Being a mother to a daughter when you have a difficult relationship with your own mother... how to do it??

[Emeraldgirl2]

I won't ramble on about my own mother but essentially she is (undiagnosed) a hysterical/narcissistic type, hugely judgmental and critical, strict to the point of cruelty, boundary-less in terms of her own emotions (rage, fury, impatience, her way or no way) and utterly unable to accept any emotions from her own children that were not just good behaviour (as if behaviour is an emotion!!) and bland, not-bothering-her cheeriness.

I am always anxious around her, always desperate to please (much much better after years of counselling but I still struggle at times) and she made it clear enough from birth onwards that there were terrible consequences for upsetting her.

I live in fear of ever doing any of this to my own daughter!!!

DD is almost 2 and is a very very high-maintenance toddler, she has absolutely epic meltdowns which I know for a fact my own mum just couldn't cope with/wouldn't tolerate, she once poured a bowl of cereal over my head when I was a toddler because she was tired of me getting upset at breakfast time so I know whereof I speak!! My approach with DD, therefore, is to give her ALL the understanding and emotional support she needs, her meltdowns are not (yet, at least) anything to do with 'naughtiness', they are just because she is tired, frustrated, a toddler with huge emotions she can't always handle. So I cuddle her, tell her it's all OK, that it's OK to be angry/upset/frustrated etc etc - who knows if it's helping but what I want is for her to feel, for now, that I am a sponge who can absorb her scary feelings so she doesn't need to be so overwhelmed by them, so that as she gets older and older she is capable of coping with negative feelings on her own.

But I still worry and worry that I am getting it all horribly wrong because obviously I do need to be firm at times - for example yday she was refusing to have her nap (terrible overtiredness so I knew it wasn't an option to agree) and I had to be quite firm, I wouldn't get her out of the cot though I did stay in the room with her, I told her very firmly that it was time for sleep and then, when she woke up later, I lavished her with praise for being so good and going to sleep in her cot.

I have been worrying, pathologically, ever since, that if I do this repeatedly she will somehow get the message that I only 'like' her when she is good and does what I want her to do.

I know it's meant to be a good idea to praise good behaviour (and ignore 'bad') but how do you get the balance right when you have no role model for it??? I never ever ever want my DD to feel as if mummy only likes her when she does what I want.

Admittedly my own problems with my mum go much deeper than just this worry - I was always made to feel, for example, that my mum's happiness was dependent on me and that I was responsible for it, which is too high a burden for a child to carry, she was probably clinically depressed I guess but that wasn't for me to cope with as a child.

Still, can anyone advise how to do this - manage those times when your child doesn't want to do something that you know they need to do, which lets face iit happen again and again and again - without slowly but surely giving them the impression they are only there to do what you want.

Sorry for rambling post ,I'm in a bit of a pickle this morning.

Well, you're not your mum. Your daughter isn't you. This is present day...

Surely if anything this would make you a better parent as you consciously know what not to do

I know how you feel OP, I constantly worry about this. I have two dd'S and in many ways I wanted boys because if how worried I was about history repeating itself (as stupid as that sounds).

I think the poster above is right, just take it as it comes and use what you went through as a what not to do guide.

Hi I have similar worries. I'm going to look at this book.

www.amazon.co.uk/Parenting-Inside-Out-Self-Understanding-Children/dp/1480560294
I'm trying to be more conscious in my parenting. You sound like you are doing a great job. Just be kind, gentle but firm if necessary for non Negotiational things.

mrscumberbatch I like to think I know what not to do but it is very hard to know, my sister for example has gone so far the 'opposite way' with her own (older) children that they walk all over her, she has obviously wanted never to repliacte our own strict, judgmental upbringing and so never tries to enforce anything at all... I recognise this and don't want that model, either (though i still think it preferable to being frightened of your mother) and though it's easy in theory it can feel much harder in practise IYSWIM?

thanks steben and socks... I'm sorry you feel the same way but glad it;'s not just me.
I was terriby upset (and scared) when I knew I was having a daughter as I was sure I would make the same mistakes my mum did but I guess it helps that I know they are mistakes!

Unconditional Parenting is a good book on this subject.

Thanks - I will get those books on amazon today :)

HeadDoctor, do you know the author's name?

You sound like you're doing fine - you're being understanding when you think that is going to be most helpful, but you're also capable of drawing boundaries and sticking with them when you think that is necessary and appropriate.

