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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is it abuse or incompatibility: am I wrong or right: is the grass greener the other side?

48 replies

Rockover · 23/10/2014 11:08

Hello everyone. This is my first post. I have been watching for a while and wanted to contribute, but I find it hard to reach out when I'm holding myself in, if that makes sense.

My OH is regarded generally as a kind, generous man. But behind closed doors it is a different story. He can be moody, unpredictable, critical and mean. It seems to be about money, although perhaps it is control. I work part-time, over 5 days, squeezing in the hours between the school run for my little boy. We aren't married and I got pregnant very quickly, so our life together has pretty much always been 'with child'. He has been married and has two other children. My financial contribution has always been food, childcare costs and holidays/social contributions. My role has been primary carer for our son, housework, cooking, etc. He earns a high salary but pays a massive amount of school fees for his other children.

He states that he thinks I should be working full-time. That I should contribute 50% financially to all costs bar mortgage. That's food, utilities, bills, holidays, socialising. He earns 6x what I do. He doesn't offer any solutions in terms of childcare now our son has started school, just says other women manage. I did work full-time for 6 months when our son was at nursery, but it was miserable. I paid almost half my salary towards childcare, my son was angry and miserable, I was tired and sad. I still got home before OH so the childcare, cooking and housework still fell to me. Now our son is at school and the thought of managing the school run and finding childcare provision during all those term breaks when he is so small. Some mothers do manage, I know...

He says I don't buy the food he likes. I don't cook the food the way he would like it. I made too much washing up, using two pans instead of one. I left a pile of laundry over there. I didn't rinse the bath properly. It goes on. He compliments my body and my face but can't find anything nice to say about my personality or character. I ask if I can have a glass of wine, or a bit of food he has bought, or a cup of coffee as historically he has become very angry if I 'helped myself' or gave our son food he has brought. He sometimes says no, I can't, or says yes on the understanding I will replace it. I buy my own wine, or ham, vegetables, etc, to avoid this conflict. Then he goes ballistic if food is wasted (which it is, as often we have doubled up on things). He tells me I sing too loudly, that my voice is screechy. He tells me that I am a sponger, a user. He says I am manipulative. If I lose my temper he says I am crazy and an unfit mother.

I jump when I hear his car door slam. I rush around before he is due home, making sure the washing up is done, the house looks tidy, there aren't toys lying around. I feel sick a lot, wondering what I am going to do to upset him next. He can turn from loving and funny to cold and hurtful in a second. He will be cold for days if I upset him and only warm if I cry and show remorse for whatever it was I did.

He says if I talk to my parents or my friends about our relationship he will end it. He repeats often that the house is his.

I am articulate, but I find I cannot argue with him. I get tied in knots. The bigger picture is lost over a minor detail and nothing is resolved. I recognise that he goads me to lose my temper, at which point he has 'won', but there is no winning, whatever I do.

We don't talk about holidays and haven't had a real holiday for a couple of years, as I cannot afford to pay for half of the type of holiday he wants. He has taken his other kids away. If we go out for a meal or find ourselves in a supermarket together, I get half the money out to pay but he won't accept it in public and gets angry that I tried.

I could contribute a bit more financially to the household, but I don't think it will make a difference to his attitude. He spends over £30,000 a year on private school fees but our son is my financial responsibility. He thinks nothing of spending several hundred pounds on a luxury. Am I wrong in squirrelling away £50 'just in case' instead of contributing to the electricity bill?

It got physical for the first time about a month ago, when I lost my temper. He tried to shut me out the house, I fought my way in, he tried to drag me out. It hurt. Things have been calmer since. I said and he agreed that it was better to call it a day. He asked how I would manage and I said 'with difficulty'. Then he was loving towards me. But a couple of nights ago he got angry when I asked if he could think about taking some of his leave during holiday times, as my leave couldn't begin to cover this. He said that my job contributed nothing to the household and what was the point if I couldn't even cover the childcare. I felt too defeated to defend myself. He was meant to pick our son up from school as I had to work but said he was going to spend time with his other kids.

Our son has had trouble adapting to school. He witnessed the violence above and wet his bed. He has been acting out and biting and hitting. He heard his dad say he thought something was wrong with him. It was my OH saying this about my son that took me to the point I said it was time to end it. I think it's another control thing but this is his area of expertise and it cut deep.

