I seem to have missed a memo on dating, please help me!

[BeginTheBeguine]

Basically, I'm in my early twenties, still at university (PhD) and have never gone out with anybody.

I was at an all girls school and did quite a lot of evening clubs there, and my hobby outside school, which I did for about 10 hours a week, was also pretty much all girls (a few boys who I knew to talk to, but they were all three-four years older, so left when I was about fourteen). So with all of that, plus schoolwork, going out with somebody wasn't really high up my list of priorities.

Anyway, I came to university and have been here ever since. My course was a fairly even mix of boys and girls, and I'm involved in two societies. One I just do the one rehearsal each week, and know a few people well and plenty to chat to, but the other I'm heavily involved in - I can do up to eighteen hours a week, that's a mix of classes and practice and a social.

Anyway, nothing's ever happened relationship-wise. I was asked out once in first year by my then dance partner, but I panicked and turned it down (he was four years older, which seems a lot when you're eighteen! Plus I had no idea he wanted that sort of relationship, I had only been focused on the dancing).

I always though it would happen at some point, but recently it's started to prey on my mind a bit - most of my friends have had at least one boyfriend/girlfriend since being at university.

I think I'm quite nice, and there's nothing immediately off-putting about me (I hope!). It can take me a while to feel comfortable around new people, but I'm good at chatting and asking people about themselves etc. so I have a big group of acquaintance/friends, some who are a bit closer, then a small group of close friends.

Problem is, all the men on my close group of frieb

...friends are very nice, and so already have girlfriends! Or I just like them as a friend with no romantic feeling.

I just feel like I've missed the 'how to meet somebody once, decide you quite like them, and decide to see them again' lesson! And of course now it seems a much bigger thing because everybody else has had at least one relationship before. I might make really obvious beginners' mistakes that I should have got over and done with at about fifteen...

Sorry for the mammoth post! Writing it down has felt surprisingly good. Thank you if you reached the end

Have you thought about online dating at all?
I don't really have any other advice because when I was younger, I used to fall in lust a lot and would have no problem with pursuing a person who I was interested in.
Now that I am older and a lot more about who a person is, I find online dating sites a good way of meeting people, because you can get a general outline of who they are before you meet them. Not that I have actually met anyone yet but it is early days!

I haven't really - I haven't even had a stab at 'real life' dating yet, so online sounds a bit scary! I might have a think about it though.

I think the pursuing somebody might be the problem I have, I can think somebody seems good-looking or nice and I'd like to get to know them better, but then think "what if they don't like me" or "what if I do something that makes them think I like them, and then I realise I actually don't" or "what if they actually already have a girlfriend" and pull back. Most of my friends are people I've become friends with over time, if that makes sense - I see them a lot and realise we get on well, rather than thinking "I'd like to make friends with her".

'Dating' is a rather loaded term, unfortunately. All it should be is two people who like each other enough wanting to find out more over dinner or a cup of coffee. Friendship plus. Instead there's often a third figure in the picture like the old Monty Python sketch... nudge, nudge, wink, wink.... :) That's when it can get awkward and pressurised.

If you're sociable and have plenty of friends get the word out that you're single and interested in dating. Girlfriends have friends, brothers, etc. Take a chance and ask a male friend out just to see how it goes. And develop a bit of 'sparkle' towards anyone you particularly like. A little encouragement goes a long way.

That's a good idea Cogito, I might try mentioning it to a few people, especially with Valentine's Day being soon, it's probably quite a natural time for it to come up.

I can really relate to what you are saying. I am in my forties now but didn't have a boyfriend till I was 25. I just didn't know how to go about it. In hindsight men were interested and even went to quite extreme lengths to make this clear but I just wasn't picking up on the signs.

I am not sure I am a good person to advise but I would say (a) be friendly to anyone who you particularly like (b) try to pick up on any subtle signs they are giving you that they are interested and give them signs back (c) don't worry/ be nervous about anything - what's the worst that can happen? (d) have fun!

P.S. My friends and I used to call this "Girls' School Syndrome".

Go for dates for practice. Just be yourself and enjoy getting to know strangers.
Eventually you are going to be able to meet someone but don't put yourself under any pressure to accept dating if somethign feels wrong. There's usually a reason for it. Trust your instincts!

I went to a girls school too and used to think that a boy was just being friendly unless he tried to snog me! I still struggle to spot subtle signs even at 35. Any clues?

Yes, the one who walked me thirty minutes home in the wrong direction for him twice a week for the best part of a year is probably a case in point... I just thought we got on very well, everybody else kept asking if we're going out.

