cheating

[Halftruth]

Ok so had a little arguement about mumsnet today in rl ... Cheating when is it ok to cheat ? I ve notice post and i am one of the people that would lite a fire under anyones arse for cheating ... But my oh said i could say to someone about cheating because they have the same mental health conditions as me ... Well i don't think because my partner having mental health issues is a good wnough reason to cheat if you don't want to be with someone don't be with them . what right does anyone have to justifie cheating ...i don't no ,what does anyone else think ? And feel free to abuse me if you don't agree i've got thick skin

It's never ok, end of story. If you love someone, even if circumstances are difficult, you don't do something with the capacity to cause that level of pain. I don't buy into the idea that it's ok if you're sure you won't get caught either, betrayal is betrayal whether the person knows they've been betrayed or not, I couldn't live with myself for cheating nor could I forgive someone capable of doing that to me. Problems in a relationship don't justify it, problems get solved by talking, not cheating. And if a person isn't 'satisfied' by being with just one partner they should steer clear of committed relationships so everyone knows where they stand.

In answer to the question when is cheating ok? It isn't. Neither is it justified.

But sometimes there are things which lead to people having affairs.

And the truth is that society isn't supportive of people leaving relationships for reasons other than cheating.

In my case meeting someone else gave me the strength to leave an emotionally abusive marriage. Do I regret the affair? Absolutely. Would I advise anyone else against doing the same? Yes of course. But when I left and talked about the things that were wrong in my marriage (and things were pretty bad fwiw) the response from people was "but at least he didn't hit you." And I even had some tell me that the only reasons to ever leave a marriage should be an affair or physical violence.

Society is not yet on board with the idea that it's ok to leave an unhappy relationship. Perhaps if it was less people would get to breaking point and do something which everyone regrets. Obviously not all affairs happen that way, and of course some cheats are just bastards. but not all affairs are black and white either.

In my case I didn't leave for the OM. But meeting the OM made me realise that it was possible to have people in one's life who actually think something of me as a person.

In the case of the person who was married and whose partner had a debilitating illness, again, society would never sanction someone leaving that kind of relationship, in fact they would be considered the lowest of the low for leaving someone with an illness which meant their own emotional and physical needs would take a back seat for possibly decades. I can absolutely see how someone would gain emotional and even physical comfort elsewhere in those circumstances.

Cheat is a "catch all" term, so people cheat for hundreds of reasons.

i have two good friends (both company directors in their early 50's) who both have "happy, successful marriages" and yet they both have young "lady friends". There is no chance of these arrangements leading to anything permanent. I guess they are just stress relief (because they both have quite stressful jobs) BTW I don't condone their actions.

This is post is in no way away to abuse people for ther oppions . iam happy you 've posted. And gut instincts it does seem that way sometimes your right some people would think badly of the other poster story if she'd just left but i for one would of understood why . there could have still be a conversation there about needs and maybe they could of come to some sort of arrangement yet again there are ways around the actually cheating but it would mean people having teally awkward conversations....and emotional abuse is a good enough reason to have another conversation about why? and if thing's don't change i'm off ... And thanxs mr m ... I'm sure another conversation here. Would help they could alway's see a councillor to deal with the stress and if they are earning a sex threapist too so they could liven things up . or maybe they like having mrs homemaker at home and keeping her there is cheaper than a divorce? If someone doesn't respect you enough to at least talk to there partner about how there feeling how does the other partner know where they stand . how can they have an opportunity to fight for you before its to late if there oblivious to what's going on .... Great post by the way thanxs

I don't think it's ever ok to cheat, but sometimes it's understandable iyswim. So for example, my dps colleague says relationship with wife is dead, she won't have sex he won't leave because he loves seeing his kids everyday. Obviously he should do right by her and leave but I can understand his reasons, although I don't think it's ok or justified.

Can i just say, i never justified cheating because of MH issues, what i did say to my DP was, dont go on that post and start flaming the OP because she clearly has issues and feels bad enough about what shes done/doing without people on the internet judging her.

Im a sensitive soul and i always think about how the persons feeling or what they've been through that might have lead to their actions before i start judging.

Ive never cheated on anybody and i never would.

I think in the case where a partner has a debilitating illness and the other partner finds comfort with someone else it's really no-one's place to judge.

When someone falls seriously ill all the focus is on that person, and those closest to that person are almost forgotten, their needs secondary because to suggest that they have emotional, and yes, physical needs as well is an almost unspoken taboo. And for the person with the illness the idea that their partner could discuss their own needs could possibly be the ultimate rejection.

I read a book recently by a man who had had a stroke and was left with locked-in syndrome.It was partly written by him but also by his family and his wife. And I remember reading a passage about how she had dedicated herself tirelessly to his care, and how selfless she was to never consider her own needs or even feel she should be allowed a space to cry. It was written in such a way as to suggest that this should be the expected norm. She was 25 when he had the stroke, she has given up her life, her ability to have children, essentially her right to a normal relationship ever again. If that is her choice then I hope she is very happy in her life and can find the fulfilment she needs in other areas. But if despite the fact that she loves her husband and will devote the rest of her life to caring for him she found herself finding physical and/or emotional comfort from someone else at some point along that road, and nobody was ever any the wiser and everybody was still happy, I could never find it in myself to judge her.