I am not entitled to spousal maintenance. I have no claim to the house and couldn't afford it if I did. His arrangement with his ex is private, but I am sure he will pay only the minimum child maintenance for our son. It wouldn't be enough to rent privately in this area.

I feel entirely trapped. I have stood in the doorway wanting to step away from him and our son. My love and patience for my child is distorted by the feeling of being trapped. My perspective isn't right and I'm finding it hard to make decisions.

Thanks for listening x

OP posts:
Rockover · 23/10/2014 20:12

That sounds really familiar matchsticks. I got to the point where I wouldn't start cooking until I had checked what he wanted. But he often wouldn't say what he wanted and rejected all my suggestions. He used to get annoyed if dinner wasn't ready when he got home (bearing in mind he came home at different times, I had been working, and was trying to get DS to eat, bath, story and bed at the same time as cook a grown up dinner). So I tried calling to check what time he would be home and he accused me of harassing him. You just can't win. I'm so glad you made it out. No settlement for me though - it's a lifetime of renting I think...

OP posts:
Rockover · 23/10/2014 20:18

BertieBotts I think you are right. Reliance on maintenance = lack of autonomy and security. But with rent prices so high it's hard to see how the maintenance wouldn't be an essential...

OP posts:
Rockover · 23/10/2014 20:18

He's back.

OP posts:
BertieBotts · 23/10/2014 21:01

Are you in London or somewhere else? In London I could see it would be hard. Elsewhere it's doable. Granted you're stuck looking at the lowest 5-10% of properties in areas which are actually practical, and there's a high level of outright refusal, so it will probably take longer to find somewhere, but it's doable. If you went via a refuge, you have homeless status too which pushes you up the list for council housing. Depending on what kind of area you live in, that might be useful or might just reduce the waiting list from "sometime next century" to "some time in the next 10 years". If you applied for council housing from your current situation, it's basically down to the discretion of the housing officer as to whether you're in danger where you are.

Yes you'll be borrowing out of child benefit/ESA/child tax credits to pay your rent, but it is manageable. Shovel maintenance into that bills account whenever you get any but don't budget as though it's coming unless it's definitely already arrived.

I don't know what your situation is now with access to money but I know when I first left my ex, he had controlled my access to money so much that the small amount of benefits I had to live on seemed like a fortune, I was so used to stretching out money. I never spent all of it, until I had extra childcare costs due to studying. If you don't have debts, childcare without paid work, or other extra costs (medical, transport, perhaps?) it's easily livable on.

Charley50 · 23/10/2014 21:52

He's worse than awful. You and your DS will be so much happier and safer without him. You can get benefits tax credits etc don't worry.

mummytowillow · 23/10/2014 22:33

He's an arse I'm sorry.

I'm a lone parent, I work part time to fit in with school hours. I have a lovely rented house, a modest but pleasant enough lifestyle.

I have no spare cash for holidays but I'm happy!

I get tax credits, working tax credits, a small amount of housing benefit and child maintenance off my ex.

You can do this, you need to think about how this affects your child that will give you the courage to do it.

Entitledto will give you an idea of what help you can get.

Take care Thanks

catseyes10 · 23/10/2014 22:47

Oh Rock, honey, just think about how good it will feel to tuck your DS in safely to his bed, go downstairs, pour yourself a glass of wine and have some food all WITHOUT HAVING TO ASK Permission!!! Please don't put up with this shit any more than you have already. Xx

yetanotherchange · 23/10/2014 23:04

Everything you describe is without doubt abuse, and the bit about you not being allowed to give your son food that HE has bought is just horrific. The man is a savage.

You WILL find a far, far better place for yourself and your gorgeous little boy than where you are now. You've already taken the first step, keep going, one step at a time xxx

nicenewdusters · 23/10/2014 23:15

So sorry for the situation you're in. He's a controlling, insecure bully - I know because I lived with one for far too long. They're so predictable it's boring, almost like they have a script to follow.

I'd forgotten until I read your post that my ex and I used to 50/50 everything, despite having bought a house together and he earning slightly more than me most of the time. How is that being a couple ? They normalise such weird behaviour that you don't even see it's odd at the time.

