Being unwittingly emotion abusive / mean

[SouthByNorthWest]

Hi, I'm a man, but I thought you all could offer some thoughts. Is it possible to be excessively mean / verging on emotionally abusing without even knowing? I think that my wife can occasionally be horrendously mean to me and im not sure if she's ever acknowledged it and has only bearly apologised for it. We had another argument last night because she made chilli con carne and I thought that we were supposed to have it with wraps, as we normally do. Without thinking very hard, I opened a packet of wraps and when I sat down she blew up, had a massive go at me and then wouldn't talk to me. I hadn't realised that there were (unusually) potatoes in the oven to have instead of wraps. We aren't poor so buying another packet of wraps is not a problem. We couldn't resolve this, I mentioned that I still thought that counclling might be worth exploring then she blew up even more, saying, as she always does, that she's the mean one and she's the bitch because she's always having a go at me but what do I want: for her to never have a go at me? Yeah, actually, that is what I want. She refuses to contemplate counselling.

This is only what happened last night but it is very characteristic. I will often make a small mistake like buying her the wrong ice cream or not including the right quantities when she asks me to check a recipe and text it to her. Those are both real examples. Then she will go mental at me for ages and not apologise because I should never have made the mistake in the first place.

I dont think she is a master manipulator but I think she is just naturally a bit mean to me (though is never mean to anyone else) and is naturally very passive aggressive. I would consider separating if we didnt have kids but I can't stand the idea of not living with them. If we split up and she got custody it would be the end of my world.

When we're not arguing we actually get on pretty well though the fact that we don't really have much in common plays on my mind a bit, whereas that is something she doesn't mind very much.

So there you go, any thoughts much appreciated. I would have gone into more detail but am on a phone.

Diagnosing her achieves little.

Focus on you:

• Are you happy in this relationship?
• If not, what are you going to do about it?

It seems that the answer to the first question is "no". You've suggested counselling, which she rejects, she also rejects your attempts at discussing her behaviour and being willinig to change it, and you have ruled out separating. Your only remaining option is to suck it up... unless you put separating from her back on the table.

It doesn't sound like she loves you very much.

en she blew up even more, saying, as she always does, that she's the mean one and she's the bitch because she's always having a go at me but what do I

Seems like a tactic used by emotional abusers.
Passive aggressive.
She IS a master manipulator.
Don't listen to her, tell her it's either you go for counselling or the marriage is over.

You have to man up and not take that sort of behaviour from her or anyone.
Do not ever allow anyone to go 'mental' at you.

Most abusers don't accept they are abusive because they think they have the right to treat their victims that way. She's undoubtedly not intentionally abusing you but that doesn't mean it's not abusive and she's not at fault. If you tell her it hurts your feelings and she just blames you and continues to be hurtful then she is doing it on purpose and she's not a nice person.

Yeah you're right I suppose I have left myself with no options, I just want to live with the kids more than anything else. But I will suggest counselling again and maybe even get in touch with Relate as I do feel like a bit of a doormat sometimes so something needs to change.

Is she a SAHM?
Does she work?
I think maybe a free 1/2 hour with a solicitor would be good so you can see where you would stand on finances and custody.

No-one should stay in an abusive relationship.
I think you need to sit her down and just ask her to listen.
Write a list of all the things she does and says that upset you.
Once you have read through your list ask her what she thinks?
Does she have a list she would like to write regarding you and your behaviour.

Or write her a letter. Tell her it's abuse and you won't be putting up with it anymore!

For now, every time she starts. Say something.
'You are doing it again. It's abuse and it's not OK. Stop it now!'

She's an abusive idiot that is getting away with it.

Seriously OP, do you really want to spend the rest of your life with this person, she sounds completely unhinged.

I get that you want to be with your kids, get your own place and share custody.

Makes me wonder how she is with the children. After all if she "can't help" bei

Sorry for posting too soon am on phone. If she 'can't help" being mean to you it is likely she has a short fuse with your children too.

