What a mess (sorry, long post)

[WhataPickle]

I nearly walked out on my DH last week, taking DS with me. The main thing that stopped me was the lack of petrol in the car to get me anywhere, and being completely broke. The other thing that stopped me was that there would be no-one to look after our horses on Monday when he returns to work and we can't afford to pay anyone to do it.
Life at the moment is one big fecked up mess and I really don't know how long I can continue with this. Without going into extensive detail, we have a house in the country, with horses, chickens etc, which has always been DH's dream, and, I thought, mine. Rural idyll, yeah, yeah, yeah. Unfortunately, DH has to work away to pay for this, leaving me at home to cope with DS (1y/o) and the animals alone, sometimes for 2-3 weeks at a time because we can't always afford for him to get back as he's trying to build up a new business.
We're as good as broke and he's fighting tooth and nail to save his business, which could well go under very shortly. In the meantime, I'm dodging creditors and praying the bailiffs don't turn up (it's happened before) and as at this moment we have no money at all, not even the coppers under the sofa. On top of this, I have now come to hate having to look after the animals and am resenting DH going off to work, doing something worthwhile, whilst I feel like the classic dowdy, overweight, useless mum who used to have a brilliant life. When DH does come home it feels like the boss has arrived, not my husband, as I never seem to get anything right.

The only solution I can see to this is that we sell the house as the equity is huge and move somewhere smaller, but DH won't hear of it. I understand that to him this place represents a lot more than bricks and mortar, and if I'm honest, probably means more to him than I do, so if it came to that choice, I know which way he'd go. I also don't want to be the cow responsible for forcing him to sell his dream. His mother walked out when he was young, forcing the family home to be sold (hence the importance of our house) and he has never forgiven her. I really don't want to be in that same position.
However, if his business does fail, the house will have to be sold anyway, and the sheer relief of that would be wonderful because I have put up with this situation for so long. But I know this would as good as kill him and I don't know what we'd then do for income - me getting a job I suspect, which would mean moving back to London as it's the only place I can work with my skills. This I would love, he would hate it. Just to add to this, I do still love him, I think, although even that I'm not sure about any more, and we certainly haven't had sex for months. I think the time he's spent being away whilst I struggle alone here may be killing that off, and I feel I spend a lot of time here being lonely and in floods of tears as I just can't see a way through. Like I said, I'm broke and would probably be declared bankrupt within days if I left. Added to which, what kind of a person would I be to walk out on someone whilst we're in this situation? God what a mess. But the worst thing is that I walked into all of this with my eyes wide open, believing that this was what I wanted and that we could make it work, so it's me that has made the mistake.
I am a bit of a poster, albeit relatively new, but I have changed my name as I don't want people to know who I am, as I am so ashamed. And sorry for the length, I just needed to get this off my chest as I have no-one I can talk to about this, so don't feel you need to respond. TBH, there's not much that can be said as I know I won't leave, however much I think about it, or at least not in the immediate future.

This sounds a horrible situation, and I would feel very trapped if I was you.

Cant there be some way to compromise? Could you sell the animals? That would mean a reduction in your outgoings and mean that you werent so tied to the house and chores as you are currently. When things sort themselves out you could could then buy some more.

Or what about renting out some outbuildings? If you keep livestock do you have spare stables you could take in some liveries? Maybe someone could stable their horse in exchange for looking after the ones you have?

As a last resort could you agree to rent your house for a set period while your dh business is sorted out. You could live somewhere smaller and cheaper, but the dream home would still be there when you are all in a better position to deal with it.

Just realised you may not actually have wanted advice, just a listening ear so apologies if I have rambled on.

It would be good to find a way you can happily live there without feeling unhapy, but also not have to upset your dh.

Message withdrawn

You know the things you need to do to make things easier for you.
Your dh has his head in the sand and that is some peoples way of dealing with things. It's hard to make people see what to do if they are not prepared to look at the problem.
Your are carrying alot on your shoulders,I would see about re-homing the animals.
You need to be strong, present him with the facts and then sort it together.

I'm so sorry that you're feeling so fed up. I was wondering if maybe you're lonely with only little-people company and your husband being away. Maybe you could advertise under the rent-a-room scheme for a lodger? There is a set amount that you can get without having to pay tax on it (check on the hmrc website), and you could discount the room rate if your lodger would be willing to help out with the horses say two or three days a week. This would give you a little discretionary disposable income, and a wee bit of respite from the animals.

