Not sure what to do - strange visit from the police

[myfriendflickadee]

10 days ago, a good friend staying with me told me 3 police officers were outside our building at 10pm and asked if he knew which flat a women called XXX (they only gave a first name) lived in. He knows my neighbours (there are only 4 flats here), and there is only one other woman living here - a newly wed couple who moved in a few months ago.

Slightly strangely (maybe not for London), although we both know her husband, neither of us (nor any of our neighbours) know her name. No mail arrives for her (we put the mail from the communal letterbox in pigeon holes ourselves).

The police refused my friend's offer to come in. They said they couldn't.

Since then, I've had problems with identity theft and fraud under different aliases at my address. I have been talking to the property managers about this and, strangely again, they know my neighbours are a married couple but they don't have any record of the lady's name, only the husband.

It isn't the first time the building has been used for ID theft, long before this couple moved in. But now I know the woman's name is the name the police were looking for (after a chance encounter). The police are investigating the fraud but I don't think the fraud and the visit are related - if all happened after the first visit looking for her. And they only knew her first name. Plus, surely the police would have made the link if they were coming to the house looking for a fraudster and a new fraud was reported from the same address?

Having been through DV, I am still wondering whether that is the reason for the late night police visit ( that was my guest's first thought too), Although they seem to be very happy normally. The only odd thing is that no one knew her name and that several times in a couple of months I've had to let her husband into the building as he's "forgotten" his keys.

Am I projecting? Being naive? Should I try to have a chat and let her know there is somewhere she can go if there's a problem? I'd rather make a fool of myself to a fraudster (if that was the reason for the late night visit) than leave someone vulnerable. Although I know interference can be as unwelcome as welcome...

Maybe I should just leave it to the police?

I don't really understand.

What is it you think is happening?

Can't you call the police and ask why they were there - as you now know the woman they were looking for?

Have you met the woman?

What is the significance of the keyless husband?

Sounds odd, but I think you may be jumping to conclusions about the DV. Surely the Police would have known her first name and surname, and for 3 of them to be there without not only both her names or her actual address seems peculiar.

Is your friend certain they were real Police Officers? Something about it doesn't add up, can you ask the officers dealing with the fraud whether the 3 officers who turned up on x date at x time were there in relation to the fraud? It will flag up to them if there are other things going on. There could be a very simple explanation but it seems strange.

I don't think the fraud stuff has anything to do with the police visit looking for the neighbour. I just mentioned it because there are other strange things going on. I just got a strange hang up call again from a blocked number. I really don't think they are related though. It wouldn't make sense. Targeting neighbours for fraud is just foolish. It isn't the first time fraudsters have used the building.

I don't know what's going on . But if the police called, either she is a victim or a criminal.

I have met her a few times. She looked terrible the last time I saw her., on Saturday. Normally she looks beautiful.

I think it's strange that her husband is often locked out of the building as in 10 years living here, that has only happened a couple of times before. Never twice with the same neighbour, let alone multiple times. I'm wondering if he's left in a rush or she's locked him out.

You're right. I could just call 101 and tell them that police came to the house looking for her and give them her correct address.

I guess I'm projecting my own experiences. Both my friend and I assumed it was a possible DV situation from the police's inability to come in without knowing the address and not being sure of the details.

The Met has a no tolerance policy for DV so I assume they will contact her if she called them and I contact them to provide the full address. If she's done something wrong, I shouldn't feel bad for giving them her address. I would feel bad if she was a victim and didn't want me to.

Having been in that situation, I understand that sometimes involving the police isn't want you want (even if you called them, and even if it's actually the best thing). I just would want to offer her support if she wants it. Sometimes involving the police can make things worse as well as better.

She could however be up to no good. Or her husband could be the victim.

Should I turn a blind eye to a call from the police, whatever the reason?

It is odd, emotionsecho.

We assumed DV for the very reason they had few details and wouldn't come in and the time of night. A rushed, frightened call or not sure what she wanted to do... If they had a warrant for an arrest, they would have come inside, as I understand.

I can guarantee they were real police officers. We live by a high profile address with armed police officers yards away from our front door.

I think the simplest explanation is a argument, she or he called the police, not that she is the fraudster responsible for the other things happening. If she is, the police will quickly make the link if they already were here for that reason. Question is, if it was an argument, was it a nasty one off moment or more than that? Am I making things worse by calling the police to give the address or talking to her to let her know about the police vist and offer support if there is something she needs,

It could be anything, they could have been looking for her to give her bad news about something, she could be hiding from someone, someone could have been released from prison and she needs to be made aware. In the last two cases they would have had far more detailed information than just a first name, the first option possibly not, possibly just a name and partial address, eg someone she knows involved in an accident.

