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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Narc personality disorder & abusive husbands

63 replies

wotevaaaa · 28/01/2016 12:03

Narcissistic personality disorder at it's worst is untreatable as the person with it is incapable of seeing/accepting their behaviour and won't take part in therapy. This was my husband. I would call this a mental health issue as it affects all areas of his work/life/relationships. In a way it's like living with a disability. Does this then mean that their abusive controlling behaviour is excusable as they're unconscious of what they're doing?

OP posts:
HandyWoman · 28/01/2016 19:27

See I find that interesting, if you've had bucket loads of therapy, why you are still wondering whether the behaviour he meted out is excusable. Am not being goody, just find that genuinely interesting.

HandyWoman · 28/01/2016 19:28

goady

not goody

Hillfarmer · 28/01/2016 19:45

Abuse is inexcusable IMHO. That's why it is a called abuse. It is a value-laden term. It is deliberate, it is cruel, it is meant. It is aimed at hurting someone and it is about breaking normal rules about how humans should treat each other. If what your XH did was excusable then it would be called something else.

I agree, it is the fact that you seem to want to excuse him is the interesting thing.

Offred · 28/01/2016 19:48

I don't think it's always deliberate. It's very often a learned maladaptive coping mechanism or an expression of learned beliefs.

It doesn't need to be deliberate to be inexcusable.

Offred · 28/01/2016 19:54

Op him having an NPD diagnosis means two things for you I think;

  1. He will always use any contact/interaction to try and abuse you.
  1. You must never ever try and excuse his behaviour, he is dangerous to be around.
Original poster
wotevaaaa · 28/01/2016 19:57

I have all sorts of new thoughts now we're apart. I guess I'm just 'processing'. We were together a very long time after all. I am still adapting to my new freedoms & having my own thoughts is still a novelty. I guess in questioning his culpability, I'm allowing myself to say 'actually what you did was very wrong', which is something I couldn't comprehend thinking when we were a couple. I now have the freedom from fear & oppression to look back and say I was coerced & controlled. To sort of acknowledge consciously I let him dictate my life & that caused me great pain.

OP posts:
Original poster
wotevaaaa · 28/01/2016 20:06

So he was 'expressing his learned beliefs' in his treatment of me. I wish someone could open his eyes. But that will never happen. So he carries on his thought-processes same as always, his whole life. & he thinks I'm the mad one, after all I must be insane to tear the family apart, to leave the man I swore to stay with 'till death do us part'. He actually said to me 'If you love me & you meant your marriage vows, you will stay loving & faithful by my side till the day you die'. I am a religious person & that comment extended my marriage by another 6 months as I battled my religious beliefs against my sanity.

OP posts:
LittleMissUpset · 28/01/2016 20:13

I can understand what you mean, I strongly suspect my husband is a narcissist, as are other members of his family, particularly his mother.

Part of me thinks it's not his fault, he is abusive but he can't help it.

He would never ever admit it, and can't see when he is wrong. I'm not perfect but will admit when I'm wrong.

We've had relationship counseling which was one of the worst things I could have done (it was his idea, but he made out I have lots of problems/denied things/said the right things to impress the counsellor).

I talked to a friend recently and she said she thinks his behaviour is controlling but she thinks he can't help it.

It's very confusing isn't it.

Imbroglio · 28/01/2016 20:34

he made out I have lots of problems/denied things/said the right things to impress the counsellor

... that was my experience, too. Horrendous experience. Was livid when I called a halt.

Original poster
wotevaaaa · 28/01/2016 20:40

Mine was livid too. He said 'this isn't happening' and I finally found my balls and said in my little voice 'oh yes it is'.....

OP posts:
Offred · 28/01/2016 20:45

He can't just unlearn his beliefs if he has NPD. They are deep seated and from childhood.

No-one can fix him, least of all someone in a relationship with him.

