saying he would. He asked me what was wrong and if I was bored. I said I was struggling and that sometimes I just wanted to run away and not come back. He replied with that's horrendous but mat leave is such a short time so it'll be over soon. Then he started to moan about his work again. I gave him the same advice again but got annoyed because it's the same over and over with no change from him. I then went to bed again and he said oh, here we go again.

I find it easier to walk away because I can't trust myself to not say something I'll regret in the heat of the moment. I give him the silent treatment because it's easier for me than trying to discuss it. It hurts him when I do this and I don't want to do that. I can feel it chipping away at our relationship until it's completely eroded and we won't get it back.

My mum used to give my dad the silent treatment, they have been divorced for decades now but he still sometimes mentions how bad it was. I have some awful character traits from my mum and I hate it.

Can anyone help me change the way I communicate?? I've looked online but can only find things about being on the receiving end of it and how it's a form of control and abuse

There was another strategy for messy spouses here on MN that was very popular. Originated by a poster - can't remember who. You tell them that every time they dump something in a heap, they should say to themselves "Fuck you, Pippin - YOU do it".

Feel free to say it for them!

About the gift. Put it in the middle of the table. Point at it and ask him to put it away wherever he wants as it's his. He doesn't have to open it if he doesn't want to - but he does have to do something with it so it's not cluttering up the place. It's Tuesday now FFS!

No, it wasn't shit in retrospect.
I expect it'll come into its own in a few years time when suddenly both kids seem quite grown up and you've forgotten those events...
But sometimes you have to recognise that all the effort that went in was because you enjoy doing it, and it's not fair to expect your partner to jump for joy over that - in fact, if they haven't made one they won't realise how much effort it was! I used to think it was a bit of a quick easy no thought present tbh then I made one for GPs... It can take ages!

He should be polite and appreciative.

But think of it this way - if you'd bought him the latest novel by his favourite author, would you mind if he put it aside to enjoy a week later when he was in the mood for it? You wouldn't expect him to read it immediately because if was a gift

He hates books so it definitely wouldn't be that example! I KNOW he hates books and yet I still gave him one?? He never even bloody opened it so he doesn't know what kind of book it is

Agree with the PP who said the gift should be about the receiver. He still should have been polite and looked at it though and been a teeny bit appreciative I feel.

Why is the gift shit???

YY to learn to communicate better.
One way to do that is to stop using YOU sentences (as in YOU never pick up avatar yourself') with I sentences (as in 'I feel that I am are ding my time picking up after everyone in the house, the dcs, you And that makes me feel like a maid').
You need to explain your feelings to him rather than rant about what he dyes the do iyswim.
I found that when I'm really angry it helps to write what I want to say down and/or to reverse it in my head. That way I'm calmer and I know what I want to say so it comes out better

Did he even unwrap it? ??

Yes the "fuck you, pippin clear my shit up for me!" Is highly effective when you point out this is what he is doing in effect.

It works on primary school age children too, albeit differently. Tell them when they leave a mess they are saying "Mummy, tidy up my mess instead of giving me attention."

My friend's DH altered it to "I am leaving my socks on the floor for you to pick up WifesName because I don't want sex." which made us all laugh.

So he moans about his job all the time yet isn't motivated to look for another one? Stop giving him advice. He's not taking it. It's up to him what he wants to do about it.

He hasn't openedhis father's day present? Put it somewhere obvious and say when he get s in, there it is. Do something with it.

He's really messy and doesn't help around the house? Agree with Elspeth about this too - or you could just get a big black sack and dump everything in it at the end of each day. Your 4yo is old enough to help putting his own toys away, tho.

The silent treatment - you need to practise saying things calmly so that things don;t fester and don;'t come out in a big explosion later.

'Dh, I am hurt that you haven't opened your present. I put a lot of time and effort into it and it makes me feel you don't value me or our relationship as you haven't opened it.'

'Dh, I am hurt that you have left a huge mess for me to clear up. It makes me feel you don't value me or our relationship and it doesn't make me want to have sex with you. It makes me resent you.'

See what he says.

A few people have mentioned writing down what I want to say. I'm coming round to that idea more now. I don't know why I'm so nervous about speaking to him about it! Well, I suppose it's probably about my concern of upsetting him. But I can't control his feelings about his reaction to what I say as long as I say it in a measured, non-confrontational way he had to take ownership for his reaction I guess.

We'll have time together before Friday so I should really speak to him this week.

Your relationship has many similarities with my own and DH to be honest. The gift of the photo/memory book with anecdotes. I am wondering about that.
If your DH made that and gave it to you, you would be utterly bowled over by the thought and care and love that went into it.
However. It sounds that your DH has difficulty with his emotions. Like many men (excuse generalisation), a lot of them do have difficulties expressing emotions and they worry about their relationships with their children especially. His avoidance of the gift is not about avoiding the gift, it is an avoidance of coming into contact with emotions. I'm speculating widely here and could be way off the mark. But if he's anything like my DH he can't manage Love, no better than he can manage the anger, sadness or hurt. I figure he will look at it when he is alone and really love it. That book you made represents the love of his family and he literally cannot handle it, physically or emotionally...at this point in time. Has he had any bereavements in his life of close family members?
If you gently place it aside, I think by this time next year he will really love and treasure it.
I thought it was a Fitness Tracker you got him or some such!

The gift is a printed photo album type book that I had made up for him. It has little anecdotes about him as well as photos of when he was younger and also photos of the children and us as a family. There are a couple of our eldest's drawings printed in it too. So kind of like a memory book.

