Meeting my sister again

[something2say]

Morning.

Backstory is....we suffered bad child abuse as the hands of our mother. I came off worst. Brother and sister complicit, father absent due to divorce. I left when young and never went back. I have become a charity working guitar playing no country walking music loving sort. No kids, lovely boyfriend, own small flat.

Last year, after not seeing her for years, my sister made contact and we have been seeing each other. I was delighted at first. It had been so long that I'd set to rest much of what happened and built a good life. It was lovely to see my sister again and find out how the family are all doing. Not very well mind, but still.

The problem is that my sister and I seem to be very different people with different values. She uses words like common to describe people. I would be fired for that language. She grimaced at the African name of my artist friend. I took this as her making fun of his name. She say things like 'Mwahahahahahaah, were SO different, I wouldn't be caught DEAD walking in the woods!!!' And this makes me feel like shit.

Regarding men, she is 42 and like a teenager I feel. Just split up with one philanderer, has a wealthy ex hanging about who regularly pits large sums of money into her bank acct so that she can buy Jimmy Choos. She earns slightly less than me but because of this man is able to have things like that. She looks me up and down and it is obvious that my second hand cool clothes are not to her standard, everything she has is designer. We have totally different looks. On Friday she said about a builder doing some work 'Imagine only earning £120 a day!!! I mean R warns £500 an hour!' I could hardly stand it. Meetings are boring for me, they are all about me listening to her boyfriend problems and comparing man against man. Now I can analyse but seriously! She doesn't see any depth to life, it's all surface stuff and she glosses over things that I think are important.

But I think mostly what is getting to me is that I have wilfully gone back into the lions den. My family were very abusive, lots of physical abuse such as drownings, lots of naked humiliation etc and they all laughed at me a lot. I feel that when she says things about not liking waking, not liking the country, finding it boring, she prefers Harrods, how can people earn such a small amount of money etc she is making fun of me. She has said she feels sorry for my life because I don't have much luxury. In actual fact, too many belongings make me anxious as I don't need them. I have a lovely pretty flat and love it where I live.

Anyway I would like advice on how to negotiate this relationship going forward. I don't want to hurt her as she has the right to live her way, but so do I and I won't put up with being belittled.... There is currently contact several times a week.

Thanks for listening.

I would just gradually phase her out - nothing dramatic just slowly reduce contact to a level you find acceptable.

You are never going to agree with her values and there may always be some resentment albeit subconscious about the way you were treated. Overall it is best just to reduce your interactions with her - she is unlikely to change

You have gone back into the lion's den. Ime it's best not to disturb the beast. You have built a lovely life you don't need to be self-conscious about (I don't mean shy but conscious of it iyswim, ie in comparison to others')

A few times a week seems a bit much tbh, particularly with such a terrible past. You have both built strong identities as a refuge from the past, it's no surprise those identities clash. You may not want to get into deep and meaningfuls but I wouldn't feel I could take up where we left off without at least some reference to the hideous past. In which she was complicit . OK she was a child and it's all about survival then, children aren't as culpable as adults. But she's an adult now! I don't know if I could take blithely skating over such a terrible past...

She may feel you're making fun of her tbh [and it's tempting! She has chosen a shallow construct really...].

Hi guys, thanks for the responses.

Well, everyone warned me, but it was just so sweet to see her. She has more or less left them all behind too, but you are right springy, in that we have trodden different paths. I chose to get into counselling in my early twenties, where she is still in denial. This makes our approaches to life very different. I feel like her older sister a lot.

We have spoken about what happened a lot, but she does gloss over it all with yes buts. She doesn't like to think about it very much, about what it all means, whereas I have been through all that, and for the better I think.

She does compare us as well. She says oh you're just so peaceful etc. so maybe you are right there too and she feels bad as well.

I guess I am sad that it won't be going anywhere meaningful and I may feel like this a lot when we have contact. Bored, irritated, put down, out of my comfort zone.

