I need a safe place to talk about having no friends

[Annabelle001]

I'm lonely. I've just got home from mother and toddler group. And I could cry. I feel so inadequate. Everyone else chats and socialises with ease (it seems) and I feel so awkward the whole time! Yes I make small talk while I'm there and there is a girl who I would love to be friends with. She's really nice and we seem quite similar, except for the fact that she is more outgoing.

I'm an introvert and enjoy my own company but it would be nice to have a friend. Someone I can...I don't even know what I want. It's got so bad I'm not even sure I know how to be a friend, what being a friend even means. Sometimes I see "girlfriends" on tv and think I just can't imagine ever being like that with someone. I feel like I'm missing out on a huge chunk of life. After all, isn't life all about relationships? Why can't I connect with someone? I am starting to think there might be someone thing wrong with me. I don't want to come across like I have a chip on my shoulder because I don't, but often I feel like I give the impression of being a bit weird. Someone you can make small talk with but not someone you'd want to get to know. I'm not though. I'd love a friend and I'd love to be a friend to someone else.

I don't know what I expect to gain from posting on here. I suppose I'm hoping I'm not the only one who feels like this. And I would like some advice on how to make a friend. Like literal, step by step advice. It seems I really need it.

I should add that my youngest child is 3 so I feel like I'm on my last chance to make a friend over the next couple of months of mother and toddler groups. After that she will be at nursery and I have no idea what I'll do then. I'll be so alone.

I'm really emotional reading all your replies. Thank you so much for building my confidence and encouraging me. I appreciate it more than you know.

To the others who have posted mentioning they do or have felt similarly to me, I hope this thread can encourage you too. I know I will certainly come back to it again and again when I'm having a bad day.

I couldn't make it to a toddler group this morning and won't now until next week but I'll be reading your advice again before I go and hoping to step out in more confidence, reassured that I am not weird, I am not alone in how I am feeling and hopefully that maybe I'll swap numbers with someone...eek.

I know I have a problem with comparing myself to others and my lives to theirs. I understand deep down that no ones life is ever quite as perfect as it seems, but it's still hard not allow myself to be impacted by what I see of them. I need to remember that I have something to offer. This is all very easy sitting here on my sofa. Once I go over the door it's usually a totally different story. Anyway, I suppose all I can do is try.

I feel exactly like you.
I have 3 friends in the world that's it.
1 of my friends invited me to a girls night last Saturday with 2 other girls and I was so nervous.
I went and actually enjoyed myself.
I pushed myself to talk and be myself and felt so much better
Basically what I'm saying is just try and be more outgoing if you can.

It's hard to make friends.

And it takes a lot of effort. You have to be friendly, ask questions, make the effort to arrange a play date. But if it's someone you actually like, making conversation should be easy.

The woman that you feel you could be friends with is probably feeling like you, a bit hesitant to take the next step. Just say to her 'Oh, do you ever go to XYZ, we should go, take the kids/ or have a coffee sans enfants if you fancy' .

Then say you'll find her on fbook /give her your cell /email whatever.

Good luck OP!

And honestly OP, out of a group of ten mums at toddler group you are lucky if you make one good friend, it's just the luck of the draw.

Unhappyexpat where abouts are you?

I'm an expat too, in Canada, and it's so hard to make new friends.

In a strange way at playgroups you can take the pressure off yourself by focussing on the children. So with this one girl you like and fancy being friends with, why don't you just casually suggest a play date at your place or the local park sometime soon because your children seem to be getting on well (even if they aren't particularly!).

I know that when people have occasionally asked me to do things like that I've always been delighted to have been asked. I'm sure this girl will feel the same way.

I don't have best friends really. But i have a lot of acquaintances. I think having a list of things might be a problem - if you are so focused on getting into / through your list you are not letting the conversation develop organically. DP does this, keeps banging on until people join in with what he is trying to talk about. My mum also has things to talk about but then shoehorns them into the conversation. #

I didn't make any friends at mums and tots groups but I did when the kids went to school.

Mums and tots groups can be difficult for lots of mums so please be reassured that it's not just you. I found it so difficult when I first started going, some days were better than others and usually this coincided with how much sleep I'd had. My DD has never been a great sleeper...

I think you will probably take to some groups more than others so i would say stick to going to the one(s) you prefer. I used to dread walking in the door (and still do sometimes even though I know most of the mums now!) but honestly the more you go the more you start to become familiar with those around you and ultimately more comfortable. Don't try too hard, focus on the kids and try not to worry. Friendships are usually forged over a period of time so don't try to force it. You sound like a lovely lady and I'm sure so many people would love to be your friend. We're all in the same boat

So many threads like this OP and so many of us who feel the same. I just play with my toddler at these groups, although the one I go to is mostly good as it has different rooms with different activities so people don't gather together. But when they have a special occasion lile Halloween etc, it's held in one room and everyone seems to know each other. I don't know what I want though, why should people approach me? They are busy in their chats. I just don't have the confidence to stand with other people, but that is exactly what I need to do. If someone just joined in my chat with someone else, they'd be welcomed with open arms.