That will come over as a passive-aggressive gift, far more about the giver than the recipient. It says "see, I notice more about our relationship and our children than you do, so I'm going to show you that I am paying attention even if you aren't." And a book with anecdotes in it about the receiver and photographs of them when they were young? That's "I know more about you than you do, so I am going to attempt to control your perception of the past as well".

I'm sure it was meant well, but if I received such a gift from my partner I'd be both puzzled and vaguely upset. It's what you give relatives who live a long way away (in the case of photographs of your children) and well, I don't know, long-standing colleagues who are retiring in the case of anecdotes and "when you were younger" photographs. I would certainly not pore over it pointing at things and saying "how cute", and would lose it down the back of the bookcase as soon as I decently could. Sorry.

Okay, I've tried, but I absolutely cannot fathom how that can be perceived as a passive aggressive gift?! Our relationship has it's flaws but I think the control you are referring to about "I know more about you than you do, so I am going to attempt to control your perception of the past as well" is taking things to an all time low, even for me! Sorry, but I can't agree with you there.

DH and I have spent many an evening with a glass of wine looking through the pictures on our phones of our children, laughing and reminiscing. He has photos on his phone that he has taken of photographs of himself when he was younger as he likes to tell me about them and those periods in his life and comparing which of our children looks like him, or more like me. He has often said that the only problem with photos on phones is that there are so many and never in an album/hard copy to look at like they used to. His best friend gave me some of the photos in the book and they are some of his favourite photos. I've seen them many times and he loves to talk about the situations surrounding the time in the photos. So I did the book for him so he would have a hardcopy of his fave photos and people in one place.

I will come back to respond to a couple of other posters a bit later.

About messy spouses- could it not also be possible to accept that if two people have different standards of tidiness, they need to come to a compromise rather than assuming that the tidiest partner/female partner gets to decide what acceptable levels are? I am quite an untidy person myself and find it relaxing not to have everything put away straightaway; fortunately dh is similar so we jog along happily. But if dh did have different standards I would not relish being told that I am simply wrong and that I am forcing him to do something I don't actually want done in the first place.

I would say that anyone who think that a photo album is a PA gift has issues of their own tbh

It would be if it was an album all about you (ESP in Father's Day). But it isn't. It's all about him.

Yes, he unwrapped the gift and opened the first page then closed it again and said he'd look at it later.

I definitely need to change tack on how I speak to him about leaving stuff around as what I say now isn't working. cory absolutely people have different standards in terms of tidyness/cleanliness however there is a difference I feel between tidyness and downright laziness. Examples of this are: changing our eldest into her jammies in the living room and when he takes her clothes off dumping them in the middle of the living room floor and leaving them there ALL night and stepping over them the next day; bathing our eldest and leaving the place in a mess - her clothes where he left them in the bathroom, the towel on the floor, some toys in the sink and the bath mat still on the floor; changing the baby's nappy and leaving the nappy open on the table once he's finished; feeding the cat and leaving the wrapper on the worktop - I bought a bin SPECIFICALLY for this reason that sits right next the food bowl. Has he used it? No. I use it and I empty it, he STILL leaves the wrappers on the worktop until they build up and fall on the floor. Or I tidy them away. There are more but I think that's enough

I'm not the tidiest person by a long shot and by MN standards a slattern when it comes to cleaning however there are 4 of us now in the house and the place becomes untidy very quickly. I'm fed up picking up the same things day in day out after he's left them behind. It's like having 3 kids to pick up after.

sadie you are right in certain respects. He has no hang ups showing love in any way, shape or form. He is very loving through actions and speech. He is very affectionate and likes to do things for me that shows he cares. He is always telling me he loves me, how happy he is with our family, how much he loves the children and is very demonstrative in that respect. But the other 3 emotions you describe he does find very difficult to show them or tell me how he feeling when he's upset etc. He is a fixer and is the one people go to to solve their problems. I think when he has a problem therefore he finds it difficult to deal with as he's always expected to be strong. I think he feels it makes him weak to show he's struggling emotionally.

Why are you worried about his reaction and upsetting him?
Are you worried about his reaction?
Or are you avoiding any situation where you might upset someone, somehow feeling that if someone is upset, it HAS to be your fault?

Your fear of communicating negative things leads you to extremes. The cat food wrapper is a thing that happens sometimes in our house but our reactions are different.

Yours is either put it in the bin yourself, or wait until there's a big pile of them that fall on the floor (and then pick them up yourself in a huff?).

In our house, I'd wait until he was standing nearer the packet than me, nod my head vaguely towards it and say "wrapper". One word. A noun. No instruction. No complaint. No request.

DH notices "wrapper", looks at it blankly for a second, twigs, puts it in the bin. Conversation continues as we were, with no one feeling bad or defensive. On the rare occasion he says "what?" I say "I noticed you left Thing out." Still no judgement or complaint or instruction. I am not his mum.

It is so much easier to use one noun and let the person think for themselves. It is also better for the offender because it is non-confrontational and they get to be more "adult" about it, which people generally like.

All of your scenarios would have gone single noun for me. "pyjamas" "dirty nappy"

If I were you I would say to DH quite simply, "Was the photo album not what you were hoping for for your birthday?" See what he says.

Whilst we were pottering about after dinner I said nonchalantly "So was the book not a hit then". He replied with "It's not that, I've just not stopped the past few days." I then tried to start saying "Well -" and was going to go in with how I was feeling about it but then he said "I feel like I've just been in and out in between working and all I've been thinking about is my days off".

So I've left it just now but will go back it.

I'd drop the present thing now if I were you. He has said it was a nice enough present. He is looking forward to a day off with you. Next time buy him some socks and a box of chocolates.