My dad knocked my son to the ground

[grizedale]

Need advice pls. We were in the park with my parents and ds and dd were squabbling. Ds kicked dd (she was also kicking, they are 6 & 7). DH wasn't with us, he was at home. I was sorting it out and my Dad overheard and came up. He saw ds kick dd and grabbed his arm, saying' If you kick someone, someone else will kick you back harder'. Ds then laughed. So my Dad said to him again, 'If I kick you it'll really hurt.' Then Ds again laughed. My Dad had started to walk away but overheard and then flew at my son, knocking him to the ground with his shoulder. I said, too late, 'Don't push him over!'. My Dad went off and my son was ok, just looked a bit shocked. My parents later went home and now I don't know how to say to my Dad that this behaviour is not on. I am so upset. My son seems fine but I don't want it to happen again. It has happened once before, when ds was about 3 and squabbling with dd again. Dh, again wasn't there. My Dad grabbed ds roughly by the arm and I, again, said not to do it but he doesn't ever say sorry or that he shouldn't have done it. My Mum just doesn't say anything. We've only just started to communicate better and things were going well but now this has happened. I just don't want to see my parents now which isn't going to help rectify the situation. Any advice would be welcome.

Thank you. I will tell them I'm taking a break from visits for now and tell my Dad how unacceptable it was to do that (and previous) and how upsetting it is. It was shocking as we recently went on holiday with them and my Dad was kind and considerate. He stepped back with I or Dh needed to stop them squabbling and has been quite helpful over the last few years. My parents have even moved nearer to us to be more supportive. However, my son is only 6yrs old and I've never believed that violence teaches anything other then more violence. He needs to hear it from me and yes, I have always had problems standing up to him. Time I did. Dh heard it all from me when my parents had gone, I broke down. He wasn't happy about it but he understands why my Dad got cross and was also brought up in 70's but has said my son shouldn't have provoked it and told ds to apologise to me for upsetting me (which wasn't the point and could make my son feel it is all his fault).I need to make it clear to everyone that I won't have that behaviour.

Your dad is a bully & basically saying you can't parent. Are you ok with that?

My formative younger childhood years were in the 1970s and none of my grandparents ever used violence to try and regain control. Its nothing to do with the time you were yourself raised in.

Re this comment:-
"Dh heard it all from me when my parents had gone, I broke down. He wasn't happy about it but he understands why my Dad got cross and was also brought up in 70's but has said my son shouldn't have provoked it and told ds to apologise to me for upsetting me (which wasn't the point and could make my son feel it is all his fault).I need to make it clear to everyone that I won't have that behaviour".

Your son was having a normal childhood disagreement with his sister, I presume the word "he" at the beginning of your second sentence above refers to your DH, who is this "he" you are referring to otherwise.

I think he was bang out of order and just because it was acceptable in the past doesn't mean it is now, so you should tell your Dad.

However, he must have felt as though he needed to step in to discipline your child, and your ds needs to accept grown ups telling him not to do things without laughing at them and showing no respect.

To explain about the shove, we were on a grassy slope at the time so my Dad was going upwards to get to him and did a rugby type shove with his shoulder, ending up on top of my son on the ground. He knew it was wrong and too rough but I need to tell him it can't happen. Both times Dh wasn't there and no one else around at the park either. I don't think he would have done it if we'd been surrounded by other people.

This is so so wrong. If this were my dad with my son, that would be it - curtains. Especially seeing as he has previous. Why hasnt your mum said anything? Is she scared of getting a clout herself?

"Both times Dh wasn't there and no one else around at the park either. I don't think he would have done it if we'd been surrounded by other people"

I think this is critical. Your father knows this behaviour is unacceptable. It's not just that he's stuck in the 70s and incapable of acting any other way. He doesn't do it around your DH. He wouldn't do it around other parents. But your opinion doesn't matter to him.

my Dad was going upwards to get to him and did a rugby type shove with his shoulder, ending up on top of my son on the ground

This is SO bloody wrong. He could have broken his bones. Nothing about this is normal, or ok, no matter how things were when your dad grew up.

And actually I don't think this would ever have been considered ok. A sharp slap on a bare leg used to be the sort of acceptable thing (not acceptable to me, I should add), but a grown man using his weight to knock over a six year old - NEVER.

I would not go NC straight away (because there is a good chance he is just out of touch, what with the generational gap) but I would make it an ultimatum for if he is ever violent with your DC again.

I think the generation gap is a red herring. My dad was a violent old bastard but even he would never have done this.

For people talking about generational gaps etc, i am sorry but you are so missing the point. I was born in the 70s and my dad didnt used to barge me to the ground when i was 6. Parents might have been stricter in days gone by but i dont remember random physical assault being standard parenting back in the 70s. Your dad has assaulted your son. He is a nasty bully. By allowing him to see him again (after two incidents) you would be sending your son the message that a. Such behaviour is acceptable and b. that as his parent you are not fulfilling one of your key roles of keeping him safe by protecting him from such behaviour.

I don't think it's anything to do with a generation gap. I grew up in the '70s too, no one thought it was okay to rugby tackle 7 year olds.

I grew up in the 70s. This is not, not, not normal.

I agree it's different if you feel your father is rough with your DS only if your DH isn't there and does it deliberately because he thinks you let your DS get away with things.

That's a very different kind of behaviour to my DDad simply automatically 'parenting' his GDs as he would have parented us.

Well, you say that on the holiday he was kind and considerate and (if I read you right) did not interfere. That's all good stuff.

So, maybe a chance but suggest you make it very clear, you and your husband together, that this must never happen again.

I would give it some time before seeign them again and then short visits, cup of tea, working up if all goes well.

Yes each incident has occurred without your DH present, I think this is worth exploring. If you feel that your DHs presence is a deterrent for your father escalating his actions then you need to engineer meetings with your DH present, and scale back the number of times you see your parents with the children

Tbh I feel that your dad ending up pinning your child to the ground with his body is waaaaaay beyond what would be considered normal chastisement and was downright dangerous

I do feel sorry for you; we have a family member who bullies with their body (blocking a crawling baby with their foot, pulling a pre teen off a dining chair for a perceived infraction, "accidentally" destroying toys, on family holidays nipping to the bathroom in front of a potty training toddler, were just a few of the things observed - all challenged at the time, lots of minimising from the person and other family) We have severed all contact, we could never leave this person in the same room as the children and go make even a cup of tea without "something" happening. Btw, this person is an adult, in their late forties now. I understand they have now started on the baby of the family, we have warned the parents of that baby but you know how people think you are oh, I don't know, mis-remembering, full of dislike, being over-sensitive? Ah well. Not my monkeys, not my circus.

Ps sorry for essay!

Ignoring the shove (which has been dealt with by other posters), what did you do to reprimand your son for laughing at your father? That's extremely disrespectful.

While you need to make sure your son knows you don't agree with what your father did to him, he also needs to know it's NOT okay to disrespect him.

gnoring the shove (which has been dealt with by other posters), what did you do to reprimand your son for laughing at your father? That's extremely disrespectful

Yes your dad was out of order, of course, but does the OP think what her son did was ok?

I hate children being abused, but I also think it is abuse not to bring them up properly and teach them to respect others.

Ignoring the shove (which has been dealt with by other posters), what did you do to reprimand your son for laughing at your father? That's extremely disrespectful.

Words really do fail me.