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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Friend is wavering in taking back an abusive ex...

15 replies

KissyBoo · 27/01/2015 16:00

Not sure how to best support her.

Is it best to be a plain speaker and reiterate the attendant risks in getting back with him or take a very neutral stance and just be non- judgemental in a 'I'll be here for you' way.

Children are involved. He has a criminal record related to domestic abuse. I'm very worried as she seems really distressed.

Any advice welcome.

OP posts:
Ohfourfoxache · 27/01/2015 16:57

Urgh, horrible situation.

If you speak too plainly it might just push her away.

She needs to know that you're there for her no matter what, but a bit of gentle talk and gentle persuasion about how she is better off without him wouldn't hurt. You probably don't want to go in all guns blazing, but equally you don't want her to be in any doubt what a crap idea it would be for her to take him back.

How much support has she got? Has she got anyone else around who could tell her what a bad idea it is not to take him back? Sometimes the more people who express the same view the better.

Might be worth seeing if she wants to post on MN. My sister went through a bad relationship, and it wasn't until a bunch of strangers offered a resounding LTB that she really listened.

iloverunning36 · 27/01/2015 18:54

Why is she wanting him back? If it's cos she is worried about being on her own forever then reassure her that it's unlikely she will be but if she stays with the wrong person that she may miss a good man. If she's lonely find ways to get her some company (I find mn helpful as there is always someone to chat to and the relationships board reinforces that abusers don't change so staying away fr them is absolutely the best thing to do. Just try and be the person that really cares about her (hopefully this will highlight his bad behaviour as if he has abused her he doesnt care) well done Flowers

GoatsDoRoam · 27/01/2015 21:14

Tell her you love her (although you may not love her decision here).
Stay in touch with her -- things will be even harder for her if she is isolated (and her abuser may well be doing his best to isolate her from her friends and family).

MaMaof04 · 28/01/2015 06:00

I agree with all MN ladies: make sure she is not isolated. It is sad but from what I have seen around me these men know to play on the hearts of their victims and to weaken them. If she decides to take him back you cannot do anything just be around and open your eyes. She might start lying to you (she might have already started...) It is tough but she is lucky to have you.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 28/01/2015 10:00

I'm sorry but, if children are involved, I don't think you can afford to do the usual things of giving someone the space and support to make their own mistakes and hope they see the error of their ways. He's a violent criminal and I think you have to tell her straight that if she takes him in and puts her children at risk, she shouldn't be surprised if SS turn up and take them away....

KissyBoo · 28/01/2015 11:31

Thanks everyone. I have given it to her straight as per Cognito outlined. I have also told her what a lovely person she is and she is all the children need.

She has since been frosty with me on the phone and told me she no longer wants to talk about it in an email.

It's an uncomfortable position to be in but in all conscience it would be wrong to not say anything and that be interpreted as support for her getting back with him.

He is an incredibly manipulative individual.

I hope she does the right thing for her children. I feel very sad today.

OP posts:
KissyBoo · 28/01/2015 11:40

I forgot to add I said to her that if she took him back into her home then she would be putting her children at risk and that if she was going to make that choice then it would be better if she removed them from her home. I told her her job was to them safe and that although she could choose to be in an abusive relationship, her children couldn't. I said it wasn't good enough. Sad

It is the harshest I have ever been to anyone but I stand by what I said.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 28/01/2015 11:57

I think you've said exactly the right thing. She has choices but those poor kids are just little hostages with no say in the matter. It's sad when people like your friend are manipulated or intimidated into a particular course of action but children can't be allowed to suffer.

Hobbitwife001 · 28/01/2015 11:59

You did exactly the right thing, OP, the children's safety must be her first priority, no man is worth more than they are. Well done, I know that must have been difficult for you.

GoatsDoRoam · 28/01/2015 14:11

If there are children involved, telling her off will still be counterproductive. But calling SS is a responsibility you could shoulder.

shovetheholly · 28/01/2015 14:18

God, OP, I think you showed a lot of bravery doing the right thing.

I know right now it probably feels like you've lost her, but I honestly think that in the longer term she will see that you couldn't do anything else than speak up, and hopefully she will come to trust you all the more for it.

