Should I get back in contact with my mum?

[MojitoMadness]

My mum is a Narcissist. Not diagnosed, and she would be aghast at such a claim, but after many years of being controlled and engulfed by her I finally realised she was one last year.

It's a long story really but in short, I had a pretty normal if not overprotective (she was a helicopter parent - but only when it suited her) childhood. I don't really have any complaints about my childhood really. She would guilt trip me quite a lot, and used me as an emotional crutch from an early age, but I was