Exdh won't support dc's degree at American University :(

[exwifeofatwat]

Venting. My twatish exdh earns a solid 150k a year, he has no gf/dp & no mortgage. He has always told our dc since scratch, that when the time comes, he will fully fund the cost of their university. Now it's about time for the ball to be set in motion and our oldest dc has decided they really want to go to America to do their degree (not saying what/where as it's very outing). Exdh now outright refuses to fund anything at all as he insists the only option is that they live with him & attend a Uni near him. Dc is gutted. I'm gutted. I'm not in a position to fund anything at all as I'm on the bones of my arse as it is. I'm pissed off.

[Duckdeamon]

OP has gone......

[BoboChic]

I don't think a US undergraduate degree should be undertaken lightly. I live in France and know several families where DC went to the US for their first degree and were miserable/failed to get a US job at the end/came back to Europe and had no networks or entry point to employers.

[DeoGratias]

Just on this point:
"MuttonCadet Wed 02-Mar-16 21:31:27

Are you claiming CM, because at £150k with two kids you could be claiming £37,500 per year. (Apologies if I'm out of date, but it used to be 25% of income)."

I really wish people in the UK understood how much this Government akes from those of us who work very very hard and earn al ot. Tax is a nightmare these days. It's ridiculous and excessive. No, amazingly and sorry to break it to people, if you earn £150,000 you don't keep all of that tax free. Instead you receive only £90k of it after tax and the state uses the £60k to fund benefits claimants, non workers and to fund foreign wars and the like

So 25% of the net is £22,500. As I said above the consent order for the clean break should have dealt with child and university education costs. If it doesn't there may be a right to make an application now but I think the US degree will be less good than a good UK university so this father may be doing his child an advantage. I hvae always told mine I will fund decent degrees (I've funded 3 of them so far without student debt in the UK) but not needlework at an ex poly or whatever (and I know their father would support me on that even though he doesn't pay a penny, if we had some dispute about whether I was complying with the consent order to pay university costs which was set up when fees were £1k in the uK =- they are now £9k a year).

[BaronessEllaSaturday]

Nearly right Deo but the other error that poster made was the percentage, for 2 children it was 20% of net so only £18,000.

If it works out at $60,000 for everything for the year then it simply isn't doable because it would be approximately half the fathers take home pay and there is another child to potentially pay the same for

[MeMySonAndl]

... And that is before the high earner nrp decides to pay a good chunk of his/her salary into a pension fund, therefore making their net salary even less when it comes to CM calculations.

I reckon that my ex pays about 3% of his net salary as child maintenance. He still complains about me being money grabbing even when he asked me to hand half of my tax credits to him because it was unfair he wasn't getting any (he was earning at that point about £60,000 a year, so not exactly a poor sod surviving on JSA).

[MeMySonAndl]

Illiria, I think you have a point there... I always wondered why on Earth I was required to spend a year studying American history or the Politics of the state I was studying in... Totally useless info, especially when you are an international or out of state student, that IMO should have been covered in primary school.

[Isetan]

I can understand why you're pissed off at the broken promise but if I was on your Ex H salary and had more than child, I would say no to funding an American university too and I am neither mean or abusive, so what does that tell you about you and your child's expectations.

There are two seperate issues here, firstly your Ex is unreliable and abusive and you and your children's expectations (despite what he promises), needs to be adjusted given than knowledge. Secondly, you do realise that US students will graduate with eye watering levels of debt and given the opportunity, they would kill for the educational and fundinding opportunities your child has in this country. Your child is being extremely unrealistic if their choice of prohibitively expensive university, is wholly dependent on their unreliable and abusive father financing it. You are doing them no favours by focussing on your Ex's broken promise, as you can probably attest, being dependant on an abusive person is asking for a whole lot of uncertainty and stress.

It's time to be realistic.

[Stillunexpected]

There is a huge gulf between what you think your ex should be funding and what he is prepared to do. It sounds like this agreement to fund university was made years ago, well before the introduction of the £9k per year fees. Your ex is probably now realising what a financial commitment he has agreed to. There is undoubtedly a large element of control in demanding that your DC live with him and attend a nearby university but pragmatically it is also probably a way for him to cut the costs of financing university. You haven't said where your ex lives? If there is only one uni of any description nearby that is a completely different proposition to him living in London for instance.

Do you think your ex ever thought that your DC would study in the US? It's still quite an unusual choice so I doubt he ever factored in the huge additional costs. Did you think it was likely your DC would want to study in the US? Is it absolutely necessary? Also not sure why it would be outing for you to say what your DC wants to study as most US students seem to be studying Liberal Arts before carrying on with study in their chosen area? Has your DC examined in depth what this all means or has there been an element of thinking - oh well, Dad is going to pay so I don't have to bother thinking about the cost, sources of funding, getting a job to help pay etc?

[theclick]

A US degree and university is really really expensive. It's in no way similar to a UK uni. If not done already, You need to look at how much her degree will really cost - the sums are astronomical there.

[expatinscotland]

Gees, no one has 'every right' to study where they please worldwide .

My children are UK/US dual nationals by birth and there is NO way we could afford to send them to university in the US, anywhere.

It costs a fucking bomb, even at community college if they didn't have a place to live, insurance, a car, job, etc. and mine had the right to walk right in and get a job, any job, once they are of working age in whatever state takes their fancy. Has to be paid upfront, too.

Not sure about scholarships for non-US nationals.

But your child needs a reality check. Life is unfair and has its share of disappointments, but it's pretty good in the UK.

No court is going to force a person to pay for a foreign uni.

