Help me process this new information (long)

[TripleRocks]

Sorry this is long and garbled. I'm on my phone and trying to avoid drip feeding.

DH has been having a tough time at work, it seems like forever, stuck in dead end jobs with long hours. His last job, which was supposed to be a promotion, turned out to be a disaster and the woman he was working with was a nasty piece of work, a real bully. He left after a few months but was pretty crushed by the experience.

He started his latest job in September. We were all so relieved as he has got out of the trade like he’s wanted to for so long and the hours are so much more liveable, although it's a bit less money. Unfortunately the woman training him seems to have been giving him a bit of a hard time. Yesterday she became upset with him and stormed out of the room. They spent the last half hour of the day in silence and he was really really wound up when he got home.

This morning, he was talking about not going into work, calling in sick, borrowing a lap top and using the time to find a new job. I was pretty appalled as its been less than 2 months! I have tried so hard to be sympathetic and supportive with his work trials and tribulations over the last decade, but this time I had such high hopes for this working out. I suggested he should go in, make this woman a coffee and sit down sensibly with her and talk about what happened yesterday. I even gave him suggestions of things he might say and to discuss it all with his line manager again. He wasn’t having any of it, saying he just can’t face it and its not going to work. Also he’s got no-one to talk to and I’m not supporting him, which is exasperating as we’ve talked of little else these last few weeks, I just feel like he doesn’t want to hear what I have to say.

Anyhow, he was saying things like this is the worst time of his life, he just can't face her, he feels alone, he's got no fight left in him anymore. It occurs to me that this is not actually a usual response to someone being a bit of a pain at work. I suggest he maybe needs to see a doctor,and on a whim I booked an appointment for him.

The doctor has now signed him off for two weeks with depression and anxiety and given him a prescription for ADs. To be honest, we are both in a bit of a state of shock. Since my light bulb moment this morning things have moved on pretty fast.

There's no denying it's been a tough 2 years, DH and I have both really struggled since DC2 was born and felt pretty wrung out most of the time. But I thought it was me that was hanging by a thread emotionally at times, I'm not sure how to process the idea that it's him/both of us who're struggling. How have I been so blind to this? Now I think of it, he has been moody and not his usual self. I just thought it was the pressure of two kids and due to me struggling.Where can we go from here?

Thanks if you've got this far. I really needed to offload and feeling a bit lost.

Hi Triple, I didn't want to read and run so just wanted to say well done you for spotting a problem and getting the help your dh needed. I'm sure someone else will be along soon with experience of this but, coming from someone who has now recovered from Clinical Depression, once the problem has been identified and solutions looked at, for the person suffering with depression, things can begin to look a little more positive as something is actually being done and the way they are feeling has a name. It may take time but you are both going in the right direction now.

Good luck and

He's had "work trials and tribulations over the last decade", his previous job which was "supposed to be a promotion" didn't work out due to him allegedly being bullied by a woman, and his current job that he's only had for little more than a month looks to be on the brink because the woman training him allegedly gave him a hard time.

It seems to me that there's more going on here than depression and I very much doubt that it will have gone down well with his current employers that he's been signed off sick within such a short time of joining the company.

What do you envisage happening in 2 weeks' time? If he's been prescribed anti-ds they may not have kicked in before he's due to return to work. If he doesn't return having, presumably, resigned from another job after only a few months or so won't look good on his cv.

A employment record such as his wouldn't convince me that he's a stayer and I imagine that many companies would balk at the possibility of having to take the time, trouble, and expense of advertising and interviewing again should he take a similar dislike to a colleague.

Perhaps he could use the next week or so to give consideration to a complete change of career and look at the possibilities for retraining in another field or becoming self-employed?

If this isn't practical I suggest that he tries to mend fences with his trainer before he returns to work otherwise it's probable that the problem he encountered yesterday won't have resolved itself in his absence.

Does this man tend to control a lot of things around the house? If you put your foot down about something important to you, does he sulk about it and act like a child? Does he get overly cranky when you make household decisions without consulting him?

I ask because when a man has trouble at two jobs in a row because a woman bosses him around (a woman whose job it is to boss him around!), it rather seems like he may just have an issue with being told what to do by someone female. I've met men like this, who seem to make anything a woman tells them into an argument, or who have to do something slightly different than what a woman directs them to do so that their ego is preserved.

In the last job he was supposed to be managing the bully, so she wasn't in a position of authority, it was the reverse. She had applied for the job internally and not got it and seemed to want to make his life a misery. She did some crappy things. I wish he had stuck up to her more be he allowed it to get out of hand and ultimately ended up leaving. I think it was just a combination of bad luck and inexperience of people management on his part.

He is not controlling, our relationship is 50/50. He can be a bit stubborn but so can I. Generally we got on brilliantly. We have had more rows in the last 2 years, but I have struggled emotionally since DC2. We have no support except each other. It's been hard. I had felt we were coming out the other side this last 6 months.