I know what you mean about feeling like the "dowdy, overweight, useless mum who used to have a brilliant life". It's really tough changing from being a professional to being a sahm, let alone adopting a completely new lifestyle. Have you managed to create any kind of a network locally? Do you get out at all? (I know it's tough when you've got wee people and buggar all cash). Do you have any free time where you could take on a little work that would give you back some of your independence? What kind of thing did you used to do? Sorry for so many questions.

It sounds like both you and your husband are under a lot of strain so it's not surprising that your sex life (and your self-esteem) are suffering. I'm sorry I can't offer any real help - but I can offer an e-hug, a listening ear and re-assurance that you won't always feel like this.

Take care of yourself.

Thanks, you're all lovely - reading this back I realise how typically bloomin middle class and self pitying it all sounds, particularly whining about property of all things, but sadly that's what I am. And no, we can't remortgage either, we tried.
I take your points about getting rid of the animals, and believe me, we are trying. I was hoping they'd be gone by Christmas, but at the moment they're not shifting. We've got rid of a lot them, but still some to go. Sorry, I'm not trying to be vague but I don't want to go into too much specifics.
And with regard to lodgers, that would be a brilliant idea, but unfortunately, you've guessed, the rural idyll is a rural shithole that needs money spending before it's habitable. It's fine for us (just), but that's it. Don't worry, DS doesn't suffer in any way, and I keep the important parts as nice, clean & tidy as I can for him, but that aside, hmmmm.
And yes, we do have stabling but they're really for ponies not horses, and around here you can't throw a stick without hitting a DIY livery. But these are all wonderful suggestions, and I would do any of them if I could.
However, I do have a job interview next week which pays very well for here, and could be quite a good one, but it's full time which I'm anxious about, given DS's age, but I don't see I have any choice as I am so sick of being broke and right now seems the only option. DH hates the idea - he only knows cos he took the message from them asking me to come in - but I think even he knows he had no room to complain.
And I do get out to playgroup and suchlike, which helps a lot, but with no money and a house like this, there's no way I could go out leaving a babysitter here, even if I could afford to pay them.
As for DH, I agree that he has his head in the sand, but I think he's been fighting for so long that he really is losing the bigger picture. Or rather, the bigger picture is what he's focused on, which means he's missing the smaller one - if that makes sense?! Either way, I think by Christmas we'll have some idea of where we are. But just to add to this (God, more?) he had also convinced himself he had cancer and was about to die, but didn't tell me for about 3 months. So that really added to his already brilliant mood (bloody, bloody typical man). He finally had tests done and it was actually fine, but that really was the icing on the cake of feeling like a total witch of a wife over that period.

And Kezza, I really don't mind advice - I just wish I could think of something myself. I have good days and bad days, but today is PMT day which makes it all so much worse.

Regarding the animals would the RSPCA be able to take them for you ?
I think when you are in a situation like this you tend to close down the communication with those closest to you. You then feel that you have it all to cope with on your own.
Be as open and honest with each other as possible. Set yourselves small goals that are achievable.
Make a list of where all the money you have goes.
Have to finish off now and do the school run but will check back later if possible.
Remember that are lots of people on here that will help even if you just want to off load.
Take care of yourself.

Thanks Heaven, but the animals have to be sold as its mainly livestock, and, as such, capital. DH is doing what he can in terms of managing the income/expenditure, which basically means juggling creditors. We're not about to run out of food as I have a freezer full, and the main utility bills were put in credit last quarter, so at least they're not chasing. But it's the smaller bills to local suppliers which are the embarassing ones.
The communicating is the big problem though. We're talking about the practical stuff, like the bills, but it's everything else that's not being talked about, and won't be until he's next home, by which time we may well know if the house has to go on the market or not. To be honest, it was a terrific relief when he went back this time and I think he felt the same. We were certainly nicer to each other later on the phone than we had been all weekend. Which again just makes me feel so guilty when I know how hard he is working to try to save his business.

You are working hard too,keeping things going at home.
Next time he is home and as you have a freezer full of food why not set aside some time to sit down together and have a meal. Get ds off to bed and make the evening an evening when you do not talk about money but for want of a better words get to know each other again.

