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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Dignity and other animals

15 replies

FannyPrice · 01/11/2006 11:49

Dh & i have a rather adolescent relationship. Lots of arguments, we have never taken anything to heart, we make up, we dont hold grudges, we carry on, we argue, we shout, we make up etc etc.
Recently, over the last year our lives have changed a little. He has a new job, new collegues, new influences, new social life ( although not extensive) male dominated environment all rather 'base'. He Sits for hours at the computer on the internet when he gets home. He isn't seperate from the family becuase the computer is in the main living area.
He has a short temper. I refuse to be frightened into being quiet. This is not to say he is deliberatley trying to frighten me, just that a raised mans voice is frightening IMO ( becuase of my childhood i think this)

He has always been someone who loves to spend. his philosophy is to deal with it when it happens, something will come along, don't worry about it now. I however, find it difficult keeping on top of finances. on what comes in and what goes out. this causes me a huge amount of stress. i deal with huge stresses everyday and i just can't deal with this one. I am a number imbicile, stupid even. I cant remember my own salary ( there abouts but not exactly) i forget my own age sometimes. I am really number stupid.

so i devolve the responsability of the household finances to him. Becuase of his deprived childhood, exceedingly poor etc he likes to have things. Things dont bother me. I wasn't poor as a child but i wasn't overwhelmed with things either.
I hate his new attitude from work. the creeping mysoginy of a male dominated environment. He spends no time with me or with the children(except watching specific telly progs 2 or 3 times a week for an hour at most.)Weekends we argue all the time. all the time. It's not like we dont know each other. This isn't a fledgling relationship. All i can see is a man obsessed with self gratification.

i have had two periods in my life where i have been cery depressed. i mean contemplating the best way of doing myself in depressed (people who have been depressed with understand this hopelessness i hope. I am not suicidal) and it's creeping in again, i can feel it. I seem to work and cry, work and cry.

The children dread weekends becuase over the last 3 months we have done nothing but argue. Last weekend was the blow out of the century. It started over nothing. I have the bank cards to stop dh from spending ( he doesnt spend on himself but just spends) this doesn't mean i know what money we actually have, what's waiting to go out or what is waiting to be paid, what needs to be left in becuase it must be paid by dd next week etc - i don't know, i just have the bank cards.

He wanted to go and buy some beer to drink in the house. I don't like drinking in the house ( for myself not the principle) i don't find it enjoyable and cannot really see the point quite frankly. Self gratification 'ug' man appears and we have huge row becuase i say things about money & self gratification, what about my evening, i work too etc etc - lasts all evening he goes out and buys beer & cigarettes. I go to bed at 9pm. I don't deny him the in house drinking. It's just my idea of a great friday night after a week working isn't to watch my husband pass out at the computer whilst i spend yet another evening alone watching ukstyle!

This carried on into Saturday and culminated in us violently screaming at each other and he said he was going to divorce me. He meant it. With all his heart and soul, he meant it and i begged him not to. In frenzied semi argue i scream "Please dont leave me, i haven't worked this hard for all these years for you to leave me now"

to which he replies "Good God have some dignity"

That one statement has floored me.
Although we are speaking now i feel it's all different and i don't know what to do. I don't know why with age i have diluted my principles. When life was harder and the children were smaller, i would have left. He knew 100% i would. There seems to have been a shift in power and the equilibrium has changed. I wonder whether i should just walk out with the children and plonk myself at the council offices and ask for help.

The dilema dear reader is this, i think i would only be doing this to regain some dignity. I want him to change although i know in my heart he won't. I want to frighten him into trying. I dont want to spend the rest of my life alone. I don't want to go back into the meat market of dating. I don't want to start my life again. I just want to show my husband i have dignity and self respect and there are boundaries he cant cross. words are not enough.

Congratulations for finishing this long and dreary post. Please let me have my anonymity if i have given myself away. thank you.

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 01/11/2006 11:53

Yes, have some dignity.

Throw him out.

Why should you leave your house?

See a divorce lawyer.

And have him served w/the papers.

Carmenere · 01/11/2006 11:54

Just because he said that doesn't mean you are not dignified. I have just one question for you, would life officially alone be worse than life unofficially alone?

ScareyCaligulaCorday · 01/11/2006 11:57

Marriage guidance counsellor?

If you're not prepared to split with him, then tbh the demand for dignity is probably not feasible. I'm not saying you should split, just that if the option is unthinkable, then he has a negotiation lever that will always be incompatible with you having the nuclear option which will restore your dignity.

ScareyCaligulaCorday · 01/11/2006 12:01

TBH I feel v uncomfortable with your phrasing: "I just want to show my husband i have dignity and self respect and there are boundaries he cant cross"

You shouldn't want to show your husband you have dignity, you should want to show yourself that you have. And if you're not prepared to make a stand, then it's not true is it? He can cross any boundary he wants.

