Problem with mum since baby

[Brodicea]

Hey all,

Has anyone got any insight to help me out with my relationship with my mum? We used to be really close, I could talk to her about pretty much anything, we used to have a laugh, and I felt lucky to have a great mum-daughter relationship. But since I had my DD almost a year ago, there is a weird distance between us.

I'm worried about outing myself with these details, but here we go - if you recognise me from RL, please don't say anything to me:
I moved to a different city shortly before having DD and my mum also moved up shortly after DD was born. She had been caring for a relative who had passed away, she was retiring and wanted to be close - I was so happy to have her close, having been living really far away since I was 18 (mid 30s now). We used to talk once a week or more, and I went to see her 2-3 times a year. She was going to move straight into the house she had been planning to buy, but it all fell through and she ended up staying with us (me DH, and DD) for 6 weeks when DD was 6 weeks old. It was SO awkward. She wouldn't even make herself a cup of tea, and was a totally over polite 'guest' the whole time despite me trying to make her feel at home without patronising her.... Things were tense between her and DH as they have never really clicked - no major clashes, just a weird tension. She apologised to him once for being in, what she called, 'his kitchen' washing up once so never attempted it again: he said it was fine, she should make herself at home... but no... And we had a colicky baby crying most of the day, no sleep, all the usual mess and chaos of life with a NB to contend with. Fair enough, I thought, it was probably hard for her to be in a new place, staying in close quarters with us; plus we had a young baby and didn't have the time or energy to show her around (and I hardly knew this city!) or make masses of effort. When she moved into her place, I thought things would improve. But no, she is very business like with me, hardly talks about anything personal. She just seems closed off and very negative about everything.

She makes occasional disparaging comments about her life, how disappointed she is in how things panned out (My dad cheated on her ALL THE TIME and after 30 years of marriage, and with him expecting a baby with his current GF, they finally broke up about 15 years ago). She is also disappointed in me. She keeps encouraging me to go for full time jobs at high pay grades in my field, saying she'll look after DD and it will be fine but I want to spend time with DD. I have struggled with job interviews so it's taking longer for me to get a job than expected and she just remains tight lipped. I was doing a PhD, but I feel out of love with it and withdrew: she goes on all the time about how I could start again, even though I don't want to be an academic. She makes, or nearly makes small comments about my parenting all the time. She is visibly sickened by the fact I am still BF at 11 months and has to leave the room. She said BF is making me ill, pale and haggard. She says BLW is 'making a rod' for my back... I feel like our relationship is slipping away, like the reality of my lifestyle (rather than what she may have imagined at a distance) is letting her down. I feel like I can't meet her standards.

She also loathes DH. My DH is a really kind a gentle guy, his only real faults are that he can be a bit earnest and can seem a bit clumsy and awkward. I had a tough-ish labour and due to emergencies that day, I ended up being stuck on the prenatal ward for 14 hours waiting to go to the delivery suite. After the birth my mum blamed my DH. Not to his face, but to me, during the five day hormone surge she said 'he was supposed to look after you and what did he do: nothing'. I was devastated - already feeling raw and out of touch with DH and she adds that to the mix. She made me question everything.

Thinking back, I just feel like I was always desperate to please her. My DD made her feel like shit and left her to live abroad (living with other women although they were still technically together) from when I was 10. My brother left for uni when I was 14 - I feel like she lived through me, and the reality of 'me' is really letting her down. I feel pressured to live up to her standards, and having put her on a pedestal as the 'good' one of my parents, I think back to how she discouraged me in so many of the things I loved to do and was interested in because she didn't 'get' them: she told me what A-levels to take, what degree to do, expressed how perplexed she was that I played musical instruments and discouraged me from entering exams. She only praised me for doings well in things she enjoyed, so I pursued that. I feel stifled, and like all the positivity has gone from our relationship: I feel like I let her down on a daily basis and I don't have the strength to bother to please her any more.

Does anyone have a similar tale? Any insight? Any books I could read? I just feel so gutted that in being closer, we're actually further apart.

My Dad, not daughter made her feel like shit!

I'm wondering why she moved house to be closer to you when all it appears that she wants to do (from my interpretation of your post) is disparage, criticise and belittle you and your husband at every turn. And as for staying with you for 6 weeks when the baby was 6 weeks, and carrying on like that, well, words fail me actually. Very odd... I think you need to do what is right for you and your little family and mother and mothers opinions need to be taken with a pinch of salt. I'm not sure I'd be keen on having her look after my baby either. What do your siblings think of her, how much do they see of her?