You can't fix your relationship because you can't fix him, and you don't have to. I can remember never wanting to arrange anything without his agreement because there would always be a problem with my choices. If he went to bed I went because otherwise I'd wake him up, didn't matter I might not be tired. But he could go to bed after me and wake me ! He criticised my choice of books, tv, radio progs, music, friends, family, everything. There was nothing wrong with me - he was a dick.

Luckily we didn't have children. I walked away from everything to be rid of him - job, home (got my half eventually!), car, friends. I moved back in with my parents where he fetched up, practically begging me to come back. I just held my hatred in my heart for him and repeated no.

Excellent advice above about planning your escape, and that's what it is, unfortunately. I'd try and keep out of his way as much as possible, and let your family know that you're planning on leaving. No point engaging in any argument/discussion with him. He's an excuse for a man, actually a person. Physically shrink him down in size in your mind. Imagine putting all the things he's said in your op as coming out of a child's mouth - look how pathetic he sounds ?

You knew you were right before you posted here. Hopefully our replies will show you there is a way out, and I know we're no different to you, no super powers or a million quid in the bank. Good luck.

Planetwaves · 23/10/2014 23:28

Oh love please get rid of him :( get to a decent family solicitor ASAP and take him to the cleaners as much as you can. What a horrible man :( Flowers

Rockover · 24/10/2014 07:49

Not in London, Bertiebotts, but rent prices around here are about £850+ pm. I have 2 debts, currently paying 2 x £100pm, will be cleared at that rate in 6 months and 12 months. I own a one bed flat, but it's in negative equity. As well as being tied into a long-term tenancy agreement, it being a one bed, an ASBO neighbour upstairs, it's too far away to commute to work, fit in school runs, access family support, etc. I'm in debt because of the flat, the rent is 'income' but swallowed up by mortgage, maintenance and management fees, but if I sell it I'll be paying a mortgage off with no rental. It feels like the proverbial millstone. My part-time salary is insufficient to extend the mortgage and transfer it to another property.

Re maintenance. I think that with his salary, it works out at 17% with the whole first £800, percentage thereafter thing. But I also think that sum is then divided by three, as he has three children. Bearing in mind he is paying over £30,000 in private school fees for his other children, DS would get a fraction of what they are getting. There is no way he would pay for private education for DS. I wouldn't actually want that anyway and it isn't all about the money, but the inequity smarts a bit.

His ex is in a high powered job. I'm not and never have been. I work in helping professions, which don't pay particularly well, but I enjoy making a difference. I was doing that when OH and I met. There has been a 25% reduction in my salary and extra expenses as a result of DS. I have asked him why he got together with me, knowing what I earn, and he said he thought I 'had the potential to earn more'. I won't even go down that road.

Why is it so hard to name it as 'abuse' yourself? Controlling, no problem. Unkind, petty, even cruel. Intellectually I know it, emotionally too, and yet I rationalise his behaviour, remember the good things...

Facing life as a single parent, taking DS away from his daddy, starting a new school (probably) when we are all just making friends, staying strong at work, staying strong at home... I know I can do it, but it looks terrifying. You are all so brave.

I'm not usually one for looking for the reasons why not, but I'm tired.

I will call Women's Aid today. Thank you all again for your stories and your support X

OP posts:
Rockover · 24/10/2014 08:03

Just realised I have repeated myself re the maintenance thing, either going crazy or it must be on my mind!

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 24/10/2014 09:16

" You are all so brave. "

Bravery is relative. Your environment is not allowing you to be brave. Your confidence has been smashed by living with a bully (if you don't like the word abuse) and that has become a barrier all by itself. If you wait until you feel brave or strong or whatever before you act, you will never get there because he is deliberately crushing all of those things out of you. The other influence is that captivity can be easily mistaken for security. However bad your living situation, you'll be rationalising that at least you have a roof over your head, your DS is at school, you have access to money occasionally...

So think about that. Ask for help to get away and you'll find that the bravery and strength finds you.

CinnabarRed · 24/10/2014 09:25

Can we talk about maintenance a moment?

I'm under the impression - perhaps wrongly - that you think he has some discretion over how much maintenance he would have to pay for your DS (not for you - for your son).