It's just something about a bunch of women all together. I'm not anti-women at all and have some great female friends. But if it was a mixed group I think it would be more balanced and less cliquey.

Wish all of us like this could get together and start our own

Maybe u guys should all say wot area ur living in and u never know, there may be someone else on here who's nearby? I'm outside the UK so that's not much cop!
I met sm expat friends here at an International Playgroup and another child free friend at a language class. We're all British. I did feel very lonely and isolated to begin with mind, and would swap no.s with sm people who didn't get bk to me. You've just gotta not take it personally. Luckily there's a lot of expats where I live so u immediately have somethin in common which helps. But I do def feel awkward at the beginning.
Oops I forgot I've also got a S. American friend and I've a playdate tomoro with a Brazilian lass who's daughter was in my daughter's class in nursery. We kept bumpin into eachother around and about so swapped no.s. I invited her daughter to my daughter's bday party.
So some contacts evolve into friendships, others don't. Def arrangin playdates and be the first to invite someone to your place and hopefully they'll rtn the favour and then ur off! also invitin kids to parties helps too and obv arranging to meet at softplays etc.
The more u sow the more u reap and I think people appreciate the gesture. I haven't clicked with everyone I've had playdates with but that's just life isn't it? Just like sm colleagues u get on better with than others. You've just gotta put the feelers out and keep makin the effort so that fledgling friendships have a chance to get off the ground.

Oh and I met another mate at the gym. So don't just concentrate solely on one avenue like babygroups. Be adventurous

Have sent you a message OP.

The one thing that helped me with this was to give up trying. When l decided l am the way l am and lm going to accept that and lm not bothered if l ever make a friend then l started making friends. I didn't bother putting myself out there any more and it was like playing hard to get as a teenager people came after me. I think desperation flags itself up and instinctively people back off. Don't bother thinking of things to talk about. Just be yourself. Then at least when you make a friend you won't be stressed trying to keep it going. Being yourself can be sustained. Maybe go to an activity at night. I often find people like you are quite intelligent and don't do well with small talk but join something that demands more from the brain and you will meet like minded people. Your dh may find the same.

Great advice junebirthdaygirl

I have a theory that baby and toddler groups are almost always disastrous for making new friends. When you have a new baby or a toddler who is sucking up all your emotional energy and attention, you have less energy to give to others, even though you are usually desperate for company and support. It's the worst time of your life to be friendship-dating. So what most people do is rely on those they already know and trust for adult company, which means those friends they already have (hence cliques) or whatever family have proved their worth. I think women who are depressed may actually find their condition worsens at these gatherings because they feel they are being judged by a roomful of strangers (and if they're really unlucky, judgemental and mediocre HCPs).

Perhaps the answer to this is taking things one step and one person at a time. If you're looking for new friends you need to be strong enough in yourself to accept that the first stages might be disappointing and unsatisfactory, maybe bracing yourself for a lot of meaningless small talk at the start. This is where hobbies can help. If you don't have any personal support at this stage, then lots of writing things down/venting/MN can make you feel better. But friendships are really weird creatures IME. They take time, you can't rush them (or you end up making big mistakes with people if you do try and rush or over-engineer things) and the people you end up being friends with are never the ones you expect, and very rarely the ones you like best to begin with.

Once I do break the ice with someone or end up somehow involved in a group conversation it's hard to keep it going. I think coming up with topics ahead of time might be key here. I did that today actually. I went thinking I'd talk about half term (ground breaking,right?). The rproblem then is what to do when I've exhausted my list. Do I then stick around with the women I've been chatting to
Can I suggest that listening might be a key here? Don't stress too much about topics- the old faithfuls like the weather, cliches about how quickly kids grow, comments about the passage of time (it'll be Easter before we know it) are all fine openers.
After that if you can take an interest in them most people are more than happy to talk about themselves.
If you can (and I know how hard it is), don't focus on what you are feeling but focus on the other person and see if you can put them at ease.

There's a story told about Gladstone and Disraeli: a woman said of Gladstone, after sitting next to him at dinner that she thought he was the cleverest man in all of England; but when sitting next to Disraeli at dinner that she thought she was the cleverest woman in all of England.

Try to be interested rather than interesting

Some great posts. Junebirthdaygirl, I was massively more confident when younger because I did not care as much about what people thought and went in expecting people to like me. I am making some progress in getting that back now the children are getting bigger.

It's interesting someone agrees with me about toddler groups. For me it was because I was not at my best. I had a couple of fairly lively, tantrum y children and I was always flustered and that parent. Whatever anyone says, people do judge and gossip because they're equally insecure. Trying to manage behaviour and the anxiety that goes with it did not make me the most scintillating company or conversationalist . I also found most groups and mums who socialised regularly had pretty easy going children because they allowed them to have a social life - they weren't constantly chasing a child round the room so could sit and chat and get to know people.