If I contracted a serious and debilitating illness now I wouldn't want my partner to stay with me and sign up to a life of tirelessly caring for me with no right to any kind of emotional or physical relationship ever again. I would rather let him go to pursue that for himself. But if he left society would condemn him for leaving someone because of their illness.

GutInstinct, you have it pretty spot-on. It was my DSis to whom I was referring in my earlier post and I could see how she worked full-time, coped with the DC, the house plus an invalid. She was on ADs and I think on the verge of a total breakdown for years - in fact she once said to me that it would be such a luxury to think that she could have a breakdown but that it simply wasn't possible.

As for the "conversation" that she was supposed to have with her DH (an earlier poster's comment), if talking is no longer possible and neither is movement, that's a bit tricky. She still didn't want to leave him though.

I'm at college even thou im 34 the tutor will take my phone ....there are some really great post i ll read them when im home keep posting plz its so interesting

The only thing about those tails is that now i think i would rather be on my own then think that my partner will seek attention else where but still sit by myside like nothing has happened i think i really do think there is still no excuses to justifie cheating and in theese cases it was for shear self gratification not for love . remember the jane and ian bill story line ? About her husband . i have sympath for the situation that people have found themselves in but not for the act of cheating ... They really are some great justification but still not concinced

It's incredibly simplistic to think of it as self gratification though when you're e.g. Talking about a person who loses their partner to serious illness in their mid twenties, they still love their partner, but they as individuals have needs, both emotional and physical which that partner cannot fulfill.

It's not justification, no-one has said that. But imagine you knew you would never even so much as have a hug or a word of support from your partner for the next ten, twenty, forty years. Do you really think that ending up in a situation where you found emotional comfort in someone else as just seeking self gratification? Really? If the partner were off using prostitutes I would take a bit of a dim view, but often these types of situations evolve due to finding an emotional support which then leads to more.

Would you really think less of someone who stayed with their partner but did have an emotional connection somewhere else which the partner was unaware of on the basis that they couldn't possibly be hurt by it if they didn't know, than someone who, because of their need for physical and emotional affection decided to leave their very sick, permanently disabled possibly to the point of being unable to talk or interact in any way partner in order to pursue their own needs?

It could be argued that the person with the serious illness was incredibly selfish to either expect their partner to never find comfort anywhere else or to stay in the relationship, but of course one of the biggest fears faced by someone who suddenly becomes so seriously ill would be the fear of rejection and abandonment. Hence the feelings of wanting their partner to stay with them being entirely understandable.

I cheated on my ex when I was manic (I have bi polar) but I never used it as an excuse. As soon as I was better I ended the relationship because I needed to work on myself. Cheating really does repulse me as I've had it done to me.
I wasn't in the right frame of mind when I did it, but I was the one who had chosen to stop taking my medication.

I think that if your not happy with someone and or the situation then you should leave ,and if someone had this condiontion where they were this unresponsive and wouldn't no about the affair ,how would they know you left either ? Cheating isn't justifieable it just isn't . great post very well thought out . i'm starting to see a social pressure about leaving a partner that is seriously ill . but that's a whole differnt thread i think. But what an extremely difficult position to be in the .

Because a serious disability/illness doesn't necessarily mean the person loses mental capacity. E.g. The person with locked-in syndrome I spoke about earlier. is not mentally incapacitated, but he literally has no movement and reliant on 24 hour care. So of course he would know if his wife left him. However, she goes out to work, she does volunteer work for the church, etc, and it would be entirely possible while out in one of those contexts that she could become close to someone else, and no, he would never know because he is unable to go out independently. They still have as much of a full life together as is possible. They go on holidays, they go to church together etc, but all the while these things have to happen with carers in the mix, because of his disabilities he cannot share a bed with his wife, I imagine she still loves him, and I don't imagine she has had an affair. But I also imagine that it is likely that she would at least find emotional comfort in others who are supportive of her. It's almost inevitable for her personal wellbeing IMO. The physical might be a different thing, but I would imagine the emotional side possibly happens to anyone in that situation.

I don't think it's justifiable.
But I think sometimes it's understandable.
I was 99.9% certain my XH was regularly using prostitutes - no actual proof just all the "I was only looking" shite they come out with for escort searches.
We stopped having sex - why would I want to? Tried to talk, tried to get him to counselling. He went once, said nothing but "I only looked" and then was "ill" the morning of the next session.

The only reason I didn't leave, was that I had a small baby. Not a financial issue, though the practicalities would have meant finding a new job. The reason I stayed so long was I didn't want to take away a family life from my child, and I didn't want to be handing her over for days at a time. I lost hours going over it in mind, crying... and living a separate sexless life.

Then an ex got in touch.

He's one reason (only a small one) that I left. He lived overseas but was coming back in a few months and I knew I would have sex with him. I had gone 5 flipping years without! And had a husband who was constantly cheating with prostitutes (I later had the evidence, he'd done it the whole time we were together)

Now I didn't have sex outside my marriage, because I didn't want that to be me. I due have text sex though... which I also consider cheating.

Should I have? No.
Was it cheating? Yes.
Do I feel remotely guilty? No.
Would anyone on here condemn me? Not many.

So I think my case is understandable, but still not justifiable.