My best friend is in an abusive relationship and I don't know what else to do

[ovumahead]

This may be long and full of typos as my phone has a problem! Apologies in advance.

My friend - a kind, gentle, very small framed (think 6/7 stone) woman got involved with this guy she met online. She is (well, was) incredibly fussy about men. Time was ticking - approaching her mid 30s,childless and not yet in a relationship. She was scouting for a potential father to be, which I understood. I met him once early on, about a week in, and had a bad feeling about him - a few things he said and did set alarm bells off, but nothing overtly serious (he seemed to be lying /deeply unrealistic about future plans, and was overly charming when he didn't need to be - all could have been down to anxiety but I still smelled a rat).

The next time I saw them, she was pregnant (we live far away). As her pregnancy continued, he continued to work (in his temporary administration job, not making documentaries about global politics like he thought he was on the verge of doing). Then one day he came home and announced he'd stopped working to 'take care of her'. He's never worked again and that was about 3 years ago. He's basically lived off her savings.

There were a few indicators that things were getting nasty, but she protected him. I remember telling her about a year in 'he's abusing you, there's a risk that this physical and emotional pressure is going to get worse' and it did.

He's basically worn her down. She has no self esteem any longer. She's a fantastic mother, but an abused one. He's spent the last 3 the years going ballistic at her about her previous sexual relationships - she's by no stretch ever been a 'slag' but he will call her this and worse, way worse. It all came to a head last year when he properly beat her up in their bedroom with their daughter sleeping (?) in her cot. She was covered in bruises which she took photos of but refused to report him. I think that night she did call the police and I can't remember the details of what happened, but he spent the night in a cell I think, but was released with no further action the next day.

He has manipulated, charmed and persisted his way back into her life. She won't ever have a partner relationship with him, but he's living with her and her daughter now.

I've been so direct with her, I've offered to help in any way I can, but he seems to gave this grip on her. She also believes that he has such a positive relationship with their daughter that she wants to keep him in her life.

I saw her recently and found myself at a complete loss as to what to say to her - she hasn't asked for my advice, yet I've previously given her a lot of very strong advice (leave him, get out, call the police, come and stay with me, etc etc) but none of it sticks for long. He's clearly highly toxic (and a violent, narcissistic psychopath at the very least) but she doesn't see it. She's trained in a profession which means she is well aware of the impact of abuse on individuals and families but it's like this doesn't apply to her.

She's even thinking of having another child with him.

Is there anything I can do? I feel stumped, but I don't want to give up.

I don't think there is anything more you can be other than continue to be there for her and make it clear that you will always be there for her. Until she is ready to see there is a problem, she is stuck where she is I think.

You can't do anything until she is ready to leave. When she is, be there. I know it sounds awful, but a person will be hit/beaten by their abusive partner on average 32 times before they leave. It's a long process and you can't do anything about it. The psychology involved may seem unfathomable, but she will feel like she can't leave, she's not strong enough etc etc because he has worn her down. hopefully she will get to the point of leaving before he seriously injures her or worse.

That is so incredibly sad.

Do you think her child is at risk? If so, you need to contact social services.

For her, I would continue pushing her to leave. You sound like a good friend, she will need you.

Just be her friend. If you keep going onto her about leaving him etc then she may cut off your friendship as you are saying things she doesn't want to hear so tread with care as I am sure she needs your friendship in her life.
Relationships are highly complex. if/when the time comes when she wants to leave him then hopefully you can be there for her. It's painful and frustrating watching a person we care for continue in abusive relationships but there is nothing you can do. She is an adult and has to live her own life. The only time you can really get involved is if you see that the child is being abused, then it becomes a child protection issue. The bloke sounds like he has total control over her now and those chains are hard to break free from. It's sad.

Exposure to domestic violence is child abuse in itself. He doesn't have to turn on the child for it to be abuse.

I am very well aware of that flanjabelle, I still suffer from huge emotional/mental scars from my mothers domestic violence at the hands of my father and the hell it brought to the family.
I very much doubt that social services would intervene though unless there was direct risk of harm to the child.
DV is so complex and multi layered and us made especially difficult because the victims frequently lie and cover up the abuse for a very wide variety of reasons including fear and dependency.

Heyday that's just not true. I know a couple who had social services involvement because of their domestic violence. She was told to end the relationship, but didn't listen. They take it very seriously.

If there is police involvement then there is a high chance that ss will be contacted, or at very least the hv.

When splitting up from dds dad he became aggressive and I contacted the police. despite having no previous issues, the hv got in touch because the incident had been passed on by the police because I have a child. Obviously there were no concerns as I had done the right thing by ending the relationship and he was very much the problem, but it had rung alarm bells none the less.

Yes, I know what you are saying flan but the op is not the person facing the abuse. We are trying to give advice to a friend of the victim. A victim who is totally covering up the abuse. I would say that as she has very little evidence of the abuse then her hands are tied somewhat.
I guess she could tell her friend that she risks having the child taken away if she continues in an abusive relationship but I think that will probably fall on deaf ears too.

If she's determined to be abused there's nothing you can do. Have you tried pointing out that she's being a terrible mother by exposing her child to all this?

If you think the child is in danger then you must unfortunately act to protect the child. But this is not likely to end well for her, because she's in that mindset where she won't see it. It takes proper trained or experienced support to catch her at the moment where she is doubting, otherwise she'll keep getting sucked back in. That's not anybody's fault, (except maybe his!) it's just how strong it is. Think about somebody suffering from addiction - it's very similar in that the relationship becomes the priority over everything else and the small moments of clarity are few and far between and have to be caught just right. I read recently that police in some areas have begun taking refuge workers when they respond to a DV call out - this is making a huge difference, but it's not been rolled out in all areas yet.

