Friend obsessed with OM, ruining her life, how can I make her see sense?

[WrongUnBeGone]

I really hope I can get some good advice for my best friend here.

She is obsessed with a man that she had an affair with last year. He is married, and broke it off with her after a short fling and has stayed with his wife.

However, my friend is utterly, completely obsessed with him. She claims to be madly in love with him, and cries herself to sleep every night. She has ruined relationships with her friends over him, he has made her ill.

He is completely aware of all of this, and yet continues to play with her feelings to bolster his own ego. He tells her he loves her but can't leave his wife. He goes through phases of intense contact with her, and then will block her from his social media out of the blue, tell her never to contact him again, only to start up contact with her again when it suits him.

She is trying to date new people, but she inevitably tells him "because I owe it to him to be honest, I don't want to hurt him" (hah!), but I think she's telling him to goad him into resuming contact with her, which he inevitably does.

He had recently blocked her from all contact, until she hinted to him that she was seeing someone new, and lo and behold, he's told her he wants to see her again and has been calling her etc.

Now she has met a lovely new man, he seems really nice, stable, sensible, not into game playing at all. I would love to see her make it work with this guy, but he's not going to stick around long if he knows she's obsessed with game playing with someone else, is he? She has told new man all about her ex's game playing, and to be honest she's so utterly obsessed with her phone that I'm sure new man will notice when she's texting him etc...

She says she knows he's treated her like shit, but claims he's a 'lovely man' (I cannot see how the two can be true). She knows that he's playing her, and knows that he only gets in touch when he's worried that he's losing control of her. And yet she still plays the game with him.

How can I get her to see sense before she messes things up with this lovely new man? I really can't bear to see it happen again.

YOU CAN'T get her to see sense. Sorry about that. She's a grown up, she's making mistakes and she'll probably regret it in due course but she's allowed to all of the above.

You do not have to stick around to watch the car-crash, however. You are not obliged to be the studio audience to her one-woman Jeremy Kyle show. You do not have to collude with her self-delusion, keep her secrets or even listen to her self-indulgent crap. You are entitled to give her a straight answer to a straight question - so if you're asked what you think, don't hold back. Ultimately, you would not be wrong to walk away from it if it is causing you distress. Do you have a family of your own? Problems of your own? Those take priority

Thank you Cogito for talking sense - as soon as I posted my OP I thought to myself "I know I can't make her see sense..." I just wish I could fix it for her.

I have told her straight, and she says "I know, I agree with everything you're saying, but then you're bound to say that because you hate him". Yes, I hate him, because he's a horrible person who has treated her horribly. She then argues that he's a good person who is just accidentally doing these horrible things because of the impossible situation he's in (trapped in a loveless marriage he cant get out of, you know the usual).

Sadly, I did walk away from her when the shit hit the fan with him last year. She has never forgiven me for it. I'm scared of losing her friendship over this again, but at the same time I will not sugar coat the truth for her, so if she doesn't like my opinion then we will fall out again.

I had distanced myself and was just leaving her to her own shit, but to see her have this chance with what seems like a really nice genuine guy, I'm just worried that she's going to mess it up for this knobhead.

Of course, if she does mess it up with the new guy, it will all be part of the learning curve for her.

Aaargh I just want to shake her. But I can't, so I wonder if I can shake her verbally instead. Wise words of straight talking...?

If she only wants friends that agree with her behaviour she's going to have a lonely life. I think a friend is someone who tries to persuade you not to jump off the bridge ... not someone who offers to hold your coat for when you get back.

She will mess everything up for her romantic fantasy. That's a given. No point worrying about it therefore.

"I wonder if I can shake her verbally "

No you can't. She's not operating rationally or logically at the moment so rational words and logical arguments are not going to work. She is in the grip of an obsession with high emotion, romance, vain hope, self-delusion.... with a big side-order of zero self-esteem for good measure.... and the MM is taking advantage

It is awful being friends with someone who is obsessed with a man she can't have. It's all they talk about, all they think about and permeates the friendship. Actually losing friendships over the situation is a natural consequence to their actions and could possibly make an impact now, but probably it will be later when they think back.

