No sex - is this really marriage?

[AdaSue]

I have changed identities for this for obvious reasons, but am a regular.

DH and I have been together for over 20 years; married for 15. We have DC aged 12 and 14.

We have had a few problems, not least as one DC is autistic. I gave up work to look after the DC (my choice - not sure how we would have managed if I hadn't wanted to be a SAHM, but luckily I did, and I could).
DH works from home.

I love being a SAHM, and am happiest when with the DC (difficult though autistic DC is). DH finds them loud, messy and a bit annoying, and is often irritable. He thinks I undermine him (true - I know I shouldn't); I think he's unnecessarily controlling and grumpy (also true), and I hate him shouting at the DC. We have had years of low-grade niggles like this which have, I think, ground us both down. We don't row as neither of us is the rowing type. DH is more likely to sink into navel-gazing depression, and I am more likely to shove stuff to the back of my mind and dredge it up 100 years after the event.

Despite the above, we basically get on ok. We haven't shared a bedroom for six years - originally because he snores and rummages around in his sleep, which meant I was being constantly woken up. However, I would not want to share a room with him even if he didn't snore, as I like my space.

To cut a very long story short, we haven't had sex for well over a year. It's not that I don't have the urge to have sex; I just don't have the urge to have it with him. At all. This hasn't always been the case; we used to fancy one another like mad. I don't know how he feels as I don't want to mention it. I fear that if I mention it, he might want it - and that's the last thing I want.

We are not even physically affectionate with one another. I'm not a very cuddly person, but DH is - so I feel awful that he's not getting at least any affection. But after so many years of very low-grade misery, I can't bring myself to act in a loving way with him. I do have a male friend whom I'm affectionate with, though it is a strictly platonic friendship.

DH and I are never grumpy with one another in front of the DC, even though we're not affectionate either. We're just like housemates. Part of me wants to leave (if I could afford to), but another part of me thinks that I made my bed and now have to lie in it, however uncomfortable it might be.

Is is really feasible to live like this long-term? I am a bit sick of being in my own head, and can't talk to anyone in RL as they all know DH. Could anyone please talk to me who has either stuck with this kind of relationship, or who has left one like it?

(Another name-changing regular)

I've been married for 20 years, and also have 2 DCs, one of whom is autistic.
DH and I haven't slept in the same bed for months due to his health problems.

He suffers from ED which he has been prescribed medication for with some effect until he started on antidepressants and his libido disappeared. He is unable to achieve orgasm by any means, including masturbation.

However, whilst there is no sleeping together and no sex, there is still some displays of affection, not having that would be the end for me.

We do talk about it though, that's important for us. I'm unsure how long you can go on without talking about this.

AdaSue - I left two relationships because of the lack of sex - or, more specifically, I knew that the kind of sex life I wanted I was not going to get in those relationships. Yes, there were other issues too, but sex was a significant one.

I couldn't think of the amount of self-denial it would take to continue in something that is not only not working for you, but also causing you to shut down. And that's not selfish; self-denial has an impact on the relationship too.

Sex is important in and of itself, but also because it is inextricably bound up with intimacy - with yourself and with your partner, and with life itself. If it didn't matter to you, I'd say keep not doing what you're not doing. But it does. And you matter. And you have the power to change things.

Oh dear - I think this must be affecting me more than I realise, as both these replies made me feel teary. I was half expecting a roasting for being a crap / selfish person.

I did try to start a conversation about what had gone wrong. DH was very nice about it, and said he would try to be less gloomy. He has been more cheerful for the past week or so, since we had the tiny bit of conversation - but I feel as if 15 years of accumulated minor unhappiness isn't going to be put right by a week or even a year of DH being more cheerful. And that's not to say it's all his fault - I know he resents me putting the DC ahead of him. I just feel sad that we are in this position of emotional estrangement, because we once loved one another so much.

Have you heard of the work of Esther Perel, Ada? That might be a good place to start. She is a relationship therapist who specialises in infidelity and in sexless marriages. She has a book that you may well find interesting:

Mating in Captivity

She also has a Ted Talk called The Secret to Desire in a Long Term Relationship, which is fabulous.

Both are food for thought.

I hadn't heard of her, so thanks for that. I think I could possibly live without the sex if we were affectionate towards one another. What really scares me is that I don't even want him near me, and haven't done for a long time.

Ask yourself how you would feel if DH found sex, affection elsewhere. Would you be able to shrug it off or would you be horribly jealous?

