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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Finances - Mediation or Solicitors

15 replies

tryingtokeepintune · 09/05/2015 09:59

I am asking for a friend. Her DH has decided that after 25 years, it is over. He has met someone and left his job, the country and her, to be with this woman. There are no children in the house. Friend is devastated. Stbxh says he will not co-orperate if she consults solicitor about splitting the finances; he will only go to a mediator. Friend earns much less than he did, before he quit his job. She supported him while he retrained etc. However, Apparently, one of the things he said was that he was not her meal ticket for life...

So, will it make any difference to her financial future if she agrees to mediation instead. I have to say my friend is very passive and always gives in to him...

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Dowser · 09/05/2015 10:03

Then she needs a solicitor.

Definitely. She needs someone to fight her corner.

She can try mediatiation after a discussion with her solicitor. Then go back to solicitor and discuss what's on the table.

Normally you start with 50:50 split unless things are very unequally skewed

Dowser · 09/05/2015 10:04

This could be seen as desertion.

tryingtokeepintune · 09/05/2015 10:09

So a mediator won't necessarily be fighting her corner? Will the mediator tell her what she is legally entitled to?

Will it be desertion even if he came back to sell some of his stuff to finance his travel? He actually left stuff in the house and said he will be coming back in a couple of years to claim them.

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pocketsaviour · 09/05/2015 10:15

The mediator is there to try to reach an agreement between both parties. They are neutral.

I second the suggestion she should see a solicitor first, so she knows what her legal rights are, before agreeing to mediation.

tryingtokeepintune · 09/05/2015 10:30

Thanks for the advice. Will tell her.

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Dowser · 09/05/2015 11:50

Good luck to her.

He sounds like a right piece of work. He left stuff in the house and will be back to claim it?

Jeez! I hope she's moved on by then ! Entitled or what. Poor woman!

Someone needs to e plain to him that when he ends a marriage all marital rights cease.

Being his housekeeper and looking after his worldly goods being one of them.

I hope she takes these years, once she's over the upset to have an absolute ball, meet someone new and when little lord Fauntleroy turns up for his chattels

Tell him to shove it matey. Put his good in storage and send him the bill.

He's bullying her over a solicitor which is who she desperately needs one. I hope she hasn't been left destitute.

Why not tell her to post on here?

Dowser · 09/05/2015 12:01

Oh and in case she thinks she's on the scrap heap, I was 33 years married when my exh did a runner with another woman..

He went to the ME to live and work ( but returned to court for his share of the spoils. The judge decides who gets what, not him)

Do they own their own home? Is it mortgage free?

The judge awarded me the house as he had somewhere to live ( and also I was honest and upfront with all of my finances, while he was being an arse trying to hide money all over the place.)

He'd also run up a shed load of debt after he left and he got to keep that....thank gawd! No doubt one of his beer boozing cronies put him up to that.

The judges aren't daft. They have to be fair but they like the divorcing couple to play fair too.

WellWhoKnew · 09/05/2015 13:07

Hello, I think I'm suitably qualified to answer on this one too!

  1. She can see a solicitor for advice on what the process is, what she should look for in a settlement and never tell him that's she done that. She can keep seeing a solicitor for advice and not inform him until...the divorce goes massively wrong (as occasionally they can do) and it's all declared in the bank accounts (months if not years away from that). I strongly urge her to see a solicitor.

  2. She can engage (instruct) a solicitor. It will make no difference to his entitlements (or hers) but obviously, the costs of the solicitor will have to be paid for out of her settlement. So this option is very viable if there's enough to argue over and the cost of solicitors (and barristers) must be compared to what you stand to gain/lose. A simple divorce costs between 5K - 10K if you use a solicitor. All the way to final hearing in court (rare - less than 2% of divorces I've been told)...budget tens of thousands.

Most solicitors will tell you that they ensure a better outcome than someone who is self-litigating. It's up to you to form a conclusion on that (They say the only people who win in divorce are the lawyers!) All I can say is that I'm glad I did engage solicitors as I felt I had no other option, and yes despite the expense, they did ensure I got a much better outcome than what he was prepared to 'give'). I was ordered not to use them too...many times, but they really did shield me from some of the worst aspects of divorce when I felt too weak, insecure and terrified to defend myself.

  1. There are three ways to do a financial settlement (which is not the same as the divorce - the two bits are separate).

a) negotiation between the two of them then go to a solicitor to get a 'consent order' written up to send to court as part of the divorce. Cheap, amicable but See 1).

b) Mediate formally. This keeps things cooler and helps both understand the others' concerns. Cheaper than court. Mediators will inform both parties what might happen if they go to court (if mediation fails...) but they will not advise specifically.

c) Go to court. However you can't go to court unless you've attempted b)! Mediation is compulsory before you turn to the courts (except for a very small number of exclusions: read the small print).