Re his work history, he's worked ft since being a teenager, never been unemployed, never had a period of time off, worked with men and women. When I say 'trials and tribulations' I mean he's been stuck in an industry with no real progression prospects, pretty crappy hours, crap benefits and not brilliant pay but has found it really hard to break out and start again in a new field/retrain due to finances and having two small DC in childcare plus me working part time these last few years. He's always moaned about wanting out and driven me mad with it, but I guess it's a pretty common predicament. There's no way he's work shy.

Anyhow, after the disaster of his last job, this one was a stroke of luck. It's out of the trade, his hours are better, the company is flexible, benefits package is good, on the face of it it's what he's (we've) been waiting for. I don't know if so much riding on it adds to the pressure? Anyhow, I appreciate him going off sick so early on is not ideal but we are where we are.

I don't know what to say. I'd obviously like him get back to work and make the best of it, but the fact is, at the moment he's just simply not able to cope with a seemingly fairly everyday scenario of having had a bit of a falling out at work. It's not really like him. I do believe him that he's struggling to cope. That's not his fault surely?

It seems more than a coincidence that he's fallen out with women in his last two jobs, to the extent that he has to give up work.

People think this is because he's working with a woman

I don't think so, doesn't ring true to me.

The woman always worked on her own before, isn't used to working in a team, is reluctant to give up control of her role, wants to micromanage and has no training experience. She needs more support from the manager. He needs to get more involved in the day to day.

None of which would make me feel I couldn't face work, but isn't that because I haven't got anxiety or depression??

DH has always been really popular at work, a real team player. It's been one of his strengths.

Why did the woman training him get upset and walk out on him?

DH had asked a question. She had bristled because it wasn't something he's being trained on yet (she has been restricting what she will train him on, which she had been pulled up on by the team manager). So, they were trying to find a particular entry in some documentation. It was a part number and they were looking at plans. She couldn't remember exactly where the part was. Whilst they were studying the plans, DH suggested what area of the design it could be in. She said he was rude to have interrupted her. He didn't think he had. Either way, she left the room in a bit of a flap and didn't speak to him for the last hour of the day

What stands out to me is that he is traumatised by the bullying in his previous job. Perhaps when this last incident happened, which could look like history repeating itself, he cracked, couldn't take any more.

I have experience workplace bullying and can testify it can bring people down in record time. It's astonishing how quickly and conclusively even great oaks can fall. Don't underestimate the devastating effect of it.

I hope there are good systems in place at his new workplace ie managing conflict. I do hope so.

Triple its hard bringing up a little family with no support from family but give yourselves a pat on the back for doing as well as you have so far. You have just found out that your husband hasn't coped as well with everything as you thought. Just give him your full support now and be a team. This two weeks he has off will give him some breathing space go decide how he proceeds now and the tablets will help him soon. Also make sure to be gentle on yourself and make time for you as well.

Thanks Springydaffs that makes sense.

It did completely crush his self esteem. She was very definitely a bad apple.

I think maybe he's convinced it's going to be the same story all over again.

I have been fortunate so far not to have experienced bullying but my thoughts were exactly those posted by springydaffs.

Don't really know what to suggest apart from taking a chance and being honest with current employers perhaps with backup of docs note saying plan now is to get time to recover and return to work asap ie when able to go forward having had tine to recover as much as possible. Sounds like yea in an ideal world you could do this but if it is a big company hopefully they are equipped to see and help, in confidence.

Perhaps he could have a call with the team manager? Just to reassure the team manager he will be back.

He needs to document the meeting ( as you have below) in a non aggressive email to the team manager - perhaps the trainer is not really very experienced and sees herself as boss trainer and doesn't like an inclusive workplace? Try practising a call with him. I would suggest a call with the team manager before an email.

He got this job. He's on a probation period. He can still look for work whilst on his probation and quite honestly if you are overwhelmed the thought of dealing with trouble at work makes you want to run away. Can he get on linked in, with his new role and look at positions? Treat it as a temp job of 18 months so that 6 months to learn it, 6 to do it, and 6 to find something lose within the company or elsewhere? Breaking it down may make it easier.

Oh, and look after yourself too. You sound so nice, but everyone has a tipping point

Thanks Blodss, I missed your post before.

And thanks everyone. I actually rang the line manager myself today to explain what's happened. I wanted to do what I could to take some stress away. He was very understanding. Although, I see that after DH has had a little time, in an ideal world he would make contact himself /keep in contact with him until he's ready to go back.

Part of me wants to tell DH not to let this slip through his fingers, but I know that while he's in flight mode, putting on any pressure is the worst thing I could do.

What I don't understand is why the doctor has diagnosed depression and anxiety. Rather than, say, stress? Do these things really get diagnosed with a brief 5 min chat from someone who barely knows you? I don't want to minimise what he's going through. The gp told him to look for a new job. I'm not sure that's good advice tbh

He definitely shouldn't give up just yet but I would also make sure he talks to his line manager, it sounds like he is feeling bullied.

why the doctor has diagnosed depression and anxiety. Rather than, say, stress?

I think gp's look for symptoms of each and prescribe meds accordingly.
I am not sure if this is the best description but here you go:
www.calmclinic.com/anxiety/difference-anxiety-depression

I believe that meds for anxiety are milder tban those for depression.

I used to work with a woman who couldn't take pressure and would walk on me crying when I was training her. Itcwas very difficult relatiobship at work as she used to bring with her all her home and family stress and we never really got on. Looking back I should have looked for anither job straight away as she madd my life very stressful atxwork. I was supposed to be the bigger person and understand her moods.

In your DH's case only thing he can doniscto be that bigger person but if his confidencevis low and he feels battered and with no guarantee how the other person is going to act I xan see where his anxiety is coming from.
Unless he learns quickly to have thick skin and not to take it personally that other people are full of anxieties then it is hard to see him staying calm in his current job.

I would not dismiss the plan of looking for a new job soon.

Could you tell us how long was he in his previous company and the current one?

Terrible spelling - sorry!

I agree with springydaffs. It sounds like your DH thinks it's all starting up again.

Does his company have an HR person he could talk to? The way the woman behaved (silent treatment to a colleague!) needs to be addressed. I would encourage him to speak to HR; she needs to be told that her behaviour is not acceptable and will not be tolerated.

An HR professional would see that whilst his reaction may seem over the top, it is understandable due to what has happened in the past.

A new job isn't really going to help; there are difficult people wherever you go.
Methods on how to deal with difficult people could help him cope. Does the company offer training to help with assertiveness or dealing with difficult people?

It really isn't him... but he does need support to help him deal with his reaction to people around him.

Big hugs to you both. I really hope your DH gets the help and support he needs at work.

Is his new company big enough to have access to Occupational Health? If so your DH should contact them, and they should be involved in managing his return to work.

Do you think your DH might benefit from reading accounts of how others have been affected by workplace bullying?

I've suffered it but was rescued by being unexpectedly removed from the situation before I had to resign. But I struggled to understand what impact it was having on me beyond that I was very unhappy. However, when I listened on the radio to an account of the impact of worse bullying I found it incredibly shocking but also helpful.

Hello OP

Your situation struck a chord with me, so I thought I would share my experience.

My ex-H and I were together for over 20 years (I married him as a teenager, he was mid-20's).

He had escalating mental health problems throughout the entire time, which which ultimately led to the end of the marriage - he became very abusive and downright dangerous.

His problems started at work, and I too made his first appointment with our G.P. He wanted me to come with him. It was a fairly short appointment, but the G.P. had a multi-choice questionnaire which my ex was asked to complete. It took about 10 mins, after which he was told he had anxiety and depression and was given tablets.

The pills took a few months to work. After a while, ex would think he was fine and would stop taking them. Another minor incident (that most people would cope with) would happen at work, and he would be back feeling worse than the last time.

This cycle went on for 3-4 years before he started abusing alcohol and solvents to get the 'normal feeling' the pills alone were no longer giving him. He refused to accept that his condition required life-long management.

IMVHO, depression/anxiety medication treats the acute symptoms, not the underlying cause. If the patient is never taught techniques to deal with their stress points, then all the pills in the world won't help them in the long run (i.e. he'll still have to face returning to work in two weeks, or finding another new job/dealing with difficult people etc).

I'd strongly consider getting in touch with your local MIND group who can give you both some support. I'd also ask your G.P. for a referral for cognitive behaviour therapy (CBT) for your DH. He'll been taught techniques to help him face the challenges/situations/people that he is currently finding difficult. There is a long wait in some areas and you usually get 6 sessions on the NHS.

If your DH's workplace has private healthcare in place from day 1 of employment I'd also ask them for a CBT referral.

Best of luck

I was also going to suggest counseling. If several session paid privately would mean he can cope with his new job better you would pay with no hesitation. Of course there's no guarantee but worth trying.

I really appreciate everyone's posts. Lots to think about.

The gp has made him an appointment at the start of November with a local mental health service, it's not clear exactly what for but hopefully counselling.

Good point about getting in contact with HR/occupational health. He spoke to HR on leaving the job where he was bullied but unfortunately it was only at exit interview stage (it was a small company with an off site HR dept which he didn't know about). However he found the experience really positive so I will suggest he contacts someone at his current job.

As an update, he spent most of the day sleeping or resting today. He says he didn't realise just how tired he had got. I am not going to even mention work until after the weekend.

I've noticed he's picked up the ADs but not opened them yet. Not sure what I think about that.

You don't need to wait until he sees his GP, he can self refer online for Italk. Google for the details, they'll do a telephone assessment to decide whether he needs help and whether Italk is the right means of getting that help.

Is italk a national thing? I've not heard of it my way.

Sounds like you're getting some calm on the home front. That has to be a good thing. Step at a time...