Sounds like she needs some counseling to shore up her self esteem. She needs to get to the point that she knows she is worth better. It might also help her to read some books about men and relationships so she can see what he is doing to her is so common and predictable there are entire books about it. There is nothing special about him and nothing special about their connection. She can make the decision to take back control of her life. But what you can do? Probably very little.

I think a friend is someone who tries to persuade you not to jump off the bridge ... not someone who offers to hold your coat for when you get back

You have such a way with words Cogito, you're brilliant.

Yes, I've tried to persuade her not to jump off the bridge (fuck up her life), she ostracized me for it. We have been slowly building bridges, and I was happy to chat with her about the new man when she confesses to still holding this obsession which I thought was long over with .

She does indeed have friends who have encouraged her with this man. Of course they're the 'best friends who have supported me so much'... whereas I think they've been dangerously misguided and have done her a lot of harm.

I'm scared she'll think that all my advice is just jaded by my negative feelings towards this man - she's said so much herself. I think she's still holding out hope that he'll just leave his wife for her. I hope to god he doesn't, it would be the end of my relationship with her for a start.

I've tried telling her that this lovely new man is showing her what normal is. What its like to not feel insecure, on the edge, play mind games etc. She can see that... and yet then launches back into mind games with OM.

Thank you Wrap, yes it does indeed permeate her entire being. The phone obsession being the outward expression of that, but it runs through her entire life.

She does need counselling. I doubt she ever will take any up though. Ive tried telling her to read various things, including 'The Script', to help her see that all the shite he's feeding her is just cliche. But it doesn't seem to have worked.

She thinks they have an amazing connection, that he 'just understands her', that what they had was so special. It was shagging in the back of his car and WhatsApping when his wife was out of the room.

I'm hoping at the very least that this new bloke will help show her what a normal relationship looks like, and how normal grown men behave who aren't obsessed with their phones and social media, and actually have conversations rather than mind games. But I think this poor bloke will just be used and dropped, unless he drops her first when he realises what she's up to.

Sad and worried for her.

Have you also noticed your friend plays push/pull mind games with you?

One minute you are bessies and chatting about everything, then you are ostracised for having the wrong opinion and not being 100% supportive.

She plays you against her other friends, she plays him and he plays her. They sound very manipulative people.

You sound nice but your previous position of more distanced sounds much better than being dragged in again.

Nothing you can do, except perhaps take a step back. If you still want to be friends, hang out, go to the cinema, less opportunities for her to talk endlessly about OM. Don't expect the drama to stop though, your friend seems addicted to it.

Sadly, her DD recently said to her, when she threatened to take DDs computer games off her for being naughty, that she would take her phone off her.

DD was telling her mother that she had noticed that the most important thing to her was her phone.

when my friend was similarly obsessed, i would let. her prattle on. i would give her an hour and then say 'right, lets go and do something for a couple of hours and not talk about him. she liked historic housrs so we'd mooch around there and it would take her mind off him for a bit. ur friend is manipulating this whole thing and shes addicted. no man, however nice, is going to stand a chance of distracting her so theres no point u trying to talk her round. but tell her not to use this new man as a pawn. my friend got dumped eventually and nearly went mad, she was arrested for harassing the ex. thank god shes over it and has met someone else.

Thenapoleon yes you're absolutely right, she plays mind games with everyone. And yes, she's addicted to him and the drama that goes with him.

I just wish she could see that the affair as it was has skewed her feelings for this man, injected it all with the excitement, the forbidden stuff, the 'me and him against the world' stuff, such that she believes he is the love of her life because she's addicted to him.. but it's not him, its the drama that went with him as much as anything. He's a slimy twat who she would not have looked twice at in different circumstances. And yet she believes he's the love of her life.

