Is there any way I can help my parents?

[ObeseDenise]

My parents are extremely unhappy together.

My dad is a very active and on the ball 70, my mum is 57.

Ever since I was a teenager I've wondered how and why they got together. They don't communicate. Sometimes weeks go by without them talking. My mum hates talking openly and will do anything to avoid it. My Dad is as stubborn as anyone I've ever met so he just stops talking and resorts to monosyllabic grunts.

They want different things from life. My Dad is semi retired and wants to travel more and visit his kids and grandkids (we all live in different parts of the world). My mum works full time and enjoys it but uses her holiday allowance in the way that she wants and won't consider going anywhere new or taking unpaid days to have more holidays. They are very comfortably off and she could easily take extra days/stop working altogether. She is also, imo, financially abusive to my Dad in that she has always controlled the money and is extremely tight. My Dad sometimes gets paid in cash for his work and he has taken to hiding it from her . I know he has allowed this to happen through his passivity but it is still abuse.

They are living in the same big house but completely separately. They don't eat together (my Dad has disordered eating and has lost stones and looks awful) and spend evenings in separate rooms and then sleep in separate beds (something I realised when I visited home and my mum had obviously using a different bedroom).

They both ring me and bitch about each other. My Dad is (I think) depressed. He is worried he'll die soon or become unable to travel and feels that his life is slipping out of his hands. He is acutely aware of the limited years of activity he has left. My mum doesn't care about this and talks about when she retires not acknowledging that my dad is so much older than her.

My mum is also depressed and is drinking too much. This was confirmed when I picked them up from the airport at 8am one morning and she was hungover/still drunk and made a show of herself.

They would be better apart but for numerous reasons I know this will never happen (financial reasons, keeping up appearances reasons, inability to communicate at all reasons). I have told them bluntly that I think they should split but when I have they backtrack or change the subject.

In he meantime I (and my siblings but mostly me) am stuck in the middle seeing them both miserable but unable to do anything. I love them both and hate seeing them so entrenched in a miserable existence .

Do I just keep providing the sympathetic ear? It's so hard to do so .

It sounds as though she does have full control of the money, or the money she knows about, Bathtime. You seem to have taken against the OP for preferring her father, believing him to be abusive towards her mother. Why is that?

He should gather a share of the finances and do what he wants to do in the final years of his life. Their lives will evolve on the back of this, but let it be.

There are aren't there Browers?

My mum is lonely too I know she is. She is friends with her work colleagues but anything they do outside of work is based around wine which doesn't usually work out well for my mum.

In told her to suggest a cinema trip and she said she would but nothing came of it.

She loves cooking but my Dad has stopped eating in her presence so she is making easy small dinners just for her.

It's just all so bloody depressing .

I suppose I bridle when I read that a man has a "perfect right" to hide his money from his wife.

The OP read to me like someone was siding with one parent while pretending to be caught in the middle. Subsequent posts have only confirmed that.

I think that it's interesting that someone is so critical of her low earning mother for being in control of the family finances when she is married to a man who was self-employed and has probably been hiding money for years.

I think that a child who sides so much with one parent that they are conspiring with them to deprive the other of assets in their old age might not be entirely objective on the realities of their parents' relationship.

But sure don't mind me. I'm just a gobshite. A law unto myself, you might say.

Don't let it depress you! Does she like gardening or is there anything else she might like? Work hard to make sure that they don't bring you down because there is little you can do and you can't make yourself miserable over it.

In the long run they have to live their own lives. I get it that your dad won't leave for his own reasons and it is sad but you can't wreck your life over the head of it.

I have been in your shoes and know its very hard. For some reason mine just gave up the fight and get on ok now. It can still flare up now and then but we have all managed to not let it pain us and just wait until it subsides.

This is just straight financial abuse, (whatever BF says - if it were your mother who had worked hard for 50 years, your father who worked in a low paid job, kept the bankcards & spent money on himself - I would say exactly the same).

I'm concerned that the not eating in her presence is a psychological reaction to her over-domination of him. It's not impossible for men to get anorexia, and it's not uncommon for older people to get it either.

Whatever, he's clearly in a very bad way. I can understand why he would be afraid to get ill, because if she isn't looking after him now, why would she if he got ill?

Your mum is actually your dad's mental health & potentially his physical health too if he doesn't start eating.

I'm concerned that the not eating in her presence is a psychological reaction to her over-domination of him.

I'm concerned that it's his way of taking away one of the few pleasures in her life.

I'm not sure keeping someone's bank cards counts as financial abuse if you give them back whenever they want them.

If he has a secret bank account and a massive stash of cash, he has got access to money and is choosing not to spend it.

It's just as well given the financial control she has over him.

If a woman was being controlled as much as OP's dad is, wouldn't think her wise to have her own stash and use it to get free?

Twinklestein, that is a really interesting point: "I'm concerned that the not eating in her presence is a psychological reaction to her over-domination of him."

I rebelled against my wildly overcontrolling, critical, alcoholic father by fixing my own meals (salad leaves) and refusing to eat dinner with him... I definitely had a borderline eating disorder as a teen that lasted into my 20s. The OP's father may be rebelling, too, by seizing what control he still can...

Twinkle your post makes a lot of sense to me. Thank you.

I raised the subject with my dad on Friday and he said he was trying to keep himself in good nick (he had a missed MI and quadruple bypass 10 years ago) so that he can be around for his grandkids. Which would be fine if he were eating lean meat and lots of fruit and veg but instead he eats bread all morning and nothing after lunch time. Absolutely nothing from 1pm till 5am the next day.