As for the headache of belongings (chattels in legal speak). Nope, he can't decide to leave them there for years to come. Arrangements will need to be made as part of the divorce process. She can't just throw them out though...it's more complicated than that because it comes down to who owns/rents the house. A lawyer will explain it according to her circumstances...which are different for everyone. In divorce, there's very few hard and fast rules!

Desertion divorce means he must be gone for a minimum of two years (if he agrees) or five years (if he contests). The quickest routes to divorce are adultery (if he admits...) or unreasonable behaviour. At the moment, I'm betting she'll be horrified by the idea of divorce (I was!)...and so he'll end up divorcing her for UB...which is odd since it was him committing adultery. It is just the process though - and it's a shocking one.

I really do feel for your friend. I'm just over a year from this happening to me so don't hesitate recommending her to come here for some sympathy and support because there's a ton of people who have survived this horror and rebuilt their lives but it's one hell of a trauma to get through.

intlmanofmystery · 09/05/2015 20:40

Mediation is a cheaper and less confrontational way of sorting out a disagreement (in this case finances) however it is typically done in parallel and via consultation with a solicitor. However, and its a big however, both parties have to be willing to truly negotiate and be prepared to reach an agreement. The mediator will absolutely not take sides. In their eyes the reason for the breakup is irrelevant, they are there to resolve the dispute.

We tried mediation twice (with different mediators) but my exW refused to engage either time (and lied extensively about her finances) so we ended going down the hugely expensive legal route. It became needlessly confrontational but I think we got there in the end...

tryingtokeepintune · 10/05/2015 19:05

Hi. Sorry I was away and only just got a chance to check.

I have advised my friend to post here but she asked me to do it as a favour. However, I have advised her to at least read the various threads that might apply to her. She is still in shock and is worried about the future. She had thought they were going to grow old together etc.

Dowser - the house is mortgaged but there will be an endowment paid out in 2 years which will reduce the mortgage a little. She is on a low wage and has health problems so only works 4 days. He got rid of his assets like sports car and motor bike etc and is using the money to go travelling with his new gf.

WellWhoKnew - she saw a solicitor for one hour and was shocked by the cost and is seriously wondering if she can afford one. Stbxh has assured her that there is definitely going to be a divorce - he is never coming back to her although she still keeps hoping that he will change his mind. So the only thing they will be discussing is the financial settlement. If she has to mediate formally, I think it is a good idea that she sees a solicitor to just get an idea what she is entitled to as it is very likely that he will bully her into a settlement.

As to desertion - I don't know how he is going to petition. He said he will be back in perhaps 2 years to collect his musical instruments.

intlmanofmystery - Her stbxh did cite cheapness as the reason for pushing for mediation. However, I thik a huge reason is probably because my friend will just give in. I don't think he will be honest - why should he? I don't think he has been so far. Nobody meets a stranger one night and realize that the stranger is the person they were meant to be spending the rest of their life with. I don't think anyone throws away a 25 year marriage on a chance meeting with a stranger.

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pocketsaviour · 10/05/2015 19:14

Some firms of solicitors will agree to defray costs until the final settlement is made. She really needs to find out how much the remaining mortgage is on the house, versus the value, because the "default" arrangement with no kids involved is that you sell and split the proceeds 50/50. It sounds like he's already disposing of marital assets (bike etc - remember all assets gained during the marriage are deemed to be jointly owned) so she needs to get a move on.

If she's happy just with a 50/50 split then mediation should be able to handle that quite well, I'd have thought. But she definitely needs decent legal advice first on where she stands.

babybarrister · 10/05/2015 19:25

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SolidGoldBrass · 10/05/2015 19:29

He has left her, therefore she doesn't have to worry about placating or obeying him. She definitely needs to talk to a solicitor, because men who have left their wives and moved onto another woman, and who then insist the dumped woman doesn't get legal advice, are men who are trying to make sure that they shaft the dumped woman comprehensively.

Dowser · 10/05/2015 20:06

Some good advice there from legal people.

My divorce was 7 years ago and we didn't have mediation although he had taken himself off to the ME where he was earning mega bucks compared to here.

My divorce cost about £7.5 k so his will be about the same plus flights from ME to attend court.

I asked around and went the solicitor who felt I would come off best. She was recommended by a friend who had used her for two of his divorces and he did well both times.

I was shocked tbh at how much it did cost.

tryingtokeepintune · 11/05/2015 14:35

Thank you all for your advice. I will update friend with all the advice and recommend that she thinks carefully about what she wants to do.

SolidGoldBrass Yes, I think he is trying to do that too.

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