please tell me why I can't cut out my abusive mother

[thatthingonyournose]

She does and (more often) says some horrible things to me. It has been like this since I was a child. It has been so accepted now for decades that I am her punchbag, even by other family members and friends, that there is something inside of me that is scared to change the status quo and I don't know why.

Some part of me knows that I have been dealing with it for years and now have installed some kind of personal overdraft facility for her insults, which keeps a reserve of energy to deal with the abuse when it comes.

In the times when she has completely and utterly crossed the line (and these have been extreme, often violent physical attacks or betrayals) I have retaliated with anger and cut her out. The longest period was for two years.

Whenever I do this, she cries and begs and becomes so sad and depressed and pitiful with apologies, and I see how empty she is inside. She is like a child. I can't bear the thought of her feeling this kind of desperation, and I don't know why. After a while I feel that I am strong enough to take it and I have to love her because I'm her daughter and she doesn't really mean what she says, and I let her back in and the abuse starts again.

The abuse is so belittling. That I am a pathetic, desperate, worthless, fat or unattractive, how no-one likes me. I made a speech at my own wedding and she heckled me during it. My father for some reason expects me to just absorb these abusive comments. Sometimes he even laughs at them, as if she is being entertaining or is a comedian. I think he thinks I just let them go over my head, which of course is what I appear to do - because she seems to thrive on my weakness - so I've had to learn over the years to at least appear like they have no affect at all - as that at least guarantees that they will stop after a little while. In the past when I have shown that a comment has wounded me deeply, she has slashed the wound open again and again.

A visit from her consists of her throwing poison arrows constantly from the moment she walks in.

Her: "You think you're so great, don't you?" (laughs,) "you think you have the perfect little life, but it's all a sham. You were nothing until you met your husband."

Me: Oh please, stop talking bullshit.

Her: "Deep down you know it's true. You know that no-one is going to tell you the truth apart from me - but when you hear it you can't take it."

Me: Right. (Rolls eyes) Would anybody like tea? (goes to kitchen)

Her: (shouting down the corridor) "You look awful in that skirt. You need to completely cover up otherwise you will become a laughing stock. No wonder Brian dumped you." (my ex)

Me: (ignoring) How are you? How's the house?

Her: (Looking at my wedding picture on the wall.) "Here you are posing again. I'd be embarrassed of this picture if I were you. It's arrogant to have photos up. Does your DH actually like women on the more overweight side? Or did he just feel sorry for you?"

The last visit she upset me so much that I sobbed for two hours after she left. I wait until I close the door and then I cry. DH got back and asked me what had happened, was furious and drafted her a fuming email telling her to never set foot back in our house, but for some reason I just couldn't let him send it, partly because I didn't want her to see me as weak or to know the things she said really affected me (and confirm in her mind that somehow they were true) and partly because I knew that whatever I was feeling right now, she would feel 10X worse upon receipt of the email. It's like abusing me is her lifeline. She hates herself more than she hates me. Does that make sense?

She once asked me to fix the internet on her computer as she doesn't know huge amount about technology. I went on to safari and saw that she had done about a hundred google searches about me online with association words like where I lived and my husband's name, his company, some of our friends and things like "affair," "liar," "criminal record," "vile."

When it's your own mother it is very hard to know what to do. She and I are so ingrained in this dynamic now - it's a part she's carved out for me since I was very, very young, so it's almost like I don't feel what's missing anyway - like being born without a limb or something. And now she is old.

The pain I will feel from cutting her out would almost be worse than the pain I feel from receiving her abuse, and I really don't know why?

Can anybody shed any light on why this is?

Your mother reads to me like a narcissist and an engulfing type one at that. Narcissists make for being deplorably bad parents anyway, not just to say abusive ones.

You may well subconsciously think on some level that she will one day change and say a heartfelt and sincere sorry for all the abuse she has put your through since childhood. You as an adult still want your parents approval, approval they will never give you.

You likely feel very scared of cutting contact even though this is something you must absolutely do because she has made you an extension of her and you feel you are nothing without her. She has controlled you your whole life. You have to cut her off completely for your own self because you need to start properly living and you will need to have to grieve for the mother/daughter relationship you simply have not and will not have.

You need to fully and properly accept that she saying sorry is never going to happen, you have to let go of that fantasy that is also trapping you within this dysfunctional abusive relationship.

It is NOT your fault your parents are like this; your dad also failed you abjectly as a parent by being the weak bystander and acting out of self preservation and want of a quiet life. He failed to protect you from the abuse and is also complicit. Men like your dad often see women like your mother as someone to idolise; their love for each other is more likely than not an unhealthy co-dependency.

If you were to become a parent yourself it goes without saying that these young people should have no contact at all with your parents.

Do read the Stately Homes thread and post on there too.

Have you ever talked about your father's role with your counsellor? Because although you may think he's nicer/abused by her etc, he's actually her enabler. He sits quite happily married to her, doing her bidding (including abusing you) for a quiet life.

Neither of your parents are fulfilling the role of a parent in any way so I don't think you have any obligation to fulfil the role of a child to them. Being a parent consists of far more than feeding and clothing you, that's actually the easy bit. A real parent gives love, nuturing and cherishing and neither of yours appears to have bothered with this at all.