It worries me because he looks very skinny and unwell.

BF, yes I took away my father's pleasure in berating me across the dining room table every evening! I'm sure he missed that delicious opportunity to critique my hair, face, clothes, attitude and manners!!

OP - I think you should encourage your dad to use that money to get away.
Perhaps he could buy a flat in a retirement village where he could be looked after? Some guys of his generation aren't so good at looking after themselves, and he's clearly not eating enough - and may have mental health issues in that area too.

I'm not a lawyer, but my guess is that a) the money will inevitably come to light and b) it will then form part of the inheritance pot and will go to your mum unless your dad writes a will specifically leaving it to you and your siblings.

Eden your post rings true as well .

I would suggest that you insist that your Dad diverts his pension or anything in his sole name to this other bank account she doesn't know about. There is nothing she could do about it, he could then choose to hand over some of it to her or not.

Would they have enough equity for them to sell up and live separately without divorcing? Perhaps your Dad would be happier in a retirement apartment?

OP, now I really fear for your Dad. Could you get him to see his GP about the weight loss? He sounds like he's starving himself...

They have plenty of equity.

Their valuable home has been paid off for years. They have a holiday property in Spain which is paid off as well.

My Dad would love to move abroad. That has always been his dream. And it's something that I've encouraged him to do.

I've told both of them to sell the house and buy a small flat at home where my mum can live and a property abroad where.my dad can live and then split the time between the two however they want. They seem to think it's a great idea at the time but then it fizzles out into nothing.

I honestly think that my muma biggest fear is the neighbours and the people in her town gossiping about them if they did split. Which is a fucking terrible reason to stay together.

xpost with OP - his eating sounds so disordered that he needs to go to the doctor. But I can well imagine the difficulty/impossibility to get your dad to the GP to talk about his eating.

Would it be possible to go to your dad's GP and share your concerns? They can't give out any private info about your dad, but you can share info with them.

It might be possible for the GP then to do a drop in home visit to assess him.

I am sorry to hear that OP. Yeah is always about the neighbours isn't it? As if the neighbours were saints themselves. Would you be able to bring the topic up again?

You see before you bring it up could you get some brochures to show them real options.

We tried to encourage our folks to do this but dad refused point blank to move and mum wouldn't leave on her own. Your mum might welcome the idea of having her own place. It can't be good for her either living in this atmosphere. It would be wonderful if your dad could live abroad. It would give him a new lease of life and he could eat yummy healthy food.

Have you siblings who can help you or is it all left to you?

Theoretically your solution of splitting time between the two properties would be ideal - if your dad was ok. But - in the circumstances - would he be able to look after himself on his own in Spain? He may well continue his disordered eating away from your mum now he's got into the pattern of it.

Can you support your dad to travel solo? There are loads of good travel companies for older travellers.My mum uses company that does all the logistics door to door and she has now travelled further than I have.Perhaps time alone will enable them to seek solutions. You can't fix them, they need to resolve it themselves.

Twinkle I genuinely believe he'd be happy in a new life that he had chosen.

We have talked extensively about what he would want from relocation and I've urged him not to romanticise it too much and mistakenly think it will be the magic solution to all his problems. It's the same country where their holiday place is. He doesn't want to live in a touristy coastal place. He wants to buy a townhouse or cottage inland and merse himself fully in the community and culture. He speaks the language conversationally and is learning more via his PC.

I think that rather than a formal separation it would be easier for them to just spend time in different places. That way there wouldn't be so much resentment and bitterness between them.

They're in Ireland. I'm in England. My 3 siblings are further away than me. It's hard to help when I can only talk on the phone but I'm overdue a trip home with the DC so will book flights soon.

I have longstanding issues with my mother based on her not great parenting but I love both my parents and want them to be happy and the thought of them spending the next 10 years in this same misery as now pains me greatly.

Thank you for all your valuable advice.

Can you go with your dad to make a will, that way he can leave his money to whoever he wants without the threat of your mum getting it. That also takes away her reason for staying to a large extent, and takes you out of the middle of this shitfest.

For the eating disorder, he needs information about how to feed himself really. I suspect meal times are absolutely grim when its the two of them so he has chosen to remove himself, but without the necessary knowledge to take care of himself.

Do any of you have the time available to help him buy a house in Spain? And to see it through from beginning to end? You might want to check the inheritance laws in Spain. I know they changed recently but better to be wise before hand.

Get himself to open a couple of bank accounts - a savings account and a current account and to keep a bit in it. Change where his money is paid into for his pension etc. The dynamic needs to change, even if it is not all in one go, but for me the number one thing here is the will.

It woudl also be worth checking out the health service in Spain to see what he is covered for. I know your siblings are not close by but lean on them for support, this shouldn't all be left to you. They need to get involved too.

Can you go with your dad to make a will, that way he can leave his money to whoever he wants without the threat of your mum getting it

Yeah, make your mother impoverished in old age in Ireland. The silly bitch with her low paid job and buying stuff for herself.

How dare she imagine that a lifetime of marriage would mean she got a share of the family income?

What an entitled bitch!

Electra, is that you?
You don't like your mum. You do like your dad.
I recommend you butt out of their marriage. You don't know what your mum might have been through.
Put another way - your parents are adults. If they're broken, its not in your gift to fix them. That hurts but you have to live with it.