My advice would be to concentrate on getting out and mixing, meet up.com is great for this, then you can 'practice' with like-minded people in a relaxed environment. Just a little light socialising would probably make you feel better about yourself, and more likely to attract genuine friendships?

Wasn't it so much easier when we were kids, when all you had to to say was, ' wanna climb a tree? ' and you'd be best friends..... Being grown up sucks

OP, I am pretty confident (I do suffer from some social anxiety but I hide it well) and without wanting to toot my own horn I am fabulous at making small talk (put it down to bad family dynamics; it's a talent I am proud of because I know that the reasons I got good at it aren't happy ones!) and I have NEVER struggled more than I did at toddler groups.

I hated them and struggled on a few more times before mercifully DD told me she didn't like them and we never went again.

I have never felt more lonely than in a room with a lot of cliques that were impossible to break into and with a lot of random nannies/grandparents/mums who didn't seem to want to make the slightest effort even to make eye contact over the coffee urn.

They were the 7th circle of hell for me and I'm good with people in most scenarios.

So what I'm saying is don't beat yourself up about the playgroups hell and give yourself a break. It is hard. Also meeting people you 'click' with is rare. I have met some very nice mums now that DD is at pre-school but I have only really clicked with one of them. That's one out of about 15. The others are all really nice to chat to but I can't see any circumstance in which I'd actually become their 'friend' iyswim.

They probably feel the same about me!

Please don't beat yourself up, it is hard and you sound lovely, plus you have really good intentions to make friends. That's a huge plus. I bet you'll be an awesome friend when you find the couple of people (which is all it takes) to click with.

I think there's a sense (largely untrue) from things like bloody facebook that everyone else on the entire planet is a social butterfly with masses of amazing pals... if you take off that pressure and work on the basis that real friendship is rare, and finding people you really get along with is unusual, it may help?

for you, you sound really nice

OP, have you seen this thread?:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/2577650-Age-45-and-never-had-a-friend-think-I-will-be-friendless-til-I-die?

OP you have had really good advice here.

With regards to the toddler group, sometimes they just aren't the friendliest places. I am really extrovert but remember one toddler group I went to where I honestly felt like everyone was staring at me and wishing I wasn't there - hoping I would disappear. Obviously after a couple of weeks of this I found a less cliquey group where people would happily engage in casual conversation.

You do seem hard on yourself about what you are bringing to the table in terms of conversation. I lecture in politics, but I certainly wouldn't want to sit discussing it with my friends - would rather talk about TV, Clothes, holidays, cinema. Also, most people love a good listener, so don't feel it's not OK to sit there nodding along. Some people like to be the centre of things and won't mind if you are quieter company.

Maybe asking the woman you liked if she wants to do something, maybe just a coffee would be a good start. Or suggest doing something with the DC?

Firstly, sorry to all for disappearing! I was without internet for a few days, then life happened. But I finally got to read through all your replies. Thank you to each of you for your advice and encouragement.

I went to mum and toddler group again yesterday and tried a new tactic of talking to another mum who I've noticed who seems a little shy and is often on her own. She was lovely. Turns out she is feeling a little overwhelmed, as she has recently become a sahm (a few months ago) and also finds toddler groups difficult, so we had a nice chat. I didn't ask her for a coffee or anything, as I sort of lost my nerve, but hopefully we will get chatting again and maybe we can take it from there. I truly came away feeling uplifted yesterday. It was a good morning. And I know that a large part of that is due to all of you for helping me to think a little differently. Thank you.

I know my problem isn't "fixed" but yesterday was a good day. And for that I am thankful. We will see how it goes from here.

I get this. Totally.

It's funny, some of the things people have said they do to try and strike up friendships with people - I realised I often take these the wrong way - think people are being patronising. I guess I've convinced myself no one would be kind to me because they actually like me.

I have issues, and a need for some therapy obviously.

Just wanted you to know there are more of us out there, OP. You're not alone.

Actually, I was reading something about Aspergers (I think of myself as undiagnosed but meet some of the traits for the way women sometimes present) and there's a new theory that far from having trouble forming relationships because we lack empathy, adults with aspergers actually have too much empathy; we can tell too easily what others are thinking and feeling, but we're not able to process it or deal with it. It's overwhelming, so we tend to shrink away from social interaction, although we want friends desperately.

This struck a huge chord with me. My whole life has been characterised by me loving other people, but finding things overwhelming and having to either run away or a big rift forming with people. Does any of that ring true with you at all?

one thing i'd add is that when you go prepared with your list of topics, it's tempting to rattle through the list, at least i used to, mainly because i felt awkward. i've learnt to take it slowly now, and really listen to their response rather than worrying about what i'm going to say next. then conversation tends to flow more and it's easier to make jokes and relax.

and if there's a brief silence, don't worry. don't always be the one to rush in to fill it.