Thanks Penny - my older DB hardly gets in touch and keeps her at arms length. He has commented before that if she is unhappy it is her life, and she has been a bit of a martyr.... I am beginning to think he's right! He has definitely disengaged with attempts to please her... he does his own thing, has an OK job but fills his spare time doing things he loves to do. She seems very saddened that he hasn't had kids, and isn't better of materially - but he is very happy in my view.

I don't think she intends to belittle us.. but I do wonder if the dynamic has changed now since I am 'mum' and she is 'nanna' and maybe she finds it hard that I make the decisions?

It sounds like she is depressed perhaps you being a mother is bringing feelings to the surface in her . If you had a good relationship before it does sound odd . It sounds like she needs to read a self help book on positive thinking as she sounds far too negative!

I think that this is more common than perhaps people think. In particular the mother being disappointed with the life choice of the daughter because feels like criticism of what the mother did. Eg daughter breast feeds is seen aa implicit criticism that the mother didn't do that. Or if daughter is sahm when mother works.

Mother doesn't realise that she is being difficult and both parties end up disappointed

Thanks guys - interesting points Kerstina and Pimms... I think she might be depressed, and maybe she does feel implicit criticism... I have noticed she is a lot touchier if I make what I think is a joke / mild chide (the other day I tripped over my words and she made a joke of it and I said 'oo it's like being around DH with the constant quips!' and she was a bit offended and apologies and I felt really bad, reassured her I was joking etc etc). Maybe then she does feel like I am tacitly criticising with my different way of doing things...

Oh how sad for you.
I think now you see more of your mum you can see her short comings more clearly.

I'm probably a similar age to your Mum and would hate to think I have her opinions and attitudes. She doesn't seem to have any joy inside her.

Op don't let her pressurise you into going back to work etc.

I'm very similar.

I think it's down to losing control. My mum is very worried about appearances and what other people think. When we were young she had absolute control, what we did, how we dressed, how we behaved. It reflected well on her, iyswim.

Same with academics and career choice. Anything other than university and a degree wasn't good enough for us.

Now I have dc it's the same- when am I going back to work, I'm too educated to stay at home. She seems to think degree= walking into a 50k + job. I think she just doesn't like telling her friends I don't work.

Same with breastfeeding. Again, I think she's very black and white, the way she did things is the right way, therefore I am doing it wrong.

I run my house very differently, it doesn't have to be spotless, I don't care if toys or a bit of washing is out (but what if anyone comes round!).

Tbh our relationship has suffered. But previously we got on because I did things she approved of, and now I'm not she doesn't like it.

I have no real insight, except to note the many similarities to my relationship with my mum! We were very close when I was a teen, and she often said how like her I was. But the older I got, the more of my own decisions I made, the more I had my own life, the more I think she realised I wasn't entirely like her, and the disappointment set in. On the one hand, I find it really hard. She doesn't rate my life at all, doesn't understand that I love my job, and doesn't like my husband. But on the other hand, shit, who cares?? Not me. I have an amazing life, a really interesting job which I do part time now that I have 2 beautiful children, a nice house and a kind husband I really love. I thought those were the things she wanted for me, but I feel like she moved the goalposts. It's telling that she rates my sister more highly than me. Her husband has more money than mine, and it pains me to say, I think that's why.

All that to say, I get you. I spent a few years in angry tears to my husband, driving home from my parents' place. But I'm pleased to say, I'm almost over it now. The little jibes still shock me, but I laugh about it now with DH, rather than cry. It's a shame, but I hope you work through it.

I'm so heartened by these balanced replies. There's a lot of mother-bashing goes on on MN usually, lots of projection.

What comes to mind is that being constantly cheated on will have taken its toll on her in a profound way. Not your fault of course. I wonder if the big move has also unsettled her, dredging up a lot of banked up pain she thought she was going to skate past. She does sound depressed.

My mum feels exactly the same as your mum when she's at my sisters' houses bcs my sisters are married and I'm not. She says how comfortable she is in my house, openly says she can't relax in their houses bcs of the husbands but can relax in mine.

It sounds like your mum has lived through you - her life has been so shit she focused on you. Now you're branching out, being your own person, and she's lost. Nothing is going to plan (or ever has).

All her stuff. Very painful for you, a real headfuck tbf. I feel for you. Its tragic really. BUT you have to live your own life!