You both think I should back off then. What if she notices and asks? When you say not to disturb the beast, do you mean not say things directly about what's bothering me, because they reflect who she is? Ie I don't like it when you put people down for not earning lots of money, I feel it is a shallow value?

I think she actually sounds very insecure. You just need to tell her straight what you've told us. Not in a confrontational way, but next time you feel she is having a passive aggressive dig at your values or your lifestyle or that she's mocking you or your friends just say patiently as if addressing a small child that it takes all sorts to make a world and you are glad you don't need expensive shoes or a rich boyfriend or designer 'stuff' to feel validated. It's possible that her self esteem is actually rock bottom and she needs to convince you (and herself) that she has survived and triumphed against the odds. As indeed you have - but you manifest that in different, more subtle ways and I imagine that you are more at peace with yourself than she is.

You could just back of to a level that suits you and if she asks then calmly say what crossfit suggested. I think it would be upsetting for you to have a huge row but you do need to maintain a situation in which you feel comfortable

Good luck

Cross fit you are absolutely spot on there. She has said that every time something goes wrong with a man, she withdraws into becoming more and more glamorous and untouchable.

Thanks for the chat, I appreciate it. It's so sad isn't it. Even after all this time, we don't get on and seem unlikely to be close. Never mind, we both have our lives and it will probably be nice to catch up here and there.

Oh no, I wouldn't make a negative comment about her values - please don't. As cross says, the construct she has devised is fragile.

You're shored up - you've done the work. She may not be capable of delving into all that horror, as you HAD to. She's probably found a shelf to function on - don't knock the shelf.

Yes, it is sad. Do you feel she is actively toxic, or just blind? If the latter then give her space (but not at your expense!) She doesn't sound like the most switched-on person. I hate to say it but she sounds lonely.

If she's out of contact with the family (the beast that shouldn't be disturbed btw) then you're on safer ground imo - she won't be tattling back to the others.

I have a friend who isn't the brightest bulb in the box who was being a bit troublesome and I backed off - imperceptibly at first, stronger as time went on. No announcements. Words just don't do it with a lot of some people - it's what you do sends the biggest message. So when she called I was busy or distracted - no explanations; in fact I sometimes plain didn't reply to texts and let time go by. I saw her now and then - and was genuinely glad to see her. But if she played up I made my excuses and left; not flouncing, I just didn't want that. We're on a much better footing now and I genuinely enjoy her company.. now and again !

I should make clear that the 'troublesome' I refer to in my friend was, ultimately, toxic behaviour. Learned, probably; but I didn't want it nonetheless.

If she is not actively toxic then I think it is a potentially valuable relationship, even though you're chalk and cheese. We don't have to have a big connection for a relationship to be valuable imo.

Thanks so much for your input there. Will have a think and let time pass by.

X

Would it help to actually talk about this directly? To say that when she makes comments about people that put them down or say 'how can they live on so little' that you dislike it and that you don't want to be around it? it can be said in a quiet way that isn't angry, but more giving straightforward feedback.

If you did choose this option, it would be an idea to write down exactly what sorts of comments / behaviours you'd like her to leave out when you're together and to be clear about them. Also plan how she's likely to react. Some people do respond to straight talking; others really don't.

If you think she might respond to it, it might clear the air and might make her be less critical at least around you. On the other hand it might also lead to a row, and you'd have to be prepared for that. If you end up with less contact - well, you were thinking of reducing contact anyway.

But she is your sister and while it's unhealthy to have a relationship with someone which makes you feel belittled and with someone - anyone - who puts you down, it's one of those relationships that's at least worth taking a risk for.

Meerka she was complicit in abuse.mshe was there, she joined in, she made fun of me and we haven't ever been close. We are meeting as 40 year old women who barely know each other. I don't know many women who wear four inch heels all day every day and call other people common. It's a bit of a street tbh and the family loyalty just isn't there and never has been.

