DH wants to separaye "slowly"

[torontonian]

Together for 5.5 years, DS is two years old, baby girl due day after tomorrow. We have been walking on thin ice for some time (some background here: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2284438-Dont-know-what-to-think-feeling-bad). Went back to sleep in the same bed, talk sometimes but we go in a loop, nothing resolved.

A week ago I asked him if he loved me so we could start the conversation of fixing or breaking our relationship. For him, the starting point was to make the decision and talk about feelings after, so we couldn't agree on a start and we didn't talk at all.
Last night he told me that he wanted to separate but he was shocked (his own words) that I was asking him to leave until we sorted out at least the housing. We don't have a spare room and my mother is staying in the living room. She came from abroad for 3 months to help us with new baby. "He didn't think that things would move on so fast and now that I am going to have a baby it was not a good time to leave. Who would drive me to hospital, etc". He said he wants to help me with the baby (he reaffirms that this comment is not sexist) and be part of our DS's life. We had previously talked about living arrangements for DS: he would spend 2 weeks with each of us, so I don't know how this part fits in the conversation. Apparently he has also asked for two weeks off already (for the birth) and what would he do, play videogames? (again his own words)

Anyway, this delayed separation concept got me really confused, I have a bit of a cold, I am 39 weeks pregnant and it was past 11pm, so I asked him if he wanted to save the relationship. He said that he didn't think that it was salvageable but that he would love to.
I kept thinking about it for a few minutes and started doubting why I had asked that. I am still thinking if that is what I want myself. I asked him what his reason for trying was and the answer was "it is the right thing to do", meaning that we have kids and can't quite remember what else he said.

This is not the first time that we talked about separation, but I wonder what the trigger was this time. He made me go for lunch with his new boss on Friday (I was clear that I didn't feel like it at all and he was quite upset that "I didn't want to meet somebody he is going to spent a lot of time with"). Then, Saturday night he is telling me about what I understand as a decision to separate and not a conversation about what we are going to do. That was strange for me and also asked about it. That is when I got the "I didn't think it would move so fast" answer.

I can't think of any direct questions, just wanted to share and see if some of you can bring some thoughts into the situation. I always like to see different perspectives.

So it looks like your dh is having an affair with this woman from play group but they are not ready to live together yet? He also doesn't want to look like a complete cunt.

Why does he get to dictate the terms of the split? He says you're over so you're over. Don't let him mess you around like this.

I think at 39 pg you really need to put yourself first. For your sake and your baby's.

So what do you want to happen OP?

Can you let everything go on the back burner until after you're recovered from the birth? Would you feel okay for him to be at the birth/looking after you afterwards (why is your DM there?)

Or would you feel more comfortable if he moved out and just cam back to look after DC1 while you and your dm focus on birth/baby?

Forget his feelings, focus on what you want.

Yes totally agree that you at 39 weeks pg with a toddler is the priority here
Fuck him, concentrate on what you NEED at this moment in time
You don't know how you feel because it's a crazy time to go through this right now
So work out the practicalities first and then let your feelings come to the fore when they do.
Can you rely on your dm a lot? If you need him to give you a lift to hospital good tick that off
If you don't want him at the birth tick that off
If you need him to come for two lots of two hours a day to your place tick that off
Always remember things will change daily or weekly and tell him that
Involve your midwife and hv if you want
It does not matter one jot what he wants please do the right thing for you and your baby's health and wellbeing and do what you need to do
Tell him ok take it at your pace

Separate at his pace? So everything suits him? When you're about to give birth? What did he expect? That you'd just say, ok darling, yes you're having fun shagging someone else and I'm about to have our child but yes, let's make sure you're all a ok, don't you worry about me....

Hell no. Kick him the fuck out and focus on YOU and your kids. You've got your mum there to help you.

He's made his choice. It's all about him isn't it? Staggeringly self absorbed. Probably playing the "I'm such a good man I didn't want to leave her with a baby" card with his mates as well. Urgh.

Tell him to go. You have your mum there with you and as for getting to hospital you can use a taxi or ask a neighbour to take you.