I agree quitelikely - I feel really perturbed by this post as well.
OP you've been brought up knowing this awful treatment as normal and just something you have to learn to deal with.
You love your mother because you are a normal, empathetic, loving, kind person. Your mother does not share those traits, and she is none of those things to you in return. This is not of your doing, and certainly nothing you can do anything about, in regards to changing her behaviour. There is something fundamentally rotten within your mum that she is compelled to indulge. Had it not been you, her target would have been someone else. Of that there is no doubt.

However, what you have on your side is the power to decide what you will and will not put up with. You are not obliged whatsoever to offer yourself up for her abuse.
You can't see the wood for the trees because you're in it, and I understand why you feel reluctant to rid yourself of her malevolent influence on your life, but try to see that you have come to see this deeply fucked up situation as something you have to accept simply because she's your mother. To the rest of us, she's a monster that shows up to grind you into the dirt.

Ridding yourself of this witch and her pack of flying monkeys will be hard for you to see through, but please know there isn't a single person here who wouldn't consider it the best thing you could ever do.

Okay, you have managed to cut her out for periods of up to 2 years before now.

So there are two problems to cutting her out: the begging and the pleading and the feelign that it's permanent.

Regarding permanence, if you go NC it doesn't have to be forever. You can get back in contact at any time. But try going NC for a period, just to give yourself a break to recover. You can end it at any time.

You can end it at any time, but that ending needs to be under your control not under hers. So, how can you withstand the begging and pleading?

What I'd suggest is that you say "okay, we will be in contact, but not just yet. I will let you know when, and it won't be that long". So give her what she wants, but practise controlling when. Keep practising that.

as to why you can't cut her out, Im guessing wildly here but it may be that the desperation for mother-love is too deep. If she's been doing this since you were small, the normal filling-you-up with love that most mothers do has been profoundly disrupted and like a dog that's been beaten too often but still comes back, you can't yet make the break.

If all else fails, can you consider moving away 'for your husband's new job' thatthing? (No blame here); i think it's possible that in fact your might be putting the relationship with your mother over the relationship with your husband. He must be broken-hearted at seeing you treated like this and how upset you are.

I liked dionethediabolist's post further down.

Her straight up "that was rude, please leave/I am leaving" would be a great start for you.

Decide that from now on in, you will not be her stooge any longer. When she is rude, put her out or leave.

Dear OP,

Your post rings so many bells with me. I have a narcissistic mother who has always been the engulfing type and had a long running thread on here 2 years ago. www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/1565077-My-mother-hates-my-husband-long we lived with her at that stage and her rage was more directed at my DH (as I think she saw him as competition) but many of the same issues (and issues that others have mentioned) were at play:
put downs
denying
hysterical behaviour if pulled up on them
me putting her above everyone else including myself
Things settled into lower contact after we moved out but she has engineered another explosion and we have been NC for about six weeks. I won't lie, going NC was hard (although she pretty much forced my hand) but the relief of not interacting with her is immense.
I think Meerka gives some great advice, but above all you have to get away from her, she will grind you down to nothing with her hate and rage and bitterness.

Agreed she will grind you down into nothing, or worse into self-hatred.

Aussiebean thankyou for your posts. No personal information is what my DH keeps telling me with regards to my own parents. It is brilliant advice as a starter for dealing with this abusive behaviour, kind of like putting up a barrier and preventing her getting in.
OP you have had brilliant advice here. You deserve a better life than fearing her next words.

Cutting her out may feel painful at first. Get your DH to help you stay strong.

Once you start to live your life without this abuse, you will be amazed at how much happier you are.

Walk away from this woman and never, ever look back. There is a happiness and self esteem out there with your name on it. All you need to do it turn away from the abuse and welcome them into your life.

Don't let your DH write the email telling her to get out of your life. Do it yourself today.

You don't owe her anything. No second chances. Please walk away today.

I haven't read all the posts, sorry. I loved Dione's suggestion about the naughty child. You suspect you didn't implement it well when you tried it before... Maybe time to try again, with your new understanding of what she's doing to you. Also, I think you can make yourself a practical rule that you won't see her alone, or surrounded only by her enablers (your father, and any of the people who feel sorry for her). Make sure your husband is there, or a good friend: someone who is unquestionably there for you, and who can help you see any vileness for what it really is.

There was something rather telling in your original post, where you described the occasions when you have "retaliated with anger" and cut her out. I think that's very natural, but not the most compelling reason for cutting her out. That's because anger is very hard to sustain, and once it goes, there goes your motivation for keeping her out of your life. If you do come to believe that you can't have her in your life, you need to make the decision in relative calm. You would have very valid, logical reasons for doing so, but they should be based around what's good for you and your immediate family, not what you hope will punish her. The decision should be proactive, not reactive.

Keep working with your counsellor, and/or maybe one who specialises in abusive relationships. I've found in counselling that sometimes there's a knot so tight, you have to unpick everything around it, consolidate your work in the areas you've already made progress and then, somehow, one day it'll suddenly fall away, apparently of its own accord. Have you found any techniques that help you outside sessions? I find journalling a great way to get in a bit of "homework" on the really stubborn problems, while my husband swears by mindfulness meditation.

