Would it be unreasonable to ask DH to let me have a few more lie-ins?

[ARunOfThings]

DS is 11 months old. Since he was born, he has never slept for longer than 4 hours at a time (apart from 1 stint of 5 hours a few months ago!). Mostly he wakes every 3 hours. As he's breastfed, I'm awake with him every time. I also co-sleep with him, as it's the only way he'll stay asleep for longer than an hour, but he can be quite restless, meaning I'm awake even if he's not. DH generally gets up with him at weekends, since I'm up every day during the week.

I'm exhausted, having averaged about 6 hours' sleep every night for almost a year. DH gets full night's sleep every night. I also have depression and suffer panic attacks, which gets worse if I don't get enough sleep (pre-DS I averaged about 10 hours' sleep each night, which my body seemed to need)

DH is about to have 4 weeks off work. He said how much he's looking forward to getting lots of lie-ins. I asked what he meant and he said he thinks it's only fair for us to alternate getting up with DS, so he gets up early one day, and I get up early the next. I feel this is a bit unfair, as his lie-in after a full night's sleep is a luxury, whereas mine is more of a necessity for catching up on sleep. Mine is also often interrupted by DS needing to be fed, so I sometimes only get an extra hour anyway.

I'd like to ask DH whether he would mind if I got an extra lie-in every few days, but I'm not sure whether that's reasonable, or just me being lazy. DH is someone who is very "fair" about splitting responsibility, but by that he means it all has to be split equally, whereas I think it can depend on circumstances.

He has completely the wrong idea.

DH has had a few gaps between jobs while on gardening leave, and a gap between two freelance projects while ours were small.

He has alway viewed it as his chance to really give me a break, let me catch up on sleep, to try out a different tactic with getting DS2 to settle when he was younger.

Your DH needs to view this month as his chance to learn how to settle your child so that he can take his full 50/50 responsibility.
And you need to view this month as your chance to get some proper sleep and get your health back.

I'm actually mouth open at the fact that he will, having had a good night's sleep - leave you to get up with your DS when you've had such a broken night.

Can he really not see how utterly selfish that is?

Yep I agree lots of different issues here.

1- is your sleep and the lack of. If what works for you to get some rest is some lie in, then DH should be giving you that. No discussion

2- time for yourself. If he gets to have time off with his friends then so do you. If your time off is time awaay from ds BUT at home, then DH takes his son out for the afternoon/day (whatever works for your dc at the mo)

3- time for your DH and his ds to bond. I have an issue with the 'But I can't settle him argument'. I think atm he has no idea how tiring it is to look after a child who also has exzema and will be grumpy. Let him do that on his own for a bit.

4- when do yu ever have a break? Your ds is nearly a year old. Yes he is bfed but he will be lasting longer wo a bf and you should be able to get a 'holiday' too, one where your DH will do everything apart from bfing (and let's say the night atm). You REALLY need to look after yourself. Tell your DH that actually during these 4 weeks, you WILL go out and do xxx and he WILL look afer his ds. Or you WILL rest and do xx in the house whilst he WILL look after ds on his own.
Don't fall for the 'But I need a holiday'. If needs one, then you ought to have one too!

Just going to comment on the eczema issue here because my eldest suffered terribly! Have you looked at possible food intolerances? By process of elimination I found out that my boy's eczema flared horribly when he had pear of all things I was gaily shovelling in lovingly homemade pureed pear and the poor little chap ended up looking like he had 3rd degree burns!! It takes time to whittle it down but might be worth a try. I also did away with all the creams and just slathered him with petroleum jelly (Boots own, not Vaseline as too thick) after his bath and this soothed his eczema beautifully. The fun part was keeping him away from soft furnishings until it had soaked into his skin a bit Worth a try as there's nothing worse than seeing them scratch themselves silly - I fully sympathise

So you never ever get a full night's sleep. Your H gets a full night's sleep every night. And your H considers that fair? So fair, in fact, that he deserves lie-ins?? WTF?

The only way it would be fair would be if he were doing equal numbers of night wakings.

He is being a lazy git.

I had a constant waker and by the end of the first year as not in a good way through lack of sleep. DP knew this and gave me every lie in every weekend, without question. I'd have been murderous without it.

He doesn't need lie-ins, they are a luxury with a young baby, you need your full quota of sleep to function, without the added worry of depression and panic attacks.

I would use the time constructively for DP and DS to get used to each other with him learning how to settle DS at night - he is his father and throwing the baby at you in frustration isn't the way forward. Once he has done it a few times he'll appreciate the lie in.

I don't think you should focus too much on the amount of breast milk your Ds is taking. At 11 months he should be getting a reasonable amount of nutrition from solids. None of my DC ever had a bottle, but managed a feeder cup easily by about 10 months. They tended to only have a morning and evening breast feed at that age.
Have you tried the cot with one side removed, wedged tight up against the side of the bed, sheet tucked over both mattresses? DC is close to you, but not at risk of being squashed. Maybe he gets too hot in bed beside you and this makes the itching worse?

My DD had chronic excema from birth - hers was environment-triggered and we lived in the desert at the time. It cleared up when we can back to the UK away from dust/heat/aircon. We found a humidifier in her room helped enormously and also only cotton on her skin/non bio detergents. You are regularly seeing the GP so prob already have tried everything but thought it worth a mention.

DD grew out of it thank god. We used steroids for a long time and constant antibiotics due to the infections caused by broken skin

Agree with Pp - your DH doesn't NEED a lie in, you do need a rest. He needs to revisit his holiday plans and set himself the objective of alleviating things for you for the duration. At least he should do the earlies, he's on leave so can nap later as part of his downtime

I astonished at some of the posts on this thread. OP I think your husband is despicably selfish and I think you have a mountain to climb if you want him to be considerate of your needs. Sorry.