You can't do much more now unless you do want to call SS - and I am not sure what evidence you need to do that, or how you would 'prove' this case (I am categorically NOT saying 'Don't do it', but merely confessing my ignorance. Other, better-informed posters may be able to help).

If she starts not taking your calls and not replying to emails, which is quite possible particularly if you do involve SS, I would send a final message saying if she ever feels differently or wants someone to talk to or somewhere to go in an emergency, to consider you top of her list.

BertieBotts · 28/01/2015 14:49

Can you remind her of all of the positives of not being together?

Buy her a copy of Why Does He Do That?

Point her towards the online version of the Freedom Programme?

This is something I read today, bear with me, I think it's helpful.

She is in all likelihood operating under a false schema (set of beliefs and thoughts) that this is the best course of action. Wikipedia on schemata:

New information that falls within an individual's schema is easily remembered and incorporated into their worldview. However, when new information is perceived that does not fit a schema, many things can happen. The most common reaction is to simply ignore or quickly forget the new information.[16] This can happen on a deep level— frequently an individual does not become conscious of or even perceive the new information. People may also interpret the new information in a way that minimizes how much they must change their schemata. For example, Bob thinks that chickens don't lay eggs. He then sees a chicken laying an egg. Instead of changing the part of his schema that says 'chickens don't lay eggs', he is likely to adopt the belief that the animal in question that he has just seen laying an egg is not a real chicken. This is an example of 'disconfirmation bias', the tendency to set higher standards for evidence that contradicts one's expectations.[17] However, when the new information cannot be ignored, existing schemata must be changed or new schemata must be created (accommodation).[18]

When you tell her "He is dangerous, this is a bad idea, your children are in danger" she is likely to do one of two things: She will ignore, forget or minimise your concerns, either ignoring or forgetting the conversation ever happened, or deciding that you are mistaken, you think he's worse than he is, you don't understand the real him etc. She may also possibly decide you are a threat and reduce contact because you threaten her worldview and, therefore, her safety (I know how backwards this is - it is backwards - but it's a survival thing. Just unfortunate that the survival instincts point/lead to actions which are the opposite of survival!)

I can totally understand your personal reluctance to keep quiet, but do know that it's not a personal thing against you that she's doing - it's just the headspace she's in right now will not let any other views in. There are only really two ways to change that headspace - either to keep planting seeds which will make her look again at the evidence and see it in a different light, or to confront her very forcefully with something she actually can't ignore. This second option, you probably don't have the power to do - because you can tell her until you are blue in the face that she or the children are in danger or that Social Services will remove the children and she will keep ignoring, minimising or changing her view of you almost infinitely before she challenges her own view of him. Similarly in some cases even Social Services involvement is not enough of a confrontation because victims see the chink of "Perhaps they will see he's not so bad after all" and that keeps confirming their schema. It would have to be physical and immediate - a direct threat to her life or the life of her children - to make her immediately change her mind. Of course you can't do that.

She is probably much more able to accept smaller wedge shaped pieces of information that lead her to explore stuff for herself - ESPECIALLY if she's wavering on a decision - than to be told that such a course of action is dangerous - that's too harshly opposed to what she's believing at the moment. If you've already said that then don't worry, it might sink in somewhere, but keep feeding small nuggets of stuff about healthy relationships, about abusive relationships, about self esteem, etc, because it just might be that something clicks. And make sure she knows that YOU care about HER and SHE matters, because she might not be hearing that from a lot of sources right now.

MaMaof04 · 28/01/2015 16:25

Bertie: you wrote a very nice post- full of psychological insight. Not much can be done to help her as at now. However Cogito is right that there are kids who are trapped in this sick, twisted and violent relationship. So maybe as suggested above, SS might have to be involved. KissyBoo you might approach them and tell them your concerns- on a confidential basis. I read a nice book called 'white lies'- all kind of relationships are described there including an abusive one. It is a light novel and quite nicely written. So you might want to buy it for her (or borrow it from a library) to read. Info from novels is more easily taken in by people. Good Luck- You are a great friend!

badrobot74 · 28/01/2015 18:00

If she's thinking about it my gut instinct is you're too late to sway her, just support her.

BertieBotts · 29/01/2015 16:33

Agreed if the children are in danger, social services will have to be involved. Sadly :(

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