Revelations about Narcissistic Personality Disorder

[JustAPondering]

....Erm, I think my Mum had it. My head is spinning. I'm a regular MNetter but NC because some of my friends/family know my NN.

I have a quick look on the Stately homes thread and the first post got me thinking. I started reading about NPD and I think my Mum had it. From what I've read, she was engulfing, I was the scape goat and my sister was the golden child. I will try not to drip feed but I suspect as I read and post more, more revelations will come to light.

Mum died several years ago. Mum was at times very loving (which makes me doubt all this) but was extremely volatile too. I remember hiding in my wardrobe from her at times because I was so scared. She was very particular about how are wanted things and would lose her temper if we didn't meet those standards. My Dad was very passive in all of this. Never argued back, just waited til she calmed down or moved on to the next thing. She could also cover well - she would often be fuming with us whilst making nice with others around us.

A few memories have come back - she called me a 'slut' once because my room was messy (by her standards). I can remember the one and only time she apologised to me - I was 17 and stood up for myself when I had 'failed' to do something she asked of me. Once I had flu when she had a bad back. She made me go and hang the washing out even though I nearly fainted from the exertion. She told me I was such a difficult baby/child that if she'd had me first she wouldn't have had any more! She told me I like sprouts (I don't). She even told me I wore a size 6 shoe when I wear a 7. She was so convincing I tried on a 6 when shopping! It was only when I couldn't get my foot in the shoe I realised she was wrong.

I was bullied in primary school. I told her repeatedly about the bullying but she never did anything about it. Never went in to school to complain. My sister had problems with her friends and she intervened for her.

I've always struggled with anxiety and had depression several times that seemed to come out of nowhere. I struggle with my own opinions and self-belief.
When Mum died I said to DH that in a way it was a relief because now there was a reason for me to be like I am. I miss her a lot (I think!) but in some ways I'm relieved she's not here. I have a DD (18mo) and I know she'd be influencing things.

I'm reading You're not crazy, it's your mother. Quite enlightening but it does say about your mother never loving you. I'm finding this bit particularly distressing because I think (or thought she did) in her own weird way. How do I ever resolve that?!

Add jn to all this that I think her mother has NPD too. Always very self-absorbed, argued with Mum a lot. Almost delighted with her husband and daughter died because it got her so much attention. She has dementia now thought which seems to have changed her.

I also think my MIL has NPD. One SiL has gone NC with her and DH was NC did several years. Fortunately she lives a long way feel us so we have limited contact with her (DH's choice). She does the classics like trying to give DD lots of sugary treats, buys lots of presents. She is very manipulative at times.

So I guess I just wanted to put all of this down and ask if you think my thinking is right (can't trust my own judgment!). I'm worried I'm just seeing narcissists everywhere!

Any other advice? I'll finish reading the book. I'm registered with the local counselling service and might think about going for more sessions.

Have you posted on the stately homes thread? Not dismissing you, hope it doesn't come across like that but I've seen loads of posters say it's been really helpful to post there.
Sorry no real help but didn't want you to go unanswered.

No I haven't - I wanted to post separately first really while I try to fathom it all out but I'll look there. Thanks for replying.

I don't know really, it might be her relationship with you personally - horrible I know to think that she might not have 'liked' you that much/bonded with you/wished you were different/had high ideals and low emotions but I think it is quite common. I guess it depends on how she treated your sister - did your sister ever have any disagreement with her?

There is something seriously wrong with feeling so scared that you wanted to hide in a cupboard. Did your sister feel like that ever? It might be that she was just plain old emotionally abusive and the NPD is perhaps you looking for a reason to forgive her?

I think it's possible to be very self absorbed and selfish and not have npd so I'm not convinced of a need to diagnose her one way or another. Your dm may or may not have it, ultimately her behaviour seems to have had a lasting negative affect on you and that's what should be the focus.
Fwiw if you always felt that your mum did love you then I'm sure she did. Don't start doubting it to fit with the narrative of a condition she might not have had.
Hope you get better help from others, good luck

That makes sense. Yes she was incredibly volatile at times. Very scary. Never violent but didn't need to be because her shouting created the control she needed. It was all about control.

She was very judgemental and everything was black and white. For example I remember she was very dismissive of someone who had an MMC saying it was 'ridiculous' that she hadn't realised because her body would have noticed...(now I know the point of the 'missed' but is that even the body misses that it's miscarried). It's hard actually because I am so angry with her, the way she treated us, things she said but does that make me awful because she's dead? Yet I miss her and wish she was here. I'm so confused!

Re my sister - definitely a golden child - better academically (I'm dyslexic) and socially. I'm very clumsy and I often got shouted at for breaking/losing things in a way my sister didn't. However yes she also got yelled at and berated at times. Maybe more as we went into our teens when she was 'finding herself' as it were, less so when she was the dutiful daughter.

I think she loved us in her own messed up way but because she was a perfectionist, we constantly disappointed her and she couldn't handle us not being her idea of 'perfect'.

Op, you're on the right track. It sounds like a narc to me. My mum was one too. It took me about a year of thinking about it, reading about to really see her as a narc (so many doubts, she did a good job on my ability to confidently make choices!) Once I was pretty sure of what she was/is and most importantly, how she damaged my psyche, I went NC four years ago. It's only been since going NC that the aftermath of her destruction was most apparent. (like the dust settling after an explosion). It was about 2 years ago that I knew without a doubt I made the right decision and she most definitely was a narc because I improved every day and felt good about myself, something I never did before. And her 'script' of brainwashing, demeaning rubbish was slowly replaced by my own positive affirmations that I was, in fact, a good person after all.

Thank you Rainbow. I've talked to my sister and she definitely agrees that Mum had narcissistic traits but agrees that she definitely loved us and wasn't particularly malicious so not a classic narcissist. There's definitely a pattern of negative thinking in my head from her that I need to break.

I dunno I think sometimes NPD is used as an excuse for someone who is simply emotionally abusive. Often the two go together.

There's also a fine line between a parent doing something that seems harsh because they want you to learn something and a parent that is harsh for no reason other than they want to have total control.

There are probably millions of parents like your Mum, the Tiger Mother types, convincing themselves it is for you when really it is for themselves. Or was it more personal than that? The fact that your sister was the golden girl only until she crossed her shows that it was a control thing.

Did she have any empathy with you at all and did she have it with other people? Also did she ever apologise if she'd done something particularly harsh?

Hmm, empathy. That's one thing DSis said, that she had empathy. Only I'm not not sure about that. Sometimes she said things that were very harsh that showed she wasn't empathetic. You how time changes your perception, especially when someone's no longer around. I'm sure if I accused her of EA she'd have been somewhere between mortified and furious and refuse to accept it. I think she believed she always acted in our best interests....clearly she wasn't at times.

I can honestly say I recall her apologising twice. Once in the incident I mentioned above (I was 17). Once when she had been very depressed. She used me as a verbal punching bag. I know when she was diagnosed my Dad said it explained things but I remember thinking it didn't excuse things. I was an adult then so after she'd started to recover I told her how upsetting it had been and she said she was sorry for that.

Maybe I don't need to label it (never get a definite answer anyway) but just the recognition that at times the way she treated us was unjust, no natter how justified she thought she was, is enough for me to start the healing process.