Is my marriage over?

[idontknowanymore]

I really don't know what to do anymore, but just now after having a phone conversation with my husband I felt I can't go on anymore and I really felt like a don't know this person anymore.
We have a 22month old DS and have been married for 3 years, but together for 11. Things have got slowly worse after DS was born, but I actually thought we were going to come out of this and it would get better, but now I'm not sure.
I don't know if I should give up or not? And if not then what to do to make it better?
I think our main issues is that DH feels that I am a "team" with DS but not with him, I however feel that he just is not very loving towards me (not to say that he is actually quite nasty at times) and every conversations turns bad - I could be making a joking comment about something and he will turn it into a big deal and me being rude and insensitive etc...
It's very tiring to be constantly thinking of what I can and can't say to him that wouldn't upset him.
I do admit that I love my son dearly and I do make most decisions regarding him, because I have spent the most time with him and done the most research online about the particular subject that the decision is about.
After he raised this issue I have made an attempt at going with his view on things more but I don't think he has noticed.
I know I can't possibly write our whole life story here and even then it would be just my side, but I really just feel so defeated and in need of some support.

Has anyone had any good outcomes with marriage counseling?
I do fear that this could actually make things worse... if I say out loud my true feelings (because my true feelings are not very nice lately) he could just demand a divorce there and then. But perhaps this would be a good thing?
It would break my heart for DS not to even remember having a family with mum and dad together.

"It's very tiring to be constantly thinking of what I can and can't say to him that wouldn't upset him."

What you're describing - 'walking on eggshells' - is often symptomatic of a relationship with a bully. Making a big deal out of minor differences, nit-picking, pettiness, etc. It's designed to discourage disagreement and to exert control as the victim changes what they say and do in order to avoid unpleasantness. So when you say you're going along with his view more, that's a big concern. This kind of behaviour often only starts with the arrival of a child.

To add some context, whilst you can't describe your whole life story, how about a specific example of a decision you've made about your baby and how the discussion went? Also, how old were you both when you got together?

I was in my early twenties and he is/was 9 years older when we met.
To be honest I wasn't expecting such a strong response - I really don't see myself as a victim.

There are many examples to choose from, ranging from minor issues to the bigger ones, such as co-sleeping (his view is that DS should be sleeping in his own room, I am not ready to change this yet) and discipline (I am not strict enough - I do say no when necessary but try to avoid yelling it, which he doesn't).
When I say I have tried to go along with his view, I mean that for example when DS was sick and it was quite clearly a mild flu type virus and I didn't think it was necessary to see a doctor, I would agree to go anyway rather than have an argument - instances where it can't hurt to let him make a decision.
But to him this is not enough. And in occasions when I don't agree with him the phrase " you never listen to me anyway so I don't know why you even ask" often gets used. And he will sulk.

I'm also worried that he is damaging his relationship with DS. He considers it good parenting being strict and raising his voice, I don't agree, but there is no way to explain this to him without having a major argument and him losing it because of me "telling him off".
DS doesn't really want to hold his hand when outside, or want to be held by him - he will ask for mummy instead and I think this is making things worse - he sort of feels insulted I think by this and loses his patience with DS easily.
I'm not sure whether this is just a phase (that DS only wants mummy) or if there are already issues in their relationship.

I don't want you to think of yourself as a victim. All relationships have points of disagreement and, in a good relationship, everyone will feel they are being listened to, understood and fair compromises agreed where possible. If the only acceptable answer is always your DH's opinion then that's far too one-sided. If you feel you have to cave to keep the peace all the time, if you are modifying your behaviour or what you say to avoid a row... it's a big concern. If his idea of parenting is to shout and be strict and if he's losing his patience and being offended, not just with you but also with a small toddler, then he's probably a bully. Children do often express a preference for one parent over the other for no good reason, but they don't like people who are over-stern either.

The age-gap is significant here, I think. An older man can see a younger woman as 'biddable' and easy to control. Before you had DS were you one of those couples that never had a cross word? Has he always taken the lead and you gone along with it?

BTW... sulking behaviour is often associated with bullies.

Thank you for replying Cogito.
We certainly argued before, but it was never consistently bad as it is now. I don't even know if I love him anymore as the constant negativity is just getting too much...
I just don't know if I'm able to see things objectively.

After your first comment I have read about verbal abuse online, and have to say a lot of it matches - but on a lighter scale IYKWIM, so not sure what to call it.

May I ask, do you speak from experience or from professional point of view?