Have your DC considered going for a bac and seeking entrance to a European university?

[Lweji]

Quite frankly, I'd have to question your concept of abusive considering your sense of entitlement regarding this issue, OP.
Is he really abusive or just enforces boundaries on the DC?

[expatinscotland]

I encourage mine to learn a foreign language, even though they are in primary school just now, and DD2 already has reasonably good Spanish and is learning German, too. DS is focusing on German. European unis can be a real bargain (well, depending on how Brexit goes).

As to being gutted that a parent is unwilling or unable to stump up what will well be a substantial amount of money for American uni education/year, the mind boggles.

[bibliomania]

Has your dc done a full costing for this proposed US study, taking into account fees and living expenses?

Has he or she been accepted for a particular course?

Is there a reason why it can only be done in the US?

Has your dc investigated the likelihood of being permitted to work in the US afterwards? (My perfectly well qualified brother has just spent a couple of years in the US as a trailing spouse, not allowed to work, because the paperwork was messed up by his wife's employer).

On the face of it, your ex sounds entirely reasonable in saying that he won't fund study in the US. I could also understand him saying that he can't fully fund study in the UK now - as a pp says, the nature of the commitment he originally made was quite different to the financial commitment now involved. That said, he's unreasonable to impose the condition of living with him, and it seems morally right for him to contribute something, even if he can't/won't fully fund.

[Abed]

Why should he pay for the DC to attend an American university? They are eye wateringly expensive and even on £90k take home he'd struggle .

[SquirmOfEels]

I went to an information evening about going to university in the US, and although complex (because of unfamiliar requirements) and expensive, there are plenty of scholarships available. He could try minor sports, level of achievement required is not that high, and amounts can be surprisingly generous, from the (allegedly) typical examples we were given.

OP: how far along the entrance process is your DS? Has he applied for a scholarship?

[davidcameroon]

It's a shame that details weren't clarified.

The ExH might have meant Tuition Fees or tuition fees plus maintenance loan amounts.

He may not have realised how expensive UK further education is getting these days too. I left uni when tuition fees of £3k pa were introduced and have a y10 son so am studying up on how higher education is financed by parents these days. He'll need to get loans but I am going to have to save so that he can live too.

[IrianofWay]

Has your DC worked out how much it will actually cost? Start there and present the findings to your ex without the frothing and outraged sense of entitlement. You may be forced to accept that it is financially out of reach. He may be persuaded to accept that he can't dictate where in the UK the DC study.

[Stillunexpected]

Coming back to add to may earlier post just to say that DH and I together earn more than your ex-DH, are pretty much on the same page when it comes to university education and have a Year 13 DS who will be going to uni in the near future. There is NO WAY that we would countenance paying for him to attend a US university for all kinds of reasons - the huge cost, distances involved, range of courses already available in the UK in this chosen field, other DC following behind for whom we could not then offer similar opportunities etc.

Your ex may be behaving very unfairly now but I doubt he anticipated the level of UK costs involved when he made the offer, never mind the uplift for a US university.

[DeoGratias]

I have the same moral issue. I agreed to fund the children so they graduate debt free as my parents did in my day (when by the way if your parents didn't make your income up to the full grant you were left high and dry 0 no student loans in my day for the 15% of us who went to university many of us not qualifying for a full grant). I have decided to fund the younger two the same way sa the older 3 even though the fees of the first two were only £1k (plus about £9k maintenance and rent) and the younger 2 will cost more like £20,000 a each.

I am sure I could get the clean break consent order varied as funding university when it was drawn up was a £1k fee (plus university rent etc) and now it is £9k plus those other elements but I won't as long as they pick courses of which I approve.

[Abed]

Why must you approve of their courses?

[DeoGratias]

Most parent who earn what I do (quite a lot) do not fund their children at university. They have them take out the loans. So my decisino to fund the children is a massive benefit to them and saves them in effect a 9% tax on what will probably be very high earnings over a long period - lucky them.

The youngest two will be choosing their university courses this summer and applying in the Autumn. I will not dictate the course but I will provide guidance and if it's silly - tapestry at London Met say - then they can go off and get the loans and fund themselves. (Obviously if they were already the UK's champion at tapestry and put their all into it and were the next Grayson Perry then I might consider it. However there will be no issue. They will pick sensible courses at well respected universities that employers like and which they may realistically get into. I don't foresee any big fight over it.

Also I know their father if I chose not to pay the fees never mind the rent and never mind their allowance/food, would support me if I refused to fund a silly course.

[davidcameroon]

Abed- because not all courses are of a good quality and if you're investing £35k in a course you might as well buy the best quality you can?

[Abed]

Fair enough.

[coffeeinaredmug]

It costs a lot to fund a degree at a US university. And the young person would need to sit SATs to even be eligible to apply. My DD looked into it and my DH ( who earns about £170K) said it was totally unaffordable. She went to Glasgow instead and loved it!

[expatinscotland]

And since the OP is saying she won't say which uni as it will be outing, my guess is it's not University of Insert State (which would still be expensive as an international student) but some private university which is even more expensive. Some private unis are also in Eastern cities/towns which have very high living costs.

I thought about attending a private uni. And this was long ago, in the late 80s. Did a summer course there, stayed in the dorm and thought, 'This is a fucking rip off for undergrad' and went to a state university (in my home state, or else you can be subject to out-of-state fees/tuition if you don't meet residency requirements).

In many universities, too, it's quite common for students to work whilst studying and there's, at least in the first two years, a bit more flexibility with regard to hours of study so you can work (there are also a number of graduate/masters programmes aimed at adults who work FT that allow for flexible learning).