FireFaerie · 01/11/2006 12:07

you poor soul.. talk to him. i know you seem to be trying, which is what constantly results in arguements (i know..) a good tip i could try to pass on is this. start the conversation with a strategy in your head. points you want to make, questions you want to ask, that sort of thing. remain in a calm and rational sounding voice, even if you are screaming on the inside. as soon as his voice raises, ask him not to shout. refuse to get into a hot headed arguement with him, if he feels like he is loosing control of the conversation that is when people start to shout. if he cant talk about it in the calm manner you are, then simply take yourself out of the room, telling him you'l talk to him when you've both calmed down, giving him some dignity, not letting him tell you that your trying to leave all the blame at his feet. Keep repeating this process...
This seems to be working in part for me. its hard, i dont always succeed in keeping my cool, but it should prevent you from screaming, in a highly undignified tone 'i do have dignity, so im leaving you!' and dragging the kids into it.
this advice might help, but i doubt it will solve everything. what it WILL achieve is a clear idea of where you may end up in a years time, therefor letting you think about wether that is infact where YOU want to be.
Men have a wonderful gift of saying one line that leaves you gobsmacked, feeling defeated, and shifting the entire balance of what you have known. Sorry if this is useless or out of context, hope you feel better soon. try not to let the situation drag you down into the deep realms of depression.

FireFaerie · 01/11/2006 12:10

sorry, that should say 'some men'.... im not a man hater

FannyPrice · 01/11/2006 12:15

i agree with caligula. I think i don't have any dignity and we both know it.

OP posts:
madamez · 01/11/2006 12:56

Dear Fanny, your partner is psychologically abusive and heading down the slope towards physical abuse. If he'll come to counselling, give that a try (if you think there's anything to save), otherwise kick him out and you'll be amazed how much better you will feel.

This might sound harsh but your post reads like someone whose self-esteem has been systematically eroded by a man who doesn't have much respect for women.

FannyPrice · 01/11/2006 13:05

The house is in his name. I can't kick him out. I have asked for a council application and i have looked on "entitled to"

Apart from tax credits i am not entitled to help with anything.

OP posts:
HuwEdwards · 01/11/2006 13:06

I think you have dignity - enough to write this very frank post at any rate.

I do think you are frightened of being on your own, frightened for your future if you left him and probably can't be arsed to start again.

I would go to relate on your own and sort your own head out first, then you can tackle your relationship.

Good luck.

FannyPrice · 01/11/2006 13:14

Thank you Hew. I have just put my name down on a list for relate.

OP posts:
FannyPrice · 01/11/2006 13:21

Just told Dh that i have put my name downand he can come with or not. Told him i have got a council form coming. Told him i'm tired of crying.

he can't really say anything as he is at work. he said we will talk later.

OP posts:
anorak · 01/11/2006 13:25

If you are who I think you are (do you know me?) then you are a woman of great dignity.

I couldn't say throw him out or leave him. It seems there is a lot of love there and that he has been side-tracked, you could say his new position has turned his head.

My DH has a strong professional life, at work he is consulted by rich and powerful people and companies. When at first we were together he used to get arsey sometimes when I took the piss out of him. He'd get very cross when he thought I didn't respect the progress he'd made without the benefit of university education or a wealthy background. As the years have gone by he has realised that I had even fewer opportunities than he did and survived some terrible things, and that my humour isn't meant to put him down. All I want to do is to keep him grounded, and I can now. He knows I love and respect him so if I tease him he can take it in the spirit in which it's intended.

If your DH were to lose you I think he would be very sorry indeed and he knows this really. He's lost in a fantasy at the moment because at last he's getting some recognition for his hard work. I think you're strong enough to pull him back from this and ground him again. Relate might be the thing to help you with that.

I wonder if you pull back a little and start going out more when he's stuck on the computer what he would think? Shouting and arguing isn't working but a little detachment might scare him.

bluejelly · 01/11/2006 14:34

I spent years being afraid to be on my own. I bit the bullet and left a bad relationship.
Hated it for a month and then found that actually it was okay-- in fact it was great not depending on someone else for your happiness
I felt so relieved and liberated

kikki · 01/11/2006 14:54

Hi
Whenever my husband and I argued(usually over him going out or some unexplainable phone call from a woman) he would threaten to leave me and start packing his clothes. I would be him to stay as I was terrified of being on my own. He eventually left me when he had recruited another unsuspecting woman to replace me and I thought my world had ended. I managed to keep it together for my son and it was only after a year and a half that a friend told me, why are you afraid to be alone, you have been alone for nearly two years now and you are doing a really good job of it!
I hate dating and starting new relationships, it was not my choice to but my life is 100 times better alone than living in a warzone, constantly walking on eggshells.
I would beg and beg my husband not to leave us because he knew that I had no one else in this world apart from him(No family, no good friends etc.) this did no good at all and it only served to drive him further away. I throughly wished I had been more dignifyed about the whole thing, he didn't deserve my tears.
I don't think that it is right for your husband to say 'have some dignity'. How arrogant!
I have finally come to the realisation that it is better to give yourself a chance to meet someone who treats you respectfully than it is to put up with bad rubbish for the sake of not being alone.

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