Agree with the PP about the big manipulation aspect... How helpful is she when you have any problems I wonder? First on the scene or easily bored & eager to get the conversation back on herself?

I fear that she will indeed use the new man as a pawn. Already has in fact. Felt the need to tell OM that she was seeing someone 'because she owed it to him' my arse.

Felt the need to use new man to goad OM into giving her attention more like.

It's not going to end well is it?

How helpful is she when you have any problems I wonder? First on the scene or easily bored & eager to get the conversation back on herself?

Depends on where she's 'at' mentally. Sometimes she's great, other times very distant. I have distanced myself greatly from her because of the drama and don't share as much with her.

I'm sure she'd be there for me if I needed her though.

She doesn't necessarily talk about herself all the time - she's reluctant to talk about OM with me because she doesn't want to hear my opinions of him.

But she's constantly distracted, checking her phone, whispering to her other friends with the latest 'hilarious' thing he's texted her..

Oh it's just so sad. She was a married mother with loads of friends up until a year ago.

Now she's a shell of a woman, with a permanently haunted look, obsessively checking her phone and going on about how he must have seen her message because there was one tick, and now there's two ticks, and why hasn't he replied, and now he's blocked her, and what does this comment mean on twitter, and, and, and.....

It's just so sad

In fact, my last comment there - I think that's what I'm going to tell her.

She needs to look at who she has become, all because of this man.

I asked her whether he made her happy. She said "Yes, when things were good and we were together". I said "No, did he make you happy overall?". Obviously the answer was no. He devastated her. Why, oh why can't she see that?

u said it urself, shes addicted to the drama. the highs and lows r now her life, but ur right. it wont end well. just b a friend and dont offer advice unless she asks it.

She's a grownup. If she wants to carry on playing attention games with a married ex, she can. But she's a cow if she strings along Mr Nice. He's not a supporting character or her shot at redemption, he's a person who deserves a decent relationship too. If she owes anyone some honesty, it's that guy. And if I were you I wouldn't encourage her towards him if she's not keen enough to treat him decently.

I think she has been honest with Mr Nice and told him everything. It's early days with him, and I think she was just laying her cards on the table.

Too early for him to be possessive about her being in touch with another guy, I guess, which is why he's probably not said too much yet.

I did urge her to keep being completely honest with Mr Nice, as he doesn't deserve to be messed about, and because she needs to be honest with him to have a shot at a relationship with him.

But I did hear some alarm bells that she just wants him to bolster her ego, and give her fodder to flash at OM to make him jealous. If I see any hint of that on Twitter etc, I think Id have to say something. I've seen her do this before, it's not nice.

Hopefully it won't come to that, Mr Nice will just carry on being nice and stable and real, and she'll see Mr SlimeBag for what he is.

I did say to her though, imagine you'd just started seeing a guy and he went on and on about his ex, and kept checking his phone, and told you he wasn't over her... how long would you stick around?

In your shoes I would back off and just not discuss her love life with her it's just feeding her drama.

Why do you hate the married man? Quite strong. He sounds like a knob but your friend is responsible for her choices.

If a friend I met up with was constantly on the mobile interacting with other friends or men it'd piss me off and I would avoid spending time them or tell them it was rude!

And good for her DD for pulling her up on the phone overuse!

I guess hate is a strong word - her words, not mine - but I seriously dislike him. Partly for the awful way in which he has treated her, and how he's behaved in general. And partly because my feelings towards him are mixed up with the way she has treated everyone because of him, which I realize isn't his fault. I guess I hate her obsession with him, because it has damaged her so much.

I think I dislike him because he is clearly using him to bolster his own ego, with little regard for what it's doing to her.

If he loved her, but genuinely couldn't leave his wife, then he would let her go, not keep pulling her back with his wheedling texting and attention seeking. But the if he loved her, he wouldn't have blocked her and forbidden her from ever contacting him again, only for him to get bored and initiate contact himself a few months down the line... would he?