It sounds like you simply want to quietly withdraw then; that she isn't someone you actually like very much. Probably much better to quietly let things fizzle out then yes, rather than talking to her.

it would be an idea to write down exactly what sorts of comments / behaviours you'd like her to leave out when you're together and to be clear about them

Dear God, not to hand to her I hope Meerka??!!

Op, I,m going to be blunt here: is it just her who is making value judgements? You sound as bad as each other more similar than you may realise re who gives a fuck what size heels anyone wears? It has nothing to do with who someone is.

Even to write such a list is foul.

You didn't need her before and you don't need her now. See her twice a year and then you can enjoy her. She is starting to abuse you because that's all she knows how to do in your family and it will get worse. I talk from experience. Get her out before she contaminates the freedom you have worked so hard to find.

I reconnected with my older brother recently. I just don't like him/his values so I've not pursued any further contact. He met my dc recently and my adult dd made some comments about his attitudes that she didn't like so it was validation enough that it isn't just me, we just have nothing in common.

goodness me no springydaffs. No, writing things out can help you clarify things in your own head. If you're meeting someone and really struggling to hold your own, it can help to have the piece of paper in your pocket and to touch it or hold it unobtrusively. But no, not to hand it her!

I don't think it's foul to write out a list of what you're struggling with at all. Sometimes you can feel something is wrong. You can sense it. Comments, the way things are said. But until you actually put it into writing, you can't see the -pattern- of what's going on. When you do see the pattern, you can write down what you want to happen instead, and that can help you work towards it.

Do you see her in the hope that you will one day have the sisters relationship that you wanted as a child. It's sad to say but this isn't going to happen.
I too had a very abusive childhood with a sister that could do no wrong.
As soon as I could stop speaking to her for good, I did, and never regretted it.

Hello again.

The thing was, it came right out of the blue for me and was such a shock that I was only delighted about it. I couldn't see her enough, find out more about her. It is from that process that I am discovering we are poles apart.

I thihght the same as you springy in that I was equally to blame and maybe she feels bad around me too? It's hard to explain but I feel back there if you see what I mean, the old familiar way that things used to be. Off the cuff remarks followed by laughter at my expense, as the things I like. I really was born into the wrong family! But I have considered that she must feel that way with me too, except we didn't have that dynamic as kids. She was in, I was out, and that's just a bit too much like what I felt this week, hence the thread.

I don't want to drop her again, I don't want to hurt her. I will reduce contact and expectations. I will expect to feel out of place with her and in her world. I will allow stuff to just float by? Should I say something if she says common? I guess we are strangers even tho we are related.

You're not going to change her but would advise against letting things float by because before you know it you're back in the old family set up. You can be different without her making you feel like shit just for being you.

something you don't have to decide whether you want to challenge her about the 'common' thing yet. Get contact at a level you feel comfortable with then you can think about it.

But generally agreed with saltnpepa, don't let things float by and end up feeling like you did as a child; the butt, the outsider. this -is- a relationship of equals between you and her.

Perhaps when you are ready, you could say something like "I don't think they're common, they are just normal people"?

I will. Thanks everyone. I can reduce visits to once a month with excuses of busyness and then handle case by case basis.

Night x

It's OK to be poles apart? It sounds like you motored the excessive contact and the bottom line seems to be 'nah, I dont like you much after all'. Because she remarks that people are 'common' and wears 4" heels? You probably bang on about 'organic' and 'feel your feelings' and eco this and that. Which is probably foreign to her.

So what? As long as she isn't actively toxic then I don't see the harm. I appreciate family stuff is muddying the waters, which can definitely be challenging, but she is no longer in contact with the poisonous family, it's just her. Don't pick her up and drop her only because her tastes are (drastically) different to yours. Your choice though of course!

Thanks very much for that. I don't bang on about organic stuff, no. I spend time listening to her problems. I don't require any further input from you but thanks anyway. You don't get me.

It was a joke!