Have other people managed to keep going just for the children?

[Pinkport]

I've been reading on here for a while and I know people say it can be better to leave a marriage if it's really not working out but....
If you're marriage has become platonic and okay, there maybe a bit of low level conflict but mainly just getting along is it really harming your dc?
How long has anyone else managed to stay in a 'platonic marriage' for? Do you really think this is healthy for dc? We're just in limbo and have been for 5 years (dc 8 and 9).

Can you actually have a discussion to improve and make it a healthier environment?

Yes you need to behave kindly to one another as you would a friend, yes you need boundaries in place and yes you need to decide whether at some point you should formally separate even if you stay in the same house.

You have separate bedrooms so it's a pretty clear signal to the dc that your marriage isn't "right" however why can't you behave kindly towards each other? Don't you want your dc to model that we treat other people kindly and respectfully as much as possible????

If you can't agree to make it a warm and loving home to live in then perhaps living separately is the best thing you can do.

I don't understand couples who agree there's no relationship there anymore but still stay together - for the kids sake.

I find that a bit easy and wonder is it for the kids or is it just easier.

Separating amicably and living separately does not have to cause trauma to your children.

I just don't see how in the long term you can live like that, it's really just a pretend set up, there's no shame in splitting up, I'd rather be honest and upfront than giving the impression I am with someone when in reality I really am not.

my mum said she stayed for my sake.

Well the felled to me that ok-ish was good enough for a marriage and I wasted a lot of time being one sided in trying to make ok relationships work and that was damaging in itself.

Then add in that when they separated both blossomed and became happy and that made a mockery of the life we all had when I could then see who they really were and how broken my home life was. That had me questioning everything.

I'd never advise to stay together for the kids.

Thanks for your insights and telling me your experiences. It's very hard to know what to do. It will become obvious to the dc as they get older we are really a couple, just living together. I really don't know how they would feel if we separated. Definitely our standard of living would go down.

The kids will already realise that parents with separate bedrooms is different from their friends.

I have a slightly different perspective.
I was in your shoes.
I deliberated for years.
Finally got the guts to separate a few years ago. Like you we were platonic , friendly , not loving.
Loads of advice here about how bad that was for the children.

Now me and ex have houses close by , share child are 50:50. I have a wonderful partner that I love very much

BUT ... I can state with 100% certainly that the children are NOT happier in two separate happy households. They have suffered far more than I would have imagined. I think it is a dangerous myth to say that it's always better for children to have 2 happy households than one slightly miserable one.

And I should add , me and the kids ' dad get on completely amicably now.

I do feel much sadder than I thought I would about stuff like when the kids leave home we won't all get together for celebrations and stuff .
And I feel very sad , even years down the line , that I broke up the family.

Also we had been sleeping in separate rooms for years ! There was a lot of low grade unhappiness and we were sure the kids knew we were not a proper couple.

Nothing of the sort !! When we told them they were totally shocked. They really had no idea. And they were very upset

It totally depends on how you interact in front of the children. If there are no blazing rows and you can communicate well then I definitely wouldn't call it emotionally damaging. However, it can't last forever. Could you not use this time to think about finding somewhere else to live, how would you figure out your finances? You don't have to rush to get divorced. Is the relationship salvageable?

My parents stayed together 'for the children'. I put that in quotes because I don't believe that anyone stays together solely for the children's benefit.

I agree with all of Attila's points. You are teaching your children very damaging lessons about what adult relationships look like, and don't underestimate how perceptive they are. You are expecting them to play their role in the happy family fantasy, when they likely know that the reality is not quite matching up.

A question for you OP - what other sources of fun / joy / happiness do you have in your life? Friendships? Hobbies? My parents expected us to fill the void created by their loveless, miserable marriage, and it was a huge and cruel burden to put on young shoulders. None of us were allowed to be our own people, we were encouraged (in an unconscious way) to put our parents' needs first at all times. To say that hasn't been an easy burden to shake off is putting it very mildly.

My mum managed it....she is now extremely bitter.

Otoh, parents who divorce are 'teaching their children' that it's normal for adult relationships to be temporary.

I think it is a dangerous myth to say that it's always better for children to have 2 happy households than one slightly miserable one.

Well I suppose neither are ideal from a child's perspective. But a miserable household could never be "better" than separated parents, just shitty in a different way.

I also think there's a tremendous burden of guilt when a child (or an adult even) discovers their parents stayed together - and miserably so - for their sake.

A friend of mine has never got over the guilt of knowing that her parents only got married because they had a child. They were totally incompatible and it wasn't a happy marriage. She felt like her parents' unhappiness (and their dysfunctional household) was all her fault.

I think that you inadvertently place a very heavy responsibility on the children if you decide to stay together for their sake.

OP, I suggest you consider therapy, either for both of you or yourself. You probably only need a few sessions to help you decide if you want to stay together or if you can improve your marriage.

Staying together for the children is the least selfish option although is not necessarily the best one. But I say that as someone who is divorced.

Let's face it, no-one leaves a relationship because it would be best for their children, unless their is abuse involved obviously. People leave relationships because it is best for them. And the children are still expected to go along with and adapt to the life changes that the parents have made in order to make their lives better. The introduction of two households, new partners, step siblings, potential half siblings. Conflict with step parents and siblings which the children didn't choose. conflict between parents, even underlying conflict, the inability to talk about what goes on in one household while in another, etc.

And it is the children who are expected to carry the responsibility for their reaction to all these changes. Go and have a look at the step parenting board and the amount of resentment directed towards step children who never asked to have a step parent or step siblings.