Original poster
wotevaaaa · 28/01/2016 20:48

Yup you're right. I am thankful that he causes he almost no trouble now & keeps his distance.

OP posts:
Hillfarmer · 28/01/2016 21:26

I do understand the urge to want to find 'the key'. It is a relief to me for Offred to write 'No-one can fix him'. That was the hardest thing for me to accept. I was so sure for ages that I could. It's a really heartbreaking thing to realise that is true. And sad that I ever thought it was true. So I do 'get it' OP, I have decided that whatever shitty things happened to my XH in his childhood, it was he who decided to bully me and control me and make my life awful... and that that was inexcusable, unacceptable and divorceable.

Offred · 28/01/2016 21:33

The trouble with NPD IMO is that it is such an effective way of living your life with so many pay offs and so few drawbacks for the person with it and it is drawn from such deep seated beliefs/experiences which are constantly being reinforced in general life that I can't see how or why a narcissist would ever change.

Imbroglio · 28/01/2016 21:45

Actually I think many are extremely miserable. Because they are always blaming everyone else for their unhappiness and failures they never learn and go on to recreate misery elsewhere.

Offred · 28/01/2016 21:47

They may get upset and angry and resentful at other people not living up to their expectations but I don't think this is like sadness that other people feel. It's always tinged with that innate feeling of superiority.

Original poster
wotevaaaa · 28/01/2016 22:03

What shocked me was his underlying vulnerability which I'd never seen before. When I finally stood up & said 'that's it' his facade slipped and he crumpled & I saw just how wounded his inner (childhood) self was.

OP posts:
Imbroglio · 28/01/2016 22:08

Like the Wizard of Oz?

Offred · 28/01/2016 22:25

You can't trust any emotional reaction of a narcissist IMO. Even if the are real feelings they are likely to be deployed at you in a manipulative way I think.

HandyWoman · 28/01/2016 23:42

Some Narcs are shame-based and actually lacking in confidence and self loathing at heart. What they project is normally a 'false self' to cover up the wounded child that they really are. These are undeveloped people who have stunted emotional development and are 'stuck children'. I read an interesting article - will try and give out.

OneLiverbird · 29/01/2016 00:03

Hi there to all,

I've been a long time moocher on MN and have fought and won/winning a few demons thanks to this fantastic place!

Diving right in at the deep end here! I would like to offer my support to the OP and anyone else who is going through similar misery. Maybe even a little help along the way!

I don't want to distract from the OP's thread. Just to say I have been in a 3 year relationship with a partner who ticks most of the NPD boxes. Have thrown him out for the umpteenth time tonight. Some days I couldn't imagine loving him more than I do at the time... other days, like today, I find out yet again he's a nasty lying prick!

His 'hoovering' phases are second to none! I would say I am a reasonably intelligent woman but this seems to matter not with these men, as so far, he's managed to get back with me every time.

OneLiverbird · 29/01/2016 00:05

I meant, even find a little help for myself also, along the way!

LiverbirdOnOne · 29/01/2016 00:31

Name changed, thought I couldn't have this name but it was password that needed altering. Dur!x

spanky2 · 29/01/2016 09:45

Voldy, you need to meet my mother! I was abused by her and I don't have a personality disorder. My therapist said so! I'm referring to narcissistic personality disorder and psychopathic disorder as those are my experience. Didn't make that clear.

OnceAMeerNotAlwaysAMeer · 29/01/2016 09:52

jeeze spanky that must have been one heck of a childhood to survive.

oneliverbird hello :) Is it possible to look at the pattern of his actions rather than his words? They will give you much more key to what he really means and intends that the smooth patter of a person who wants to jerk you around and make you into his toy.

wotevaaaa some people with NPD are very sad and unhappy under it all. vulnerable.

But there's nothing anyone at all in the world can do until they consent to trying to improve, themselves. Then they have to be -able- to, which isn't always the case. But genuinely wanting to is the first big thing.