I would either mention it to the officers in the fraud case "3 officers were here x date x time looking for x can you tell them her full name is x and her address is x" or ring the non emergency number or local police station and say the same.

It does seem odd all these seemingly unconnected things happening in a relatively short space of time.

As you're certain that the police were for real then I would contact them somehow to let them know details. If they are competent about domestic violence then they will know how to contact her, if that is the situation.

If they are in any way connected to the fraud, that would also help them. Could it be that the police had somehow picked up a first name, and were trying to work out if a fraud steer had moved in? Maybe she doesn't use the same name all the time, hence no mail?
Pure speculation, but sometimes fraudsters move into an area to get hold of post and then use it before moving on swiftly.

Your explanation could be right OP. I don't think contacting the Police will do any harm, particularly as you say they are zero tolerance on DV, they will surely know how to address the situation carefully.

The fraud/identity stuff could be totally unrelated just a coincidence it must be annoying though!

The dh and forgetting keys could be just that he is disorganised and forgetful.

If it was a response to argument or something - Why wouldn't police come in if they thought there was someone in need ? Oh, sorry, we have to be invited in?

That sounds odd.

I mean, they can break down doors if they have to! They climb through windows! They had to stand on the street and couldn't let someone staying in the building give them access to the communal part of the building where they could then knock on the flat doors and ask questions?

I'm not sure that the police can enter a property without a warrant for arrest unless there is an immediate risk. For example, if a neighbour had reported concerns about hearing arguments but there wasn't an argument happening at the time.

It's also odd that there were 3 officers - 2 men and a woman.

But entrance to a block of flats so that you can knock on the door of the flat is not entering a property, is it? It's no different to knocking on the front door of a house?

Could you pay her a visit (when you know the husband is out) with the excuse that the police were looking for her the other night and you just wondered if she had been having a nightmare with identity theft too? See how the conversation pans out...If you somehow suspect that all is not well domestically then you can always allude to it by letting her know that you are in the building if she ever needs you for anything.

It's not a block of flats, it's a town house that has been converted into 4 flats. The entry system and door buzzers are outside the front door. I would guess that as there is no public access to the building, legally that means they are entering private property and they can't do that without reason. Or perhaps they had another reason why they didn't want to come in. I can think of a few.

I don't know why they wouldn't come in but they didn't. I am sure they were for real.

It doesn't really matter why they wouldn't come in or why they were here. I'm just not sure whether I should speak to the police or XXX herself now I know she was the person they were looking for.

I suppose there is the possibility that it might be a visa issue, which I didn't think of before.

Fermin - that was what I was thinking. I think that would be the best , most sensitive thing to do if it's DV. On the other hand, if it isn't, I could be tipping off someone the police are looking for!

ah, ok, I see. fair enough. I was wondering why if it really was the police and not people claiming to be why wouldn't they enter communal areas of a building to make enquiries.

Are there communal area in your flats? If so then it's no different to a high rise is it? Perhaps they couldn't come in because they were busy with an ongoing case, rather than not being able to legally enter.

I certainly wouldn't be assuming domestic violence just because it's a woman involved. It could be anything really and I would probably let the police know that you have more info.

Oh and the police can enter a property if invited in by a resident or someone in the building.

Two male officer and one female does suggest possibly DV or indeed the female officer could have been a family liaison officer.

You could do both, ring the police they will deal with it sensitively and talk to her if you can, as someone suggested a sort of light "are you having problems with fraud?" type thing and take it from there.

It's different from some high rises or big blocks of flats that do have communal public areas like walkways and staircases that anyone can walk into.

I'm not assuming DV but for routine matters dealing with victims (taking witness statements, reporting crimes, breaking bad news), the police don't usually send 3 officers late at night. Also, in most cases, they make an appointment for that kind of thing here. They only come immediately in an emergency. I think it is fair to assume they expected there to be a problem or to be taking someone into custody (which might explain why they didn't want to come in until they knew which flat XXX lives in).

Which is why my thoughts are, either she is under investigation (in which case, I should probably call the police) or it could be DV because of the time, number of officers, lack of details, reluctance to come in (in which case, maybe I should say something to her).

Actually, I think the best thing to do is speak to 101. Leave it to the police.