I'm not a professional but, sadly, I've had more than enough experience with bullies in various forms to know how thy operate and maybe I am sensitised to early warning signs as a result. I have reached the conclusion that, in a relationship setting, the only real choices on the table are to stand up to them or reject them. Eggshell-treading only earns you contempt.

A lot of couples find that raising a child is the first thing they've ever disagreed on and that it can be a sticking point. I don't know what his family is like compared to yours.... strict vs lenient etc.... but chances are you'll both be influenced by your various experiences. Good or bad.

The little pointers in your story that, for me, take it beyond normal PFB frictions and into bullying territory are his refusal to accept your opinion, his closing down of discussion with 'you never listen', accusations of rudeness and the sulking. Strict parenting isn't necessarily a bad thing but, if he's the type that think weaker/inferior beings should just shut up and do as they're told, I wonder if he's applying the same logic to you.

There are Asperger Syndrome traits in what you have described of your DH's behaviour as well. In the same way as you have investigated verbal abuse online, you could find out more about AS, or high functioning autistic spectrum disorder (or condition) and see if other aspects of your DH's behaviour are also mentioned. The NAS website is a good place to start.

"Instances where it can't hurt to let him make a decision"????

At the risk of being flamed now, I'm going to stick my neck out and ask if this is really your attitude to your dh? It strikes me as seeming rather patronising - after all, your ds is as much his as yours, so surely your views on parenting are of equal worth?

Add this to the co-sleeping and it strikes me that your dh might simply be feeling completely devalued and excluded. Nit picking and sniping are as much signs of someone at the end of their tether as they are of a bully and if, as you say, your relationship was good before you had your ds, this perspective surely has to be worth considering.

If you really want to keep your marriage, I would definitely try counselling, but be mindful that it involves more listening to the other than saying your piece. Three or four sessions should reveal whether you are dealing with a bully or a man who feels pointless and squeezed out.

I hope I haven't offended you in speaking bluntly - it's just that I've seen two friends unwittingly destroy their marriages by assuming such control over parenting and such prioritising of their dcs regardless of their husbands' views that the two men (both kind, easy going, well-meaning people) simply gave up and left in the end. Everyone lost out as a result. Make sure you are very, very certain before you act. Good luck.

I read this OP with interest, it is so familiar. I also well remember the uncomfortable feeling that something was amiss with it all.

The thing that stands out is the inequality. Your DH doesn't see you as an equal partner. I trod on eggshells a lot with my ex. When I did express a different opinion he accused me of 'not supporting him' ie my job was not to criticise him.

And that stuff with being offended by a small boy when he wants to walk with you. It's ridiculous. He is not treating his son like a child.

Your husband sounds entitled and emotionally stunted like my ex. Sadly I feel your marriage will never be an equal partnership. But you can start putting some boundaries in place. If you can't be yourself in your marriage, I do feel the marriage is in big trouble.

Sorry to be the harbinger of doom.

Thank you all for taking time to respond. All very different views!
I feel much better and more hopeful today, yesterday evening went peacefully and DH and DS had spent a lovely day together even if they made a huge mess doing it

YvyB I'm not offended at all, in fact this is what DH has in the past communicated to me - that he feels excluded and that he should have just as much say as I do, and after this argument I have tried to make him feel more involved, but yes I still feel that as I do 95% of the care of DS then I am in a position to make the majority or decisions too as a) I will be the one doing whatever the decision is about, and b) I feel that I know better (yes, I realise that sounds very patronising, but I spend the most time with DS, even now that I'm back at work, DH works most evenings and some days will barely see DS, so I do think I know better).
So I think the way I worded it was not very good, but what I mean is when I feel strongly about something then I will not just easily accept DH's opposite opinion, but if not then I have learned to let go of some things.

cheapskatemum the funny thing is that I have recently read about AS, because I thought I might have it! I think it's harder to evaluate someone else, because you don't know their inner most thoughts.
As far as myself having it, I'm not sure and don't actually want to find out for sure.

Cogito His parents were/are very strict and we have issues with them trying to impose their parenting style on us to use on our DS. DH in aware and says that he doesn't agree with them and that he is not influenced by them, but I thing even without realising he is still affected by it. In lot of things we do agree in principle, it's just the delivery that differs. We both agree that we need to say NO to DS on certain things, but I don't think shouting it is necessary, he on the other hand thinks the way I say it is not 'strong' enough...

Handywoman What you describe is very familiar, but I still have hope.