Tbf, he's six years older, so I never thought he'd be interested in me! We used to go out for coffee sometimes too. We're still very good friends (he's had a girlfriend for a couple of years now, I actually introduced then) but I've never dared ask if he was actually thinking about us going out.

The art of finding out if someone's interested is a subtle one :) You can get away with a lot under the cloak of jokes and 'banter'. 'Goodness me dear friend' you say nonchalantly, 'anyone looking at us would think we were an item!' ... At which point you look them in the eye ready to either laugh if they seem horrified at the idea or smile encouragingly if they seem to be considering the possibility. A touch on the arm seals the deal.

When I finally write my autobiography 'The World According To Cog' there will be a very large chapter devoted to Flirtation and Seduction.

I went to a mixed school but am still socially clueless. I'm really socially awkward and shy and I've managed to have boyfriends so if I can do it, you definitely can. :)

I think getting to know men as friends first can take the pressure off a bit. I once went out with someone who I'd been friends with for years and I wasn't romantically interested in him in the slightest but he started pursuing me. I said no at first but to my surprise I started having feelings for him so you never know what might happen with friends (he was also funnily enough my former dance partner). I understand it is very hard to read the signals with friends but I think you're going to have to be brave and make the first move. I don't mean you have to jump on him but do a bit of subtle flirting and see how he responds. If it goes horribly wrong you can always blame alcohol.

It sounds like you're very focused on worrying over whether men like you. That's fine but I think you should focus more on what kind of man you're looking to meet and who you might like. Tell your friends to see if they can hook you up with anyone.

Anyway, I think the best thing is to try and take as many social opportunities as you can to meet a wide variety of men. I wouldn't stress too much about your inexperience as there will definitely be men out there of a similar age who are in the same boat.

I don't think you need to ask him, I would say the walking you home was a pretty clear indication that he was into you!

Begin - yes sounds like he was very into you!

I went to a mixed school, but in the fullness of time had those "oh, so you fancied me?!" conversations. I was utterly clueless about what a little hottie I actually was (I really wasn't!) - I suspect my utter cluelessness was quite a thing, I had quite a few male friends, but to me they were just friends, I didn't really clock dangly bits, or a lack thereof, IYSWIM? They were just mates. So when I was ready to date, I was flippin confused. Not sure what or who I was attracted to, let alone what to to about it!

If me now could have given me then advice, I would have said don't use internet dating, even if you do have niche interests - if you haven't met many men with a view to intimate tomfoolery, then the ones who you haven't met face to face are going to be less easy to figure out in a wheat from the chaff perspective. If they have a chance to meddle with your mind before you actually get a chance to see the whites of their eyes, there's less of a chance of telling them to genuinely fuck off to the far side of fuck, and then fuck off some more. I have never had a horrifying internet dating experience, just more a collection of rubbish ones!

The thing I would have done earlier is to find a voluntary activity that I really, really enjoy, where you meet a bunch of people who enjoy what you enjoy, but, crucially have a really diverse bunch of people doing it, where there are people looking out for you, who know and understand the others doing it. What I have understood as a single female in my late 20s early 30s is that I was a bit of a target. I'm nothing to look at, about 5 stone overweight, but because I'm good fun, own my own place, and am a bit ridiculous, certain people think I'm worth a crack at, despite the fact that they are 20 years older than me!

You sound a bit like me, but early me. And I urge you not to go down the route of going totally off the rails batshit crazy when you discover that you have a certain something about you... when you meet someone nice, you will know, because you won't get angsty feelings about it.

If only Mumsnet had existed when I was doing what you are now doing. I would not have got into some toe curling situations, that's for sure! You are in the right place for advice. I feel like I've just warned you off most of the menfolk, I'm really not, when you meet someone you genuinely click with, you'll know it. I guess I want you to be able to listen to your inner voice - and trust it. I bloody wish I had have done, although if I had, then perhaps I wouldn't be with MrThunkit, so perhaps play it out, and keep safe, lovely.

Oh, and, I'm not sure if I've made it clear, but, go for it, walk with a stonking "I'm worth it" swagger, if for no other reason than it makes you feel like a total stunner!

The obvious thing to do is online dating. You could get yourself a date within a week whereas you could join several groups and it might take months to meet someone if you're lucky.

At least with online dating, everyone is there for the same reason and there are so many men to choose from on some sites. You want to meet someone, they want to meet someone, you start chatting, arrange to meet and take it from there.

Why don't you sign up tonight?!