She sounds controlling, as if she needs everything to be just so: and for you to read her mind. Then blows up when you don't.

I imagine you walk on eggshells quite a lot, SBNW. This is no way to live. Something does need to change.

Not living with your kids won't be the end of your world, if it happens like that. You will be with them frequently? Please don't catastrophise yourself out of taking action if you have to.

IMHO much EA is unwitting, because there is something wrong with the person meting it out. They think they are right and normal, that others (usually the partner) are being deliberately obtuse or obstructive, or even attacking them in some way. They feel fully justified - hence you get no apology.

It's not easy to deal with and remain in situ.

• typo, no question mark intended.

Have you tried actually standing up to her when she does this?

I admit that this isn't something I would normally recommend so explicitly for a woman because the power dynamics are just different when the situation is reversed.

She sounds like a classic bitch to be honest. I don't know if this verges on emotional abuse - maybe it does, but I don't believe that every single bitch wife or fuckhead husband are automatically abusers. Sometimes they are just wankers.

If you do stand up to her when she does this, what do you say and how does she handle it? If you don't stand up for yourself, do you know why?

Sometimes people simply don't respect someone if they don't stand up for themselves - it's a very unattractive personality trait, but it exists nonetheless.

Have you tried discussing this at a time when you aren't arguing? And explaining that the way she speaks to you when angry is totally unacceptable? If not, that's the first step.

During an argument I'm obviously not recommending that you start screaming at her or threatening her (for the love of god don't do that), but there is no reason why you can't call her out in an assertive way.

"You are being totally unreasonable, and you do NOT get to talk to me like that. If you have a problem, TELL ME without turning into a foaming screaming harpy. If you are incapable of doing that and you want this marriage to continue, then we are going to counselling. Those are your two options - learn how to discuss problems like a fucking adult, or come to counselling. Your choice".

If she refuses to consider counselling and continues to blow up at you, then you might have to show her that you are serious by taking the kids and going to your parents for a few days. You should only take the children is you are the primary care giver though - that's the best interest of the child.

If you don't want confrontation, you don't want to leave and she continues to refuse counselling then I'm afraid you are out of options.

One other point - has it always always been like this, or is this a new development? If it's a recent thing it may well be that is resenting you for something, and is sub consciously using these situations to vent her frustration. It's obviously still an unacceptable thing to do, but if you can figure out if this is the case or not, then it might help to resolve the situation.

For example, did she have to give up work when the kids came along? Could she be resentful of that and be taking it out on you? Does she get help with the kids, or does the main burden fall on her? Does she get any time to herself without the kids?

Any of those things could be causing her to build up a huge amount of resentment at your perceived freedom.

She works, we both work and the kids spend quite a lot of time in childcare but that's ok, it's what we both want and we have really good childminder + nursary. It's not a recent development. It has always been like this. In the past it was much worse and she has slowly got better over time. Having kids has helped a bit as it gives us something to focus on and we don't disagree TOO much on child issues. Once or twice I have thought she is a bit harsh with them but really nothing bad at all, and we have seen with other parents that we are both towards the more lenient end of the scale. It really is just me who gets it in the neck. She is excellent at storing up any issues from work or with the kids and taking them out on me. She even once had a go at me because she said that our then two year old liked me more than her.

We almost never talk about it when were not arguing. A lot of that is because I want to keep the peace and enjoy the good time while it lasts. Occasionally I refer to things she has had a go at me for and she will say she can't remember it and that's she's sorry. She sometimes seems surprised that she was ever so harsh to me. Last week I mentioned something from the past that still bothered me (I wasn't worried enough as to whether we had enough stuff when we were expecting our second, and I was too complacent in thinking that we could use the same stuff we used for our first) and her response was to have a go at me for the fact that I was harbouring resentment from the past. It wasn't even that long ago, only nine months.

What she doesn't know is that there are some arguments from the long ago past that shock me so much in remembering them that I am still quite upset about them to this day.