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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Time to start my own thread, I think...

15 replies

Anniegetyourgun · 10/01/2007 14:57

I was introduced to Mumsnet fairly recently by a friend who felt it would help me with my own issues. It's been fascinating. I saw one thread I absolutely HAD to contribute to, so I registered and, oh no, can't stop dipping in to topics now! So many of the problems resonate with me, so much good advice is offered from all sides, there's so much caring on here, it's lovely. So now: my own attempt to start a discussion thread.
Although I'm a great one for venting about my own problems, I'm not in the mood to write a catalogue at this point (probably will later though!) However you'll need some bare details to start with.
I realised about a year ago that my marriage was effectively over and that to my own surprise I was glad about it, but for one reason or another have only just taken the first few steps towards making it happen. It's been suggested that my STBXH has a mild personality disorder, but he could just be a pig-headed unreconstructed male who hasn't quite got with the second half of the 20th century, let alone the 21st. I only know that I cannot and should not live with it any more. No question in my mind that his behaviour is unreasonable and will not change; I've been cobbling up our relationship for 23 years and everyone wonders why it took me so long to break out. We have four children, only one still of school age though.
Reading through people's problems here, I see so many who have "real" problems - DV, drink, drugs, affairs, serious sh*t to deal with or escape from, so much more extreme than what I was once happy to put up with. It makes me feel as if my complaints are a bit trivial really. Given that I always believed in marriage for life if you can possibly hack it, especially if there are children, I still sometimes wonder if I am being selfish and wrong-headed about this, until STBXH obligingly does something that reminds me exactly why it's over. All his good points are negative ones - awful things he doesn't do, ways in which he could be so much worse. I managed to be grateful for that for many years, but it really isn't enough. I want, need out before I'm carried out screaming.
I'm not looking for reassurance here (as I've done all the agonising and know what I have to do in my own situation), I'm looking for a debate. Rights and wrongs in general, please, of ending a marriage, when it is possible in theory to keep going and maybe improve some aspects. Should one never settle for less than the best, how many maddening things should you be prepared to put up with/should your partner be prepared to put up with, is marriage for life just a pipe dream etc. I'm looking for good strong polarised opinions, all sides explored, some wishy washy counsellor-speak in between and loads of hair-raising anecdotes!

OP posts:
DetentionGrrrl · 10/01/2007 15:31

If you've tried and failed to be really happy for all those years, what future do you see? You could suggest Relate perhaps, but if he's not interested, i'd ask myself one question:

Do i want to wake up next to this man for the rest of my life?

(and i wouldn't worry that what you're going through 'seems trivial', everyone's problems are as big as they feel to them, whatever they may be)

Anniegetyourgun · 10/01/2007 18:49

Well no, I don't wake up next to him as it is, I told him to sleep somewhere else eight months ago and he's done so ever since. I'm so far beyond wanting to wake up next to him ever again, I'm vaguely appalled at the thought that I ever did. We're sharing a house on a reasonably amicable basis as long as we don't have too much to do with each other.

OP posts:
lissielou · 10/01/2007 18:53

it really sounds like you have made your mind up. if you dont even like him any more, how can you possibly stay with someone like that. you both deserve better and so do your kids

ginnedupmummy · 10/01/2007 19:03

Message withdrawn

DetentionGrrrl · 10/01/2007 19:26

sleeping apart for 8mths? i'd say it's over to be honest.

Pages · 10/01/2007 20:22

I too heard that, Ginnedupmummy, something about a "just reasonable level of contentment" so if you are reasonably happy over 50% of the time it may be worth sticking at. Your relationship Annie sounds as if it is dead in the water though. If you don't love him anymore then what's the point? Especially as your children are older now.

Since coming on mumsnet I have realised how unreasonable it it to expect perfection from ANY relationship and how similar so many of our relationship problems are which points to the fact that it is by virtue of us being women (for the most part) and them being men that a lot of diffuculties arise. Obviously there are exceptions to that, such as the serious problems you mentioned.