Thanks again, you're right, and I suspect we've got a hell of a lot of talking to do over Christmas, once we know how everything else stands, because I think at the moment we want very different things for the future.

I think if you can, you should show dh this thread. In simple terms, by trying to prevent what happened in his childhood (mother leaves, house sold) he is on the brink of causing it to happen anyway (you leave because he won't sell the house, then he sells it anyway).

Obviously your finances are in a bad way, but do you have a grip on them? Know exactly what your incomings and outgoings are, looked at ways to economise and generally get things under control? If you put it in black and white, in business terms your dh will understand, may bring home (no pun intended) to him that his dream - this dream - now, is unsustainable. He's asking a lot of you - supporting him in setting up a new business at the same time as struggling with a horrific home situation. One or t'other maybe but this seems like too much.

There's nothing wrong with thinking that rural life was going to suit you and then finding it doesn't. My mum was the same; after I left uni, they moved to a house in the countryside (which I charitably described as a 'rural hellhole', I now think it is quite charming, they have a pumpkin society in the village, how sweet!). My mum insisted it was what she wanted, but within a few years she had grown to hate it.

You haven't made a mistake. You wanted to try something new, and have discovered that it wasn't for you. That happens.

Your dh needs to decide what his priorities are. You can find a compromise on housing, location, jobs ... all these things are solvable, as long as both parties work at it.

I'm afraid that never in a million years would I get him to look at this. He would be furious, and the mother thing is a big black no-go area, which is far more complicated than her just walking out (nothing weird or anything, just deeply unpleasant), but it is the reason why this home is so important to him - as is having it as a legacy for DS. I know it sounds gothic, but there you go.
As far as the finances go, he's got a much better handle on it than I have, and is exceptionally good at the whole juggling thing, which means he does appreciate the situation with regard to how far things can be pushed before we finally have to call in the estate agent. The difficulty here is that I'm coming around to the view that I'm just sick of the struggle, because as I see it we can save the business and make it very successful using a part of the equity, whereas for him, to lose the house is the failure, which I truly believe he would never get over. Yup, history repeating itself. But as you point out, ultimately both could be lost anyway. He's far from stupid and the business problems are purely based on cashflow, and I'm 99% certain that he knows all of the arguments, but the problem is the emotional investment he has in this place.

All I hear in that argument is him. His emotional investment in your home, his business, his family history. What about you? What about ds? If his financial grip is so great, why are you flailing round dealing with bailiffs, trying to sell off animals? I think you think his financial grip on matters is better than it is.

I say again, your dh needs to decide what his priorities are. He cannot have everything that he wants: he needs to deal with it.

But why that particular house? Presumably you havn't owned it for that long so why such the strong attachment even taking into account what you said about his family, is the point not to just provide his family with a nice home suitable for your needs. Why is it inconceivable that you could move to somewhere more manageable, more comfortable but still with all the elements that he feels important such as rural with animals etc. It seems a bit sad to me that you could both miss some very important years in your sons life whilst working and stressing in the pursuit of this dream. I lost my home through separation recently, some days it gets to me but I know for sure that what is important for my sons future is happy memories and good relationships. I feel for you, it's all very stressful.

Like I said earlier,if you sell this is does not mean you will never have a house like it again. Your dh needs to see this.

Yes, your DH would feel far less emotionally tied to a house if he understood that you're the stability in his life, wherever you live.

I expect he's panicking because he feels responsible for this difficult situation. If this were me I would sit him down and tell him I married him, not the house, I would live with him in a tent if it meant staying together, and that I loved him for himself, not for the lovely house he's provided. Though I guess you might have already tried all that.

You're absolutely right, and I'm well aware, given how much equity we have (through a lucky hike in property prices rather than anything else), that were we to sell we wouldn't exactly be living in a hovel. And I know it's incomprehensible about his attachment to this place, but I can't go into any more detail as it's way too specific, but it's really not just about bricks & mortar.
When he gets back again and everything's a bit clearer, I will be sitting down to talk to him to tell him exactly how I feel about all this although right now I can't quite see where it gets us, as I guess my bottom line is that I want to cut our losses, sell up and move and his is the complete opposite - and that's a conversation which keeps going around in circles.
But, some good news, someone phoned last night and will be buying a chunk of our livestock which is a)cash and b)a little less to worry about

Good news about the animals.
As you say your dh has more issues than just bricks and motar,and to the outside world it seems like an easy solution. Unfortunately life is never that simple. I hope you both manage to sort things out.
Keep us updated or just rant when you feel need to.