IT's good that you're thinking about it, but don't torture yourself - being able to set boundaries and hold them even when they get very cross indeed with you is really important. And ultimately it's anxiety-reducing for the child, because they know that there are limits to what they are going to be allowed to do, and that you will maintain those limits no matter how angry they get, without getting angry yourself.

Alfie Kohn I think for UCP.

I know exactly how you feel OP - I worry constantly about turning into my mother in terms of my parenting (have gone NC with her as she is a manipulative, toxic person). It can be really hard sometimes. I think it's important to remember that you are aware of your parenting and so are extremely unlikely to replicate your mother's parenting as you know what it was like and how horrible it felt.

I strongly suspect that your parenting is so far removed from that of your mother's to make it unrecognisable, but obviously being anxious about it won't help either. Have you thought of counselling at all? It can be really helpful to talk through your fears and, often, just saying them out loud can make you realise that things aren't as bad as maybe you think?

I would really recommend Ahaparenting.com as a fantastic resource for people who consciously do not want to follow their upbringing and wish to set reasonable limits in a peaceful and respectful way.

Good luck, we all struggle to know if we're doing it right, and from the sounds of it, you are.

Triple P parenting courses are supposed to be very good. They lay out how to be positive with the children while still enforcing (healthy) limits. I think you're right - going too far the other way is as dangerous as being too strict.

Good luck.

OP: to be honest, I think you already get it. You realise that your Mum's way caused you damage, but you also know that you can't leave your children without boundaries at all. Enforcing those boundaries is bound to feel anxious at first, but you will get more practice at it as she grows and it will become less nerve-wracking. The fact that you're so aware of the cost of narcissistic parenting means that you are already highly sensitised to avoid this behaviour.

Your DM does sound like an extreme case, but I never yet met a mother who has said 'I want to parent exactly as my own mother did!'. So the value of a role-model is probably considerably less than you think! We are all different people, society changes a lot between our own childhood and our own time of parenting, and everyone has to find their own way, just as you are doing.

thanks everyone!
Great advice on here as always.
It feels very scary indeed when I have to enforce anything at all - naps, putting on coat/shoes etc - and my general approach is to pick my battles as (thanks to the fact that, actually to my eternal joy, I have a very very very strong-willed DD) many things could become a stressful battleground otherwise. But obviously you can't always pick your battles and I do think children need and thrive on boundaries and (fair, non-arbitrary) rules.
ugh, it's tough, isn't it.
good point though that so many people want to parent differently than their parents did, even if their parents weren't actually bad parents.
I'm sure I'm over thinking this but my own experience has been such that I would always rather question myself, in the way my mother did not and could not, than just let stuff slide by. For example a few months ago I found myself getting VERY wound up by my DD's nap refusal and getting very angry with her on two occasions, I am very glad I over-thought that as it made me crack down on myself and I have managed to keep calm about it ever since

Until a few years ago (when I started therapy for panic attacks/anxiety), I used to be really frustrated as to why my DC (1DD/3DSs) were not frightened of me, would not listen and were generally massive pains in the ass. Then I realised that DC being afraid of their mothers (as I was terrified of mine) was not normal and bad behaviour from DC was . I thought I was failing as a mother because they were not scared of me unbelievably!

I also used to use that terrifying line, 'wait til your father get's home' and was perplexed as to why that didn't stop them in their tracks/make them stop killing each other .

I don't know I have managed to be a 'good enough' mother after being massively fucked up by my own mother, just by them knowing that I love them no matter what, probably, and that I want them to enjoy their lives and be happy and they see that (hugs often too, my parents never, ever did that)

My DD is now 18 sheds tears of relief that she is still alive and we row like cat and dog quite often occasionally and I am grateful for that. She does not feel the need to be 'good' for me or to take care of me emotionally so something turned out right.

Echo that the fact that you are 'aware' means that the cycle will stop with you.

Wow, I could have written your post word for word Emerald. I was scared of my mother as a child, and I still am now, even as a successful, professional responsible adult! It's scary just how far-reaching the effects of having a poor mother/daughter relationship are.

I feel the same as you, that I question my every interaction with my DC trying to analyse whether I am too harsh, too scary, too controlling, too rigid, not tuned in to their needs or emotions (all the things my mother was). But that's no way to live!

And I know that even when people reassure you that you are bound to be a better mother, and being aware of it means you won't behave in that way, you still don't quite believe it do you.

I think a key point is that you have had years of counselling, which really will have done so much good in unravelling all this in your head.

Fwiw I think it sounds like you are doing the right things - boundaries without bullying.

I will be buying the books recommended on here and watching with interest.