Thank you all for your responses. DD is now 12 days old. I was scared to be alone during delivery. He was there and was helpful. Delivery took 3h anyway and he let for 6h afterwards. Was sleeping for a lot of the time he was there so I didn't get any rest. I felt deeply sad and unsupported.
DH took a week off work, we focused on DS jealousy, tried to spend time with him.
More arguments followed, I asked him to leave, he packed and I suddenly felt down in the dumps and begged him to stay and help me with the kids.
This week DH is back to work and daycare called because DS had diarrhea so I needed to go pick him up and DS stayed home sick for two days. It was very challenging.
I asked DH if he wanted to fix things and he agreed. We talked about needs and feelings, but his mind changes everyday. Today he is asking me for a separation day. He has also removed his ring.
At this moment I am heartbroken. I thought I was ready but I feel I want us to work. I have asked about counselLing but he says there is no way this is going to work. Also some hurtful things as "I prefer to go to the dentist than come home" or "the only thing I can think of is the day we are separating".
I am totally depressed. Have been crying for the last day and can't stop. I don't want to give up, I would like to find a magic potion that to us back in time.
he is talking about compromise all the time. Apparently his problems are:

• Our basement. He has a desk there but the rest of the bsement is used for storage and it is a mess. We moved when I was 7 months pregnant with DS and never got to set the house properly (I am still working in the bedrooms).
• I am an introvert. We have been together 6 years. Before kids he would finish work and it was "us time". Went for walks, dinner outside, I found new places to go the weekends, we played board games... after kids we haven't had alone time except for a couple of movies at the theatre when grandparents were here. He has not tried for more. When he is hone he is whether in the basement or listening to some audio book. And while neglecting us completely now he needs to go out twice a week with friends. He is fine with me going out the same amount. I feel like a baby sitter arrangement since there is never plans to spend time together. Mind you he is freelance and he meets for coffee and lunch with friends all the time during the workday plus the night out with the daycare parents once a month, plus the pizza Fridays, plus... he still needs more social interaction, specifically at nights.
• I asked her mother to leave our house. There is a lot of back story with PIL but that day MIL asked me if I knew how much my house costs. That in a tone meant to be very offensive, not asking for info of the real estate market. Mind you I work FT, make about the same as DH and supported him when and after he closed his company. (And what if not!?) All that despite "being an immigrant", "a girl from a provinces town", "from a town where we don't even have water (rain)" (as if that was also my fault). Anyway this is a big point for him. But his parents leaving our house angry when he told them we were married (and this happened after kid #1) or us leaving theirs because they had a fight I can't be told about are not as bad as what I did. Can't compare in his opinion. This point makes me feel specially disrespected.

So these are some things that he lists as reasons. And looks like the compromise is get the basement sorted to his taste (that includes throwing away "my things" (sofa and cabinet) because he hates them and him going out at night twice a week.

I don't think I can compromise with the latter. I have nobody here to help or even talk. Made a a couple of acquaintances and the daycare mums but they are not close friends. I feel isolated now that I am on mat leave I don't even get to talk to people in the office. He is not with me when he is home. He counts shopping time (ikea, grocery, hardware store) as our time together. Moreover English is my second language and that doesn't help with developing deeper connections (in my personal case).
I can't change how his parents treat me, and I can't shut up when they offend me directly. About socializing I can try but I don't feel comfortable. I usually understand 75% of the conversation, sometimes I find people laughing and I need to guess it was a joke but have no clue what they laugh about. Besides that the more I give the more DH wants and I just don't feel good with the same amount.
and about nights out it hurts me he needs it so badly as to break up but he doesn't need me as much.
Just lots of unconnected thoughts after a sleepless night...
I want us to be happy together but it looks like he doesn't anymore. I am heartbroken and don't know how I will get out. I moved to Canada for him. Now I have two kids and can't move back. I feel trapped in this country, far from home and completely alone.

He has made his position very clear, and everything you have said screams that you should waste not once second more on this cruel and selfish person than you have: prolonging this is trapping you further.

A happy relationship would be the "base camp" from which you could explore friendships and work and possibilities. As it is you are looking to someone who does not care about you to fill the social gap they are widening by undermining your confidence and refusing to do things with you. When you stop relying on him (and having him let you down) you may find you are more able to cope, and build a life, than you imagine.

Sending love and strength

In your position I would go back home for a break. It must be a nightmare living there. Just because you are married to him it doesn't mean you can't spend time back home with your family.

I would tell him you feel you have post natal depression coming on as a result of his behaviour and that you need the comfort and warmth of your own family for the time being. Then go.