I wondered if perhaps she felt jealous of you. I'm sorry you are going through this, it sounds very hard.

It may be she is deeply disappointed you have launched into motherhood before you flew in your career - it certainly sounds like she had high hopes for you. Perhaps she feels you had so much going for you and you squandered it ('lost interest'), instead dropping out and having a baby. Is she a frustrated academic incidentally?

She may project the hatred and disgust she feels towards her own husband onto your husband. And/or she blames your husband for leading you astray, knocking you off target. Her target as it happens

You've ended up a wife and a mother just like she did. Perhaps she wanted you to escape her fate.

Thanks for your lovely considered replies all.

So many interesting points, and so interesting that others have felt / do feel the same. Springy that is a point, she always put my dad first and ended up with what she sees as 'nothing' (her words exactly). She really doesn't trust men at all, so probably thinks I will be left feeling similarly frustrated.... I hope we can work on it!

Yes I hope you can . Your mom is precious and it is worth working on your relationship .
My mom can be incredibly negative and it is usually about other people rather than myself and my family . I do think she had been mildly depressed for a while . I have lent her don't sweat the small stuff but she says it sends her to sleep I do have to jolly her a long a lot and gently pull her up if I think she is being unfair and a bit spiteful . She wasn't always like this and is very forgetful I do worry it's a symptom of something else . Can't get her to doctors about it though.

Oh Kerstina that sounds tough - I don't think my mum would go to the docs in a million years. It's so hard: I just want her to be happy, but I know I can't MAKE her be happy....

Very similar to my mum.

• Cheated on throughout marriage by my dad
• He molested me so I always thought of her as the "good" one

(She refused to kick him out... Eventually social services made him leave)

• She refused to see a solicitor re the divorce so he took everything and she was left with nothing, apparently this wasn't her fault
• Constantly complained about a succession of crappy low paid jobs she was "forced" into but never bothered to train or improve her skills. At the same time, slagged me off for being "stuck in a rut" when in fact I really love my job and earn 3x as much as she ever did
• Now hates all men, constantly slagged off my late husband and makes very rude remarks about my son, purely because she hated his dad
• Considers herself as "always putting other people first" but then makes shitty PA comments about it
• I thought we had a great relationship until last year when I moved closer to her after years of being 250 miles away
• Told me off 2wks after my husband died for "cuddling DS too much, it's sick, like incest, I can't watch"

I have now cut contact with her. Not necessarily advocating that for you, but I'd suggest detaching as much as possible, and would not leave your DD alone with her unless you want your parenting completely undermined.

A good book for you to consider might be "When you and your mother can't be friends" and I'd also take a look at "If you had controlling parents".

My mother is very similar. She finds how I live my life as a criticism of how she lead hers and it's hard to get her to see past that. Only I have the opposite to you as DM hates that I work, despite her moaning all my life that she shouldn't have given up her great career prospects.

I've gone low contact with mine, as it's easier, but might not be the right answer for you.

It sounds to me as if she's lost her purpose. By losing your dad to his girlfriend - and him making a new family - she's losing her grip and control of hers.

By disparaging you, she thinks that she's going to sail in to 'help you' and be mummy again. She doesn't realise that she's pushing you away and making your relationship painful and unlikely to be fulfilling.

I think you'll have to have a frank discussion with her, on what you need from her - and what you don't - and take it from there. It's not easy but it's the only way.

A few 'perhaps' and 'maybes' wouldn't go amiss here.

Why, springydaffs? Is that not implied? Nobody knows the OP's exact situation and everybody is, presumably, just giving their opinion as a lay person with their own experiences. I expect OP is bright enough to insert the relevant disclaimers in her head as she reads and disregard what doesn't apply.

Actually, no. I think when we are in a relationship that is heavily-loaded and fraught it can be very hard to see clearly. Also the pain and confusion of said fraught relationship can make us vulnerable to suggestion.

Well OP asked for insights, posters have given them from their own experiences/perspectives. Incidentally, you used none of those 'perhaps' and 'maybes' in your first post, Springy.

I will continue to credit OP with reading and comprehending what she needs to rather than projecting something that I can't know and I don't want to hijack her thread.

Erm not so lying!

I think we need to tread carefully in a situation like this - opinions, certainly, op has asked for them - but perhaps we could avoid statements eg she IS doing this or that etc. Professionals train for years and years - not least to avoid projecting! - i agree we can't know what is really happening here.