I don't think it works that way. I don't know what absolute sum he would have to pay collectively for his children, obviously, but your son is entitled to his fair share of it.

Suppose, for the sake of argument, the total "pot" of maintenance for all three children was £33,000. Your son should be due maintenance of £11,000. It doesn't matter one jot if he chooses to continue to pay £30,000 in school fees for his other children - your DS is still entitled to his £11,000. Because your OH would be choosing to overpay for his other children, and you might well feel that's unfair - and it is - but he can't refuse to support your DS.

Get legal advice, pronto.

Rockover · 24/10/2014 13:26

Yes, I need legal advice cinnebar. I do understand that he is required by law to pay a minimum amount. I was just making the point that it seems unfair he will be paying 7x more to his other children, but I understand that is his choice. It's just another example of the difference in his attitude and behaviour towards them and DS/me. Well, I'm assuming that is how it will pan out, anyway. Perhaps when his relationship with DS is no longer 'tainted' by his feelings about me and is part-time, he will be as loving and generous towards him as he is to them.

Cogito you are so right that captivity can be confused for security. I'm just starting to let go of that. The security is an illusion, isn't it?

Anyone got any advice re the flat situation?

OP posts:
Rockover · 24/10/2014 13:29

P.s. The pot is nowhere near that!

OP posts:
CinnabarRed · 24/10/2014 14:14

There's a great quote from Billy Bragg song - "As long as you're comfortable it feels like freedom".

You've stopped being comfortable, and rightly so.

ImperialBlether · 24/10/2014 14:22

Hi, OP - I can't see what's so terrifying about leaving this monster! Close your eyes now and think about the freedom you'll have - freedom to breathe easily, to eat what you like, to say what you like.

What is his area of expertise that enables him to say something is wrong with your child, whilst not taking your child for help? Is he a medic? A teacher? Who the hell does he think he is, saying that?

I wonder whether his ex mixes with friends of his, so he wants them to have this image of him as a successful man, funding three sets of school fees. I've no idea how they do that on £60,000 - his ex must put a lot into it, too.

I don't know what the rules are about having two sets of children and treating them differently financially. Maybe a lawyer on here could advise?

Personally I'd get rid, rent a place on my own (with child) and tell him to fuck off. He's a manipulative, pathetic prick.

GoatsDoRoam · 24/10/2014 14:24

Your situation is awful, lovely, but you are not trapped.

From what appears in these posts, you are clearly very intelligent, insightful, articulate and capable.

You can do it.

kentishgirl · 24/10/2014 14:36

I know it all feels very daunting, so much to do, so much to sort out, so much that is going to be difficult and awkward to get arranged. You are right, it is.

BUT, you'll have 2 or 3 months of complete pain the arse getting it all sorted, and then it stops...and life is a hell of a lot better.

Living like this will go on forever.

Which is actually less difficult overall?

Don't be afraid. Take it all one step at a time and you'll cope. Your confidence has been sapped by this awful, abusive man. You'll be amazed how quickly it will flood back once you start taking control over your life. The powerlessness you feel now is an awful, draining way to live. Take control of one thing, and that powerlessness is reduced. It boosts your confidence and gives you the strength to deal with everything you have to do. It's quite amazing how different you feel once you start. Promise.

Quitelikely · 24/10/2014 14:39

OP when did you last have your flat evaluated? Are you certain it's in negative equity, prices have increased lately and maybe it's worth more than you think?

I think some difficult decisions are needed. I know you said no to living in your flat again but would you reconsider? After all if you went to the council then they could re house you in any old area. You have some points to get to the top of the register for housing once you inform them that you are living in an abusive situation.

Similarly you could go to a refuge (via WA)

God he sounds so vile. Do not let him crush you, you're a strong, intelligent woman and even if you don't leave straight away I'm confident that once you have a plan in place for yourself and your son that you will get yourself away from this awful man.

Can family or friends help you out?

Quitelikely · 24/10/2014 14:40

Not evaluated Confused I'm going bit dolly dimple lately!

Abilly72 · 24/10/2014 18:41

Why oh why are you with this person[he is not a man in any sense] somehow get help and get away from such an awful situation

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