OMG....that sounds awful. I feel guilty listing my 'problems' here after reading your story....how terrible. I am so sorry for your situation. xxxx

When I say that I feel trapped in this country I mean that I can't just revert time 5 years and move back home and start afresh. Vacation could be the best idea right now but at this moment I don't think he would let me take the kids with me. Leaving them here is not an option specially the newborn who is breastfed. And it would depress me even more to be apart from them.
it was a crappy day overall. Just saw him to say good morning and my messages were mostly ignored (we usually chat during the day). Finally we were able to rak shortly thia morning and I asked if he was willing to come to counselling. His response is that he doesnt think is going to work. But after insisting on a clear answrr he said he was willing to come AND try.
Then, few hours later we had these lines:

Me: are you available?
Him: what do you need?
me: I would like to call you
him: what do you need?
Me: Just hear you
Him: no I am not available
me: I think you are being harsh to me
him: maybe

----
Me: I need support and you are just mean to me
him: well this is where things are confusing. because what I need I don’t get. and now it’s too late for all that. yes I can talk to you as a friend. But don't get confused.

After insisting him to call me he did. We talked for about half an hour. I know he is at work and I should not bother him but I feel I am been played with. Then in the call he tells me we ate not together. I can't understand the counselling shit then. Moreover he has been trying to book another counselor that a friend recommended... I am totally puzzled. He says that there is no commitment. That I need to change and he doesn't think I am going to. But he is telling me he is coming to couples counselling and he even made the effort to find one. I'm confused.

I want to work on this. I don't know what he wants. I don't know if he knows what he wants. Basically I heat we are done but he is coming to counselling (maybe to make me a favour). Counselling is to make me compromise but not him since he has been compromising for 5 years...
I know I look stupid and I am just digging my own hole. He is still home and we share the bed (nothing else). He will hug me if I ask for it.
I have tried to look for some mom's groups and divorce support meet ups since I need to share some of my tears and I don't have anybody close to open to. I don't think I will end up going because DD is still so young and I don't even know where to start with strangers. Most of the divorce groups meet at night for drinks and I can't do that. Mom's groups might be a better option just to get distracted.

Personally..He doesn't give a dam..

I think you need to make plans for as a lone parent...These are supposed to be happy days although exhausting, emotional and hormonal for you..

You deserve far better than this..Kick him to the curb..Use your mum for support and figure out a way forward with her.. not with someone who does not have your interests at heart.

Congratulations on your DD

Thank you starlight. DM has her own MY issues after 20 + years of abuse from my father and I am a nerve wreck. She made up that I kicked her out yesterday and has been in her room all day. I don't have the energy to deal with more. She is leaving in 1.5 months back to my home country. I am the only one here, no more family lives less than 6500 km away.
DH is now home. He keeps putting me down but at least accepts to talk when kids go to bed. I don't know how to approach the conversation about counseling without getting more hurt.
He is behaving like a prick, completely disregarding my feelings "so nice to see you DS. Mom? No, not really". He served DS a huge piece of meat (DS is 2y.o., doesn't use a knive) but I can't say anything because "I am so controlling and he doesn't give a shit".
I know I should send him faraway, don't take more disrespect. But I am trying to talk to fix this. Just finding a wall in front of me. Don't want to give up.

I don't know what he wants. I don't know if he knows what he want

Sweetheart he is telling you loud and clear through his words and his actions. There is nothing to be confused about. Talking won't fix it. He is a callous, spiteful, selfish and unfaithful person. Life without him cannot possibly be worse than life with him. The sooner you end this the better for all of you.

He is playing with your mind. Cruel bastard. Tell him it's over, no counselling, get him to leave. Go back to your birth? country and seek comfort.

Being on your own even with a baby will be so much easier than being with him. Honestly.

He is seriously emotionally abusive.

Please don't beg him to stay and abuse you more. He is lapping it up and using it to be even worse to you

He sounds incredibly toxic. Don't let him totally break you down.

Being on your own even with a baby will be so much easier than being with him
I saw that with my ex. Not the same situation but I'd separated before I knew I was pregnant with my only child. One day he was visiting when dd was ten days old and I asked to help fold her clean clothes and he refused because it was woman's work, then I realised how he could have ruined all the pleasure I normally had doing things for my dd. Not the same situation at all, but newborn babies are such a delight, but being in a bad relationship manages to ruin it all and take all the enjoyment out of this miraculous occasion.

My husband was so cruel to me when we had our second child and i cannot tell you how much I regret not telling him to F* off then. But I couldn't living in a strange country no home back in UK to come back to, 2 children under 2 had a c section and had been really ill I just didn't have the strength.

Honestly it was a mistake not to find that strength from somewhere.

I am not a LTB person really but why waste your life with a person like that?

My friend said to me just because he's not punching you doesn't mean he's not punching you. These emotionally abusive men just make you more confused as it's not so black and white maybe as other people but they are horrible cruel bastards!!