Measles - I have asked myself precisely that. 15 years ago, I would have been absolutely devastated. Now, I am very sad to realise that a) I wouldn't blame him in the slightest, given the lack of it at home, and b) I wouldn't care. In a way, it would be a relief as it would mean we actually had to confront our problems. We both know that infidelity is a deal-breaker, and neither of us has ever been unfaithful. I would like to say that this is because we are very 'moral' - but in my case at any rate, I think it is partly due to the opportunity never having presented itself.

I think we are too scared to talk about it because at some level we know that it is a symptom of a (probably) terminally flawed relationship.

Well the opportunity may arise for one of you I am afraid. It is how you deal with it that is important. DH appears to be burying his head in the sand for the moment. Your little chat has buoyed him up temporarily how long that effect will last is debatable. He may well when he realises that the lack of sex seems permanent become resentful. But if you are not prepared for him to find comfort elsewhere, nor seek a solution yourself, you may be pushed into it.

I don't think sex is necessary it's an added bonus but should be born of love not lust. Or because you have an itch. There is more to a good marriage than the physical. It's about a connection being happy without the need for sex. That's just me though and my take on it has changed in the last ten years.

Measles - I think you are right. Sadly. I do have a very close male friend, as I mentioed in the OP. Nothing has remotely happened, but who knows what would happen if he gave even a hint of interest? I like to think I would say no, but I can't honestly guarantee it. In a way, it is a good thing that there is no risk of the situation arising.

I think you are spot on about the temporary buoying effect of our mini conversation. I would be quite happy for him to find comfort elsewhere, so long as I could too - though I don't think either of us could be happy with that. We are both people who need affection and sex from someone we are involved with emotionally - neither of us has ever had a one night stand, and he is only the second person I have ever slept with (the first was a long term boyfriend when I was 20). I think my real fear is that we aren't really emotionally involved with one another any more - hence the lack of physical affection - and I wonder how long we can go on like this.

Flabulous - I basically agree. But I still want to want to hold his hand or give him a hug.

He may not be satisfied with a hug. Try it and see. The other friend you speak of means the spark is not dead in you yet. I think this is telling.

Measles - sorry: I may not have been clear. I desperately wish I wanted to hug DH. But I don't want to touch him at all. I feel resentful and fed up with his inability to deal with the DC and his apparent conviction that I am the only one who can deal with DC's autism - which to my mind means just washing his hands of it all and acting like another child. I know the spark is still in me (my imagination tells me this regularly!) But it isn't there with DH. I don't know whether he feels the same. He certainly shows no interest, but this may be because he knows it won't be reciprocated...

It sounds like there are much more issues than a lack of sex. Would you both consider couples counselling to talk them through?

PrincessButtercup, I fear you are right. I would consider it, not least as I would then know that I had tried everything. DH might. I'm not sure. I think he has his head so far in the sand that he won't admit there's a problem. We did have our 'conversation', but I think he thinks everything is ok now...

Pardon me if this sounds rather blunt, but he's a crap parent, isn't he? Massive turn off. No wonder you don't want to go near him.

I think you owe it to both of yourselves to consider counselling, to see if there's anything that can be salvaged. Even if it's just "let's leave this relationship in an amicable way before one of us has an affair".

Ouch. But That's about the size of it, pocketsaviour. He wants so much to be a good parent, and is his own harshest critic on the score. But he says he just can't manage the two DC together or the autistic one alone. I think that if he really wanted to, he would find a way. He is an adult, and adults have to find ways to cope. What would happen if I just said: sorry, but I can't do this? He acts as if I find it easy. No I don't find it easy. Parenting is hard, and parenting a high-funtioning autistic child is extremely so. I now feel sweary, just thinking about how much this annoys me.

The therapist at CAMHS did also suggest counselling last time I saw her, as I told her some of this. I am quite keen. I think I need to let the dust settle a bit after our conversation, then bring it up as a possibility.

I think the lack of love you describe is a far bigger problem than the lack of sex. DH and I have not had sex for almost 5 years now. I miss it, but there are reasons for it - he has had multiple bereavements, problems with stress and alcohol misuse and right now he is on ADs and prostate medication so there is virtually no chance of his libido ever coming back.

I can live with it because we still love each other - we aren't perfect together but who is after 17 years? Mind you, we don't have the strain of an autistic DC to cope with, that must surely make things much harder for you both.

I don't think there are easy fixes, but you do come across as if you still care about your relationship, so it is not hopeless.