Struggling with brother who only wants to talk about himself

[Anantara]

Would really like some coping strategies to deal with my brother. Over the last few years he has bordered on depression or had a personal crisis, and so we only talk about him and his issues. Because it's gone on so long I think it's become a habit and I'm starting to find it difficult to cope with, it's actually starting to get me down.

I've tried to help, but he doesn't really want advice, I have learnt to be careful what I say as if it's not what he wants to hear he can be prickly.
For example, he was very depressed at the beginning of the summer and its been going on months, I said this is no way to live, go to the doctor and ask for help. He felt he could deal with it himself, so I suggested exercise, healthy eating, taking pleasure in the little things etc etc. He's marginally better but still very low. He went to the doctor who prescribed pills, he took one and said he felt it and his body is very sensitive, last night he text me to say his personal trainer recommended a drug from the internet which he had ordered. Also counselling, tried one counsellor, didn't go again, but has now found a counsellor/hypnotist/medium. He's tried this type of person before and it didn't help - I don't understand his approach and am struggling.

Sorry I'm trying to keep it short, but the gist is he often is about to make some major decision like move house, change job, move country etc, which we talk about for ages, then he ignores everything I say and does what he wants anyway.

I feel if the tables were turned he wouldn't be talking about me all the time, not that I would want to. I want to help him, but I'm finding it very negative because it's gone on for so long and he doesn't seem to be trying to help himself.

When he talks, listen and they say 'mmmm' and change the subject. Don't offer advice because he doesn't want to hear it.

I know exactly what you mean!

I ended up doing as scobber has done, and saying that I felt I was just subjected to monologues about his feelings, weird acknowledgements of anything I say 'we went camping!' - 'ohhh, right, well, I'm feeling very nervous about ...' - I just had to say how draining it was and that I dreaded seeing him as a result.

That may not work, of course.

Thank you for quick replies, I think just agreeing could work well and I'll try it. He does have a habit of constantly asking what I think/would do, how would you deal with this?

I'm very careful not to criticise if he doesn't take my advice, I just ignore the fact that I've said anything and don't refer back to it. I don't feel that emotional about it so it doesn't bother me.

I did try saying at the weekend that I thought he was depressed because he'd stopped talking about anything but himself, and not really asking about me. He said he thought I may be struggling with my teenage ds but thought he wouldn't ask about it. Then went back to talking about his only dilemmas.

Call him out directly. Humour could work.

You say something about your life. He changes the subject to be about him. You mock. Did I just speak or was it my imagination?! Am I invisible dude?! Oh good, we are back to talking about you again. You know I have a life too right? I'm bored of this, let's talk about ME!

And to his questioning I agree it is best to stop offering actual advice "I dunno, it's your life, what do you want to do?" "Why is that a difficult decision?" "Tricky one, good luck with that." "Have you tried flipping a coin?"

That is hard as you see how he is depressed and you want to help. But at the end of the day, you can not heal him. He has to participate in his own recovery. His superficial "trying" of traditional solutions, imho, might be his way of dismissing you. He heard you, tried it (not really-it is known that many anti depressive meds take weeks to have an effect)(same with counselling-takes effort to find the right counsellor then months/years of sessions to transition into recovery) ...then what? Either he gets more sympathy from you because things didn't work, or he wants you to stop advising him (does he feel you are micromanaging him?)?

I am assuming your brother is an adult. The above advice of nodding and humming acknowledgment that he has spoken is good. This is allowing you to respond to him in the moment, but at the same time allows you to have an emotional boundary to protect yourself from being sucked down into your own pit of misery. It isn't so much being dismissive of him, as it is you protecting your own mental health.

I think you're both right - turn questions back on himself, I'll have a go. I think I need to rethink what's polite.

I've tried to help, but he doesn't really want advice, I have learnt to be careful what I say as if it's not what he wants to hear he can be prickly.

When my son has very low periods, he calls me for help. (He lives about 250 miles away.) I was also trying to advise him and fix his problems. It was just frustrating both of us - me because he wouldn't take my advice, so I felt like he was sort of wallowing in his problems, and him because I was getting frustrated and he could hear that and felt like it was "just one more person turning their back on me" (Lots of residual issues from his birth mum walking out numerous times and his dad dying.)

A while ago I decided to use a technique instead of just reflecting and validating his feelings, and asking him what he would like from me. This has worked really well - it helps me stay more detached instead of taking on his worries as my own, and it helps him feel like he is more in control of his feelings.

If he tells me he is very sad about something, I will just reflect this back like "I can hear that you're really upset about it" or "that must have made you feel very sad."

I still give him my advice if he asks for it, but I try to make it more of a hands-off thing, if that makes sense - so I'll say "If it was me, I would ask my doctor for help. Do you think that would work for you?"

Depressed people often get stuck in a vicious circle where they don't have the energy or motivation to actually improve things (or sometimes don't feel they deserve to.) Something like hypnosis or psychic healing probably appeals to your brother because it sounds like he won't have to make any effort, that he would just pay and the practitioner would do the heavy lifting. TBH, when you're severely depressed (and I've been there), just getting out of bed and putting your pants on requires a huge effort, so the idea of getting exercise, eating properly, seeing the doctor, etc., can almost be laughable at how unrealistic it seems.

pocket - you sound like the most awesome Mum.

OP: I wonder if you can move away from a place where you are trying to 'fix' him with practical advice, and move towards a place where you are just there to listen and help him reflect?

Aw thanks Holly

I found it helpful for me in that situation to say lm sure you will work it out. Finding they never took any advice or help was such a pain that giving none just eased my frustrations. So finding one or two sentences and using them took the burden off me and let them make their own decisions.

Hi sorry been out since lunchtime, thank you all for your help. AndTheBandPlayedOn I can see what you're saying about the sympathy/stop advising, I don't think I try to micromanage him, I'm trying not to influence his decisions, just give suggestions, and I don't think he feels obliged to take my advice, I think he just thinks I don't understand, and its not that simple. There's always a reason not to take action.

You all sound so helpful (and kind), I hope its okay not to answer each of you, but I have read your suggestions several times. I am going to try being more neutral and detach without being dismissive, I think it will help me as it's really started to get me down. He called earlier but I said I only had 10 mins (which I did) and then I said I had to leave as was taking dd out. I felt better just controlling the length of conversation, as normally it would have gone on for over an hour, talking about stuff we've already talked about. He phoned my parents after.

I think I've moved on mentally from wanting to fix him, and realise it has to come from him. Now its just a case of trying to extract myself from the pattern without hurting him. He is my brother and I don't want to risk making him feel rejected, which could make him more depressed.

The other thing to consider Op, is that once you've put the phone down after your conversation has finished, you feel awful and exhausted and your DB probably feels great as he's dumped all his "baggage" on you!
So, active listening but emotionally distancing yourself from his problems is the way to go for both of you.
Set yourself a time limit (mentally) with his phone calls if he does have a tendency to offload for hours - you are entitled to live your life too.
Oh - and do tell him NOT to buy pills off the internet as he has no idea what he's buying.

So he really just isn't interested in any aspect of your life at all?

He calls you up, talks about himself for ages, asks what you'd do, ignores all that anyway and then does it all again to you a few days later?

Op, you're a saint. A tired out saint. I think he needs to be reminded that relationships are two way. You're not simply there as a vessel for him to pour his woes into.

He's your brother and he's very heavy. How long has this been going on for?

I'm all for helping people but this sounds utterly tedious.