My mother wasn't terrible, just rather cold and self centred.
The one thing that stands out for me was never feeling good enough, despite achieving quite a lot. I also didn't feel I could show how I felt and certainly never felt very loved.
I make sure I tell both my children I love them at least once a day and my DD talks to me about how she's feeling and if she is upset she shows it, which is great.
What I do is think about what I WOULD have liked from a mother and try to be That mother. I do sometimes hear myself and think it's something my mother would say but most of the time I think I do OK.

Thanks AlwaysOneMissing and Hopping... it does help to know that I'm not the only one worried about this.

The thing that makes me feel anxious about it is because, for example, my mum is always gleefully announcing how she 'never' had to get cross with her children (ha!) and never had to battle with us to do anything, 'you just did it!' in a sort of self-congratulatory way that SHE somehow managed to have really 'good' children (being 'good being the only thing that mattered to her) without really even having to try. So when my own DD is being strong-willed about something (not wanting a coat on, say) I do sometimes think, on some silly gut level, that I must be handling it all wrong because otherwise DD would just do everything happily and calmly and never make a fuss. That is the extent to whicih my mum's view of the world has got to me - I know, logically, that the only reason her children did everything neatly and quietly and tidily was because we were all scared of her, but I still have these sneaking worries that I am making a rod for my own back by not laying down the law a bit more with DD.

Don't know if that makes any sense?

The trouble is that my mum is very very good indeed at whitewashing history (she doesn't remember all the times she screamed at us for not doing things right, or even the day to day constant impatient chivvying to keep us up to standard) and also, probably, doesn't even need to whitewash because she wouldn't recognise anything she did as a sign of bad parenting. She wouldn't ever have been worried that a near-constant bad mood, even if you're not actually yelling, is surely bound to 'teach' children that they're better off toeing the line and not troubling you.

It's this that I live in fear of with my DD - her not 'troubling' me. I want her to trouble me!!! I never want her to conceal or bury her emotions in order to make room for mine. I just worry that, despite my best intentions, I might somehow do this by mistake. I know that may sound silly but it's hard to shake off.

The only thing I know for sure I am doing right that is the opposite of my mum is that I constantly cuddle DD (almost never put her down, in fact, she is a Velcro child who loves ot be held) and tell her all the time how much I love her and what a lucky mummy I am to have her. None of which my mum ever did with me, I don't actually recall a single cuddle or snuggle, not even when we were ill or upset. So that's one thing I do feel confident about at least I suppose.

You already have what you need, OP - insight. The wisdom to know that your mother was a very poor parent to you, and that the things she did are going to be the things you should not do. It is hugely powerful.

Picking your battles, setting boundaries and being firm are all sound strategies to use with all toddlers. And they all have meltdowns about stupid things like not putting on coats, not wanting naps. Because they are toddlers. I think you know quite well that your idea of being the 'perfect' parent would give you the 'perfect' always smiling and compliant toddler is bollocks. You are smarter than that. You clearly know that toddlers need lots of cuddles, closeness and affection and you are capable of giving those things - that says a lot about you.

By all means get books if you feel they would help, but I think they would only affirm the things you already know and the things you are already doing.

Lastly, I am that daughter of a mother who had a dysfunctional relationship with her own mother. My mother did everything right because she too had learned how not to do it. You are doing this too.

Oh my how this resonated with me. I have a ds (2yrs) but don't think gender makes any difference as I could still fuck him up!

My mother is narc/hysterical too.

I think you're doing great op, and this thread has made me feel better as I do all the things you are too.

Also my ds is very highly strung too! It's been very testing hasn't it!

This resonated with me too. I didn't really have a single mother figure during my childhood, but was brought up by my two grandmothers at various times. One of those was most definitely narc, the other cold, distant and unemotional. I have two DC, but struggled most with my DD now 4 (who I claim could still out-tantrum your average 2 year old, but was a sight to behold at two). I feel lost without that good role model.

My DS is now 2, and I can only assume his sister taught him all she knew. It's a tricky age.

I think you have to trust that because of your experiences you know what isn't good parenting, what didn't give you support and love, and can trust your instinct to do something else.

No-one gets it right all the time, not even those with lovely supportive parents, so OP it really sounds like you are doing well.

Another book to consider is No Drama Discipline. It's along the same lines as unconditional parenting, but very practical and I am loving the advice it contains about keeping a connection and making sure your children know you love them all the time, not just when they are well behaved, yet still maintaining boundaries.

I have a dodgy relationship with my mum too and share a lot of your worries. My DC are older and I hear myself criticising DD in the same way my mum did me, it terrifies me, but I'm working on it.