And never assume that because you're amicable now you will remain so if you split and new partners enter into the equation who see amicability as a threat to the security of their relationship. Don't assume the relationship you have now which is amicable albeit not loving will remain so in five years time if you split.

That being said, your children won't be children for ever. Will you want to stay in this situation when they leave home? Ask yourself honestly, are you really staying because of the children or is it that it's comfortable there and you don't really want to leave? There's no harm in staying in an amicable situation if you're not really unhappy there and aren't seeking to be somewhere else.

Brilliant advice from callmemaybe .

I don't really believe these kinds of loveless/affectionless relationships are 'for the children' I think they are actually because the adults don't feel their relationship is overtly intolerable enough to go through the upheaval of separating.

When you model this sort of relationship to your dc, it's not what they see. It's what they dont see. They miss out on finding out how loving relationships are collaborative, with problem solving and meet the emotional needs of the people in it. Far better in my view to demonstrate that relationships reflect the value each person places on themselves. And that a relationship should end when the love/respect/affection/collaboration is gone. A parallel relationship is qualitatively different. We must also never forget that children learn through children's eyes, they aren't necessarily learning what you think you are teaching them.

My own parents brought us up in an uber functional-yet emotionally-void family life. I was unaware that my family life was teaching me bad lessons (in the face of it we had everything) but my 14 year EA marriage, to a Narcissist, the fallout of which I am still feeling, suggests otherwise.

My neighbour is so full of guilt re her marriage ending, that even though they are divorced he still 'lodges' in the family home 4 days a week. Both adults are miserable. She thinks it's better for the children, but it's really about her own issues. And is messing up the kids.

The thing is calling the parent's happiness has an effect on the dc. It sets the emotional barometer in the house. Kids and parents are in a very close dynamic whether we like it or not. My dd are much the better for having the mum they have now. I was a shell of my former self by the time my marriage ended mind you my stbxh is a selfish, Narcissistic EA bastard

I would also say (I'll stop soon!) that the setting up of step families is not necessarily inevitable. It's another conscious choice and a separate issue. And should only be undertaken where the new relationship is VERY strong. It's not one I'll be making. My dc have been through enough, frankly.

My brother and his wife stayed together for the children - it is a miserable marriage, they now actively hate each other and only have relationships with their children.

Effectively they have one child each that they connect to emotionally.
It is extremely unhealthy for them and the children. Kids are now at university but are transported home weekly so the parents get an emotional connection.
My brother spends weekday evenings with our dad so he doesn't have to be in the same house as his wife.

Basically they are each waiting for the other one to die.
Kids can't make proper friends or a life for themselves as they are constantly guilt tripped to visit or driven home.
We have no extended family life in that SIL and grand kids don't talk to or visit their grandad, or their aunt (me) and DD doesn't know her cousins.

DH also thinks the kids are damaged as they effectively have been told "we are together because of you" and this means really "you are the reason we are so unhappy". They also have no clue about what constitutes a good and happy relationship because they've never seen one.

I am in this dilemma myself. Dp and I get on brilliantly and are very affectionate, we just don't have a sexual relationship (and won't again, we've tried everything). It's sad for us but day to day we are happy and don't row. I feel like if we split we have to do it now while dd is only tiny, but it seems insane to break up her happy family in the off chance we find someone else to have sex with, and the idea of step families does not appeal.

Handywoman, excellent insights, really makes you think!

My parents eventually split up, something we kids were very relieved about. I can't say that they were very affectionate towards each other even before they had marital problems (my dad cheated, my mum wanted to forgive, but couldn't). They seemed to me like a good parent team, but not a very good couple. Personally I don't feel that I have had great role models for relationships. But at the end of they day it gets you nowhere to blame your parents.

'A friend of mine has never got over the guilt of knowing that her parents only got married because they had a child'

My DP is in this situation too Driver. His parents got pregnant with him and got married because of keeping up appearances etc. They openly loathe each other and have done for decades by all accounts, but are still 'together'. Poor DP is 40 years old but still feel tremendous guilt for moving away and living his own life, and feels a huge obligation to make his parents happy.

'My own parents brought us up in an uber functional-yet emotionally-void family life'

This was my family too Handywoman. It's terrifying how badly it messes you up. My siblings and I have all been in abusive relationships, all had alcohol problems, brother has had serious drug problems, all had financial problems. I have been in therapy for several years and am definitely moving towards the light, but still have a long way to go.

I think if my parents had split up when we were kids, as upsetting as it would have been, it would have been such a relief to see them taking responsibility for their own happiness and their own lives, instead of relying on us three to provide happiness and meaning to their lives.

'But at the end of they day it gets you nowhere to blame your parents.'

Well, there's some truth to that, but you have every right to feel angry / let down / sad / whatever you feel about your parents and they way they handled things.

Definitely, Lotta - it's part of recovering, I think, feeling what it is to know you didn't have what your parents intended you to have / and what you thought you had, ie an emotionally healthy upbringing. Nobody's family life is perfect, but sometimes the balance is wrong enough to have consequences.

That said it doesn't half help to finally understand what led to the relationships you've formed in your own life. From there, you can build the skills to give yourself what you need to redress the balance. Instead of blindly playing out the same dynamics.

It's a long hard (and expensive) road, making sense of it all (as I am - in therapy with a very clever woman). But very worth it.

Well I've just found out my parents are pretty much like this and have been married nearly 50 years... We didn't know