Unfortunately social services neither have the time, money nor resources to involve DV/refuge workers at the time they are focusing on a concern about children. So even a big shock like that often, sadly, doesn't have any effect. But the children have to be protected from abuse.

Perhaps in the short term you could talk about her leaving and emphasise that she her DD could always still see her father even if she was elsewhere. If that's the hook that's keeping her in but she doesn't really want to be there herself, that might work.

Or recommend mumsnet to her as a parenting site, not a relationship board. And hope that she migrates over from parenting to relationships.

Thanks so much everyone I really appreciate your thoughts and wise words!

Re her DD potentially being at risk - I don't know for sure, as I don't think there's been any violence recently and when the more severe attack occurred she was very little. However I'm well aware of the potential for this still to be damaging at a very young age.

Currently they are not 'in a relationship' as it they do not sleep together or identify as a couple, but my friend is so weakened by his persistence and also his repetitive reassurances (aka complete and utter lies) that she continues to let him live with them. She feels simultaneously sorry for him as well as infuriated by him. Most of all though I think she is just exhausted. She works part time and deals with DD's early morning wakings and night time grumbles as well.

Also I think it's the threat of her DD being taken away that has stopped her from being honest with services about what's happening. Also her warped protection of him (this I just cannot understand but have to accept that this is how she sees things at the moment).

My concern longer term is that he is a deeply misogynistic, violent man bringing up a female child. I personally would not want this kind of male role model anywhere near my child, but she sees him as being 'brilliant' with her DD. As she gets older I think he will struggle more and more to release control of her and allow her to explore for example, her own sexuality and identity. I also think he's so obviously twisted my friends view of him that he has the potential to portray an image of himself as a wonderful father while simultaneously being abusive. Her DD does not show any signs of this atm but in my mind this is the future risk. And it terrifies me.

The weirdest and most frustrating part of all of this is that my friend simply cannot hold on to or even see that she has been groomed by this man, and continues to be groomed. It's an awful thing to watch happening and feel so powerless.

But as one of you has already said, I cannot continue to push my opinions and advice on her when she is not asking me for it as this will distance us from each other. I found myself feeling really low when with her recently for this reason - like I've somehow taken on the role of condoning his behaviour by no longer speaking up about it.

There will be a lightbulb moment for her, make sure she knows whatever and whenever you'll be there.
Don't bring him up in the conversations, let her talk. Don't mention anything he does, she'll take it as nagging and will clam up. She won't want to 'prove you right'.
Let her know even if months go without talking you'll still be there.

What do you think she'd say if you suggested her leaving but letting her DD see him still? I realise that you think this is a terrible idea (and yes, it would be better for him to have no contact with her either) but short term, it would remove the DD from his immediate influence and give your friend space to grow and develop without him. Long term, it would be easier for the DD to see the difference between her mum and her dad and she most likely will draw away of her own accord.

I think others are right and you probably shouldn't suggest anything at all or even talk about him any more right now, but just wondered what you think she would say if you suggested this or whether she has considered it at all.

It's hard OP. You kind of have to wait her out, and contact her often enough via different means, that he cannot manage to make you uncontactable. Years ago, when we only had addresses and phone numbers in a little book, a friend's abusiver got rid of hers making it very hard for her to contact anyone. Abusers work at driving everyone away from their victim. Try to maintain as much contact as you can bear, even if it is a very thin thread of birthday and holiday cards, making sure to include your return address, and a note with your phone number inside.

Thanks forthe advice, again. We often go for quite long periods without much communication but I have often told her I'm always around for her. I tend to call or text as email would be easiest for him to hack in to and I don't doubt he has.

Re him leaving, she did say they have discussed this and he has agreed to leave 'in a months time' but he has done this several times before and returned, bit by bit, within a matter of weeks. He does this by staying in the evenings to help out, thenwaiting until sshe's really tired and can't be bothered to put up a fight. Just awful, subtle, insipid. She even admitted that it was unlikely that this attempt at him moving out would last long. She sounds so hopeless. She knows he'll just wheedle his way back in. But she does recognise that things are better without him there, she just doesn't seem to have the strength to sustain it.

Call social services now. You will probably lose the friendship but children are at risk. Sorry for the difficult situation you (and she!!) are in

What action are social services likely to take at this stage with this kind of information?

Does she know what sort of history this man has? Are you worried . It has recently become possible to find out this sort of thing quite easily

content.met.police.uk/Article/Domestic-Violence-Disclosure-Scheme---Clares-Law/1400022792812/1400022792812

I think even you could ask the police if they have any information on this man.

call thats such a helpful message for you to share. Thank you. I have invited her to stay with us for a break and as you say, fora ttaste of a stable family life and time away from him and their little flat. She was on the phone to him all the time, sending him texts / photos of their daughter, which I found nauseating but didn't say anything.Small steps I guess!

Thisnpage on women's aid may help

www.womensaid.org.uk/domestic-violence-survivors-handbook.asp?section=000100010008000100320004

Wow. Yes I it hadn't occurred to me that the endless texts may be a preventative measure. But actually I think her situation is more complex - there is a part of her that does seem to actually want him involved (seemingly regardless of the cost).