I really think that it is a personal decision unique to each marriage as to when it is right to end it. I don't think there are any rights or wrongs about it. You have obviously thought long and hard about it Annie, and it isn't just a flash in the pan.

hiddentreasure · 10/01/2007 21:21

Personally, I completely disagree about the weighing up thing (well you did ask for a debate) - it just doesn't work at anything other than a 'gut feel' overall level (ie 'is it more good than bad'). How do you balance 'nothing in common' against 'cup of tea in bed every morning' - a points system? is 'bores me witless in bed and out of it' more or less important than 'tolerates my ghastly family'? Just doesn't do it for me.

The big issue is the impact it has on everyone else - is it a selfish act to end a marriage when nobody else (husband/kids) wants it to end? Should you subsume your life for everyone elses? Or how LONG should you do that before you have 'earned' your freedom? How long will it take them to get over it? Tough.

Anniegetyourgun · 11/01/2007 09:29

I don't suppose Pages meant one should make a list of good and bad things and match them up - more about a general feeling that you are happy more or less of the time. The idea of putting in time to earn freedom is certainly something I've wondered about (you'd get less than 20 years for murder, as they say), and of course STBXH keeps playing the "the kids don't want this" card unmercifully.

OP posts:
dmo · 11/01/2007 09:38

sorry being dumb whats STBXH?

i think that you sound very unhappy and that by living sep lives as you do now you are in a way separated
i think the next poss step would be for one of you to move out so that you can both move on
how many children have you got living at home? i know you said you have one school aged child out of the four

DetentionGrrrl · 11/01/2007 10:09

soon to be ex husband

Budababe · 11/01/2007 10:10

STBXH - Soon To Be X Husband!

Interesting thread Annie!

I am weighing up the same stuff. Am married to DH for 11 years, been together 18 in total - one DS aged 5 conceived thru IVF. Live overseas.

Sleep in seperate rooms as DS sleeps with me and TBH I am happy with that. No sex - not since out honeymoon. Have tried counselling. He is just not interested - wouldn't bother him if he never has sex again.

I would like another child - tried IVF in Oct but it didn't work - will prob try again next month.

No affection unless I instigate it.

But - we get on pretty well most of the time. Have a good lifestlye, lots of friends. He cooks, shops etc. Is pretty easygoing and doesn't moan about my shopping habit too much! Is a great Dad and DS adores him.

Do I want to wake up next to him for the rest of my life? No.

Bu - if I leave I wouldn't stay in this country - I would go home to Dublin where I have family and friends. So would be taking DS away from his school and friends as well as his Dad. So feel as if I am stuck between a rock and a hard place to be honest.

With your situation - I would do it. Your children are all old enough to deal with it. Presumably you would be in same area if one of you moved out? Fast forward till your youngest child moves out and it is just you and your DH. Will you be lonelier living with him or lonelier on your own?

morningpaper · 11/01/2007 10:14

I think contentment and companionship are massively under-rated

I think there are good years and bad years

DetentionGrrrl · 11/01/2007 10:16

I can't think of anything more depressing than living without affection, and not even wanting to wake up next to them. How sad.

Anniegetyourgun · 11/01/2007 14:47

dmo, two of the DSs live with us, one is at university and one is thinking about moving back in post-university. Being the only female in a chaotic household of six I never had any privacy for years. Only since I've claimed my bedroom as my own space, thrown out all items of entertainment and only allowed people in by invitation (eg if DS4 wants somewhere quiet to draw, or of course a cuddle), have I been able to relax and get a good night's sleep, and do things like dressing in peace. It's such a treat.

I would like to move out but take a fair share of the marital assets with me, and have DS4 turn about so he sees plenty of both of us. He doesn't want anything to change but if I will insist on leaving, there's the door, take the debts with you (as he's no idea how we ended up owing so much, hints of dark deeds), let us know when you're popping in to visit and btw you do realise you'll be expected to contribute 15% of your income to childcare. Yes, yes, I know - I've got some good legal advice. Not standing for that nonsense.

OP posts:
Pages · 11/01/2007 19:14

Annie, you are right, that is what I meant.

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