Your H needs a good kick in the cock. You are on your knees with exhaustion and the selfish, lazy fucker is ying in bedreading while you, having had a broken night, are doing childcare and housework? And then he goes out with his mates, leaving you with more housework and childcare? When do you get any time off?
Tell him he needs to start pulling his weight, or the marriage is over. While he is off work, he needs to be giving you two afternoons a week as well as four lie-ins to three. You are the one having the disturbed nights so at present your needs take priority over his.

I've had three non-sleepers. The oldest is now nearly 5 and the youngest is now 6 months. I've not had a single full-night's sleep in all those 5 years. Consequently, my H, who works full time, has done every single early morning get-up in those 5 years, bar a couple for his birthday, Father's Day etc.

He tells me when I start getting a full night's sleep I can alternate the earlies with him. But until then he'll do them to at least give me an hour of uninterrupted sleep in the morning. Only till 7.45am ish, but that's not bad with three pre-schoolers.

I thank him every morning for getting up, and he thanks me for doing the nightshift. You've just got to be kind in these circumstances, but I don't think your H is being kind to you.

It is often said on MN that (usually in the event of a split) that the parent does not have 'rights' only the child does.

This is the policy I have with our little ones, that although I do the majority of night duties - esp with our 6m DD as she is waking for a breastfeed which clearly DH cannot do - but also with our 2yr old as they both generally want mummy when they are tired/sad/hungry/whatever. DD1 was terrible with cradle cap & eczema for a while but seems to have mostly grown out of it.

My DH is happy to take his turn but in reality everyone is happier when mummy is in the chair. DH is much more involved with the older one now that his non-boobs are no longer a barrier but I will never let either lass cry for mummy just because it's his turn.

And I get the sleep thing, DD1 has still never quite gone through the night and sh'e nearly 2.5 yrs old... when that little voice in my head says 'will you PLEASE just SLEEP' I always think - in a few years time I'll look back on that night of gazing adoringly if exhaustedly at their little sleeping faces and wish for that time back.

I wish you every drop of joy from your angel. Whatever time of night he chooses to bestow it.

It's often what a child is eating that gives him eczema, tomatoes, red grapes, wheat, foods with dairy etc. Using creams is like a bandaid, far better to find the cause. Keeping a list of what food DS has eaten that day and seeing how much worse the eczema is after certain foods. It doesn't take long for it to flare up, sometimes only hours, so it's not too hard. Breastfeeding is probably the best thing to do for your DS, putting him on formula could make the eczema worse.

Using oats, bicarbonate of soda and olive oil in the bath will give your DS relief from the itching, it is very soothing. I have used this and it really does work, when creams and lotions made no difference to the constant itching. It is so much safer to use natural ingredients than putting chemicals on a baby.

One more thing, what you eat could affect a breastfed baby.

DH is someone who is very "fair" about splitting responsibility

Well that's good. He should see, then, that if you're doing all the night wakings, something during the day needs to be balanced in your favour in order to be 'fair' (i.e. more sleep ins, naps, time for yourself).

You feel broken from a year of sleep deprivation and he talking about enjoy his 'holiday'. Nothing fair in that.

Just a thought, in case it's not been mentioned, as I understood it, if breastfeeding you shouldn't eat the things that trigger his eczema either? Feel free to correct me if I am wrong though.

He needs to pull his weight not pass off out with mates and not lie in bed reading if your getting such disturbed sleep. Please put your foot down now before it ends up being a massive issue that breaks you completely.

An Un mumsnetty hug xxx

Piss not pass argh fail

.We've tried it, and it didn't work. Ended with DH bringing DS in and almost throwing him at me before going back to bed

If he is choosing not to persevere and work at settling your DS, fine, but fewer lie ins.

Thanks everyone. It's good to get some different perspectives. DH is normally great, and really supportive, so I wasn't sure whether I was just being unreasonable in this case, and didn't want to approach him without getting some thoughts from other, more awake, people. I'll try talking to him when he gets home later. The importance of rest and sleep just seen to be concepts he's not familiar with!

Thanks for the eczema tips too. We're currently looking at diet, and trying to eliminate different things in turn. No success so far though. I'm hoping he outgrows it!

Hmm, I think he is familiar with them for himself or he wouldn't have been so keen to establish what his holiday lie-in entitlement would be! Perhaps you've been a victim of your own success and he sees you as superwoman who can cope with anything (you've lasted very well under pressure for a long time). But hope all goes well when you talk about it. FWIW I would talk in terms of your needs 'I need extra sleep.. how can we make that work?' rather than asking permission 'could I possibly have extra lie-ins?' Good luck.

re children that don't sleep. For me, one trip to cranial osteopath was the route to my salvation, from the first visit onwards my 3 year old who had never slept a single night, SLEPT THROUGH THE NIGHT.
This, I was told, is achieved by massaging the skull, & is best done right from the start (obviously) with some babies.
I know you have the eczema issue too, but just thought I'd mention it.

Maybe he could quit his job, and his new occupation could be looking after the child, while you go to work?

I'm sure he'd accept spending all day with his beloved child rather than grinding away in an office for ten hours a day plus commute.

Or is that not fair?

He is more than familiar with the importance of sleep and rest, for himself!

to the PP saying "my DH is happy to take his turn but in reality everyone is happier when mummy is in the chair. DH is much more involved with the older one". Sexist, 1950s twaddle!