Cutting her out (and the rest of the family who think your place is under their boots) may be painful and disturbing and noisy, but it WILL END! And the end will be peace.
If you DON'T go nc, it will be painful and disturbing and noisy for ever -even when she is gone there will be other members of the family who will take over. Because they are as ingrained into abusing you as she is.

Poor you OP i agree you want your Mum to be the mother you need,like other peoples Mums.
My DM has said and done some awful things to me and one of my sis and makes excuses not to come round to my house in the same town as hers ( it is clean tidy and paid for) but no not good enough.
When she was diagnosed with terminal cancer i decided to forget previous unpleasantness from her.My sis is still nc with them as she feels just because they are ill it doesnt change their behaviour.
I have always hoped that one day they would say something nice about me or my DCs,occaisionally they do but mostly it is just put downs.
I throw myself into work...my distraction from the hurt she can dish out and so i notice it less on b days and xmas when she does things with my siblings or their dcs and not with me or mine.My heart goes out to you as i cant believe your own DM is so rude.

what I know how you feel. I was no contact with my parents for 20 years and then they came looking for me. I told them in email that I didn't want to see them and then they pulled the illness card and I relented. At first I was over the moon to have parents again and in my mobile phone list. The bitchy subtle comments started immediately though and I just turned a blind eye as I always had but deep down I was hurt all over again and distraught that they could still have that effect on me. This was two years ago and they still cause me pain. They live in another country so I don't have to see them but I tense every time the phone rings. They seem lovely on the surface but make the usual digs and sly comments that I never challenge.

Hmm...another one here. My mother is a total bitch. She is diagnosed BPD, but that may explain it, it doesn't begin to address the damage it has done to me.

I have been in therapy for YEARS, trying to come to terms with it. I was watching old video tapes last week, and watched her revolting sexual approaches to my step son, and my then husband..who she did go on to sleep with.

Being reminded of that behaviour, and how "normal" it seemed at the time shocked me, and totally validated the decision to go NC, not just for me but for my children too. I imagined her sexually approaching my teenage son And she would have. THANK GOD I prevented that from happening.

Not just the weird sex stuff, but the belief that I was born evil, her excruciating jealousy of me, her desire to have my life.....possibly literally.

Project yourself into a future and look back, like watching a video...and then change the channel. You deserve SO much better than this.

queen glad you in a better place now and have protected your own children.
I remember the weird sexual stuff my parents did in front of me. I tried to pretend I didn't see it and act normal (why I don't know) but all I wanted was to have a normal family and normal parents. I was an only child too. I would love to really really shout at them both and tell them exactly what I feel and think of all the stuff they have done but I haven't and I wont. I had therapy and that helped a lot but just having them back in my life now causes me so much grief and pain and tears. Im a bloody grown up ( over 40) now too ......grrrrrrr!!!!. Why. I just don't understand how anyone can consciously treat their own child the way some of them did. It feels normal at the time but its not, its just so not.

I can't imagine that anyone will tell you that you can't cut contact with your abusive mother. Your husband is absolutely right, cutting all ties with her is absolutely the right thing to do, given that you don't appear to be considering going to the police about the numerous physically violent assaults she has inflicted upon you.

You can block her number, you can ignore her messages. Her feeling sorry for herself because her abuse target isn't around is not your problem.

I think you should go no contact but i understand that might be hard for you to do at once so i would echo what someone else said earlier in the thread, if you see her have your husband beside you at all times. If it starts leave.
I wouldn't even get into a discussion about it - just go.

Then every time from then on - as soon as the abuse starts you say "OK. It's time for me to go now."
Don't let her come round to your house - you've made plans, you're busy etc

Then if things stay as bad as they currently are - then no contact and stick to it.

This

because I knew that whatever I was feeling right now, she would feel 10X worse upon receipt of the email. It's like abusing me is her lifeline. She hates herself more than she hates me

is where you are blocked.

You have worked hard to recognise the abuse but you are shielding yourself from the bitterness of the truth with this. You tell yourself that somehow you are valuable to her, a 'lifeline'. It isn't true. Standing up for yourself wouldn't hurt her at all; she would LOVE to get an email like that. It would be drama food and drink to her. When she cries, it is to get attention and make you out to be the bad guy.

Naughty child will not work (and you know it doesn't work, it is just your dynamic to blame yourself) because you will be giving her what she wants - more excuses for drama, blaming you, abusing you. She goads you because she WANTS the reaction.

Get out and get clear. If you feel you owe her anything, go to the police about the physical abuse you have suffered. This might mean she has to face up to her issues and get treatment - it is the kindest thing you can do for her.

What balia says. Actually, going along with this abusive behaviour is the worst thing for her as well as for you. The problem is that when you are the child of someone like this, its near impossible to stand up to them, the conditioning runs so deep.

But it's true. The more people nearby tolerate this sort of behaviour, the more the person thinks it's ok to behave like that. Curbing it is the kindest thing possible.

You have my utmost sympathy and understanding on this, OP