Heaven, and all of you, thank you so much for listening. As much as anything it's been a great relief getting this off my chest and finally admitting to myself at least that there is something seriously wrong which won't just go away. It also gave me the courage to ask my BF (who doesn't leave anywhere nearby) to read this thread, as she had no idea. So big hug & thanks to her too. I think MN may have a new member.
I know what I now need to do, but the next step is for me to concentrate on next week's interview and find a CM who I'm happy to leave DS with full time.
Thanks again, you've all been so kind, and I will keep you posted.

I agree re selling the animals.My dp's sister has horses chickens etc and they are a monumental strain on her relationship as her husband often has to deal with them as she gets ill a fair bit with depression and can't 'do'the animals.It is a full time job as you know and just taking that away would be a huge relief.I know she can't even have a holiday or a day out without organising help Can you be totally honest with him and see what he thinks?

My x2bdh was also abandoned by his mum, and she continues to abandon him. (nb - by abandoned I mean left-and-ignored, not just that his dad got custody). Your dh sounds very like him - irrationally attached to things/property/success; setting unwinnable agendas (eg why on earth sink all your capital into property when you are struggling for income - can't you release some equity for a bit of breathing space?); absolutely no concept of home/work and partnership as parents; wood:tree perception issues when it comes to Life.

In my case, I spent 20 years making allowances for x2bdh behaviour because I could see that his childhood had left him very badly prepared for hte real world. This was the WRONG approach. I should have made it clear from the outset what was acceptable and normal behaviour as a dad and dh, made sure he understood and considered my needs, and weathered the storms. Instead I had a moderately miserable, resenful and guilt-weighted marriage to a man I increasingly disliked, and am now in the middle of a difficult divorce that is damaging him badly.

So, by all means sell some chickens, but PLEASE PLEASE address the big issues too. Your needs are just as important as his - and it does sound as if you are the one in the partnership who is best qualified to make a happy family.

You are facing a crossroads - things change and you stay, or things don't change and you go. He needs to know this. He doesn't want to know, and he won't like it, and he will bury his head in the sand, but if you don't tell him then it really is unfair because one day you will up and go and he will have had no chance to fix things. Believe me, I am there, and it is not a great place to be.

tc58, I am so sorry. This sounds dreadful and I really do feel for you, this must be agony. If it's not too personal, may I ask if your walking out/seeking a divorce came totally out of the blue for him, or had he just refused to see any warning signs? This all sounds so terribly familiar, particularly the things/property/success; setting unwinnable agendas. He knows exactly where he wants to be, and so everything is geared towards that. Last week I was watching us, thinking 'I cannot see myself doing this for the next 40 years'.

And another personal question, which you really don't have to answer either, but do you think if you'd dealt with this 20 years ago (or whenever) that you would now still be married, or do you think it would have saved you 20 years of anguish? Because I have to say, I honestly don't know how capable my DH is of change, or if he'd even accept that change were needed - he's always right and the rest of the world is wrong pretty much sums it up, although ironically, quite often he is right! He's very good at convincing me to go in his direction, and this is what I'm trying to pull myself out of.
Big hug again, but it sounds like you are doing the right thing for you.

Whatapickle, thank you for your support, and I am relieved it has made you prick up your ears. To answer your questions

• yes he had refused to see any warning signs so yes it did come out of the blue, from his point of view. Not totally out of the blue, but I don't think you can ever be prepared for it, especially if you don't want it to happen (which he didn't). Big communication gap - I seriously underestimated the simplicity of his perspective and couldn't see how he could possibly think I was happy. Many men do seem to need it spelled out in words of one syllable: 'i am so miserable that unless things change I will leave'. Followed by departure to Mum if definite steps are not taken eg discussion, counselling etc
• if I had dealt with this 20 years ago would things be better? - undoubtedly and definitely. That's my main message to you - deal with it now. I don't know whether we would be together or apart now and my marriage was good in many ways, but thihgs would have been better dealt with then.

If you are dithering, I can recommend a book called TOo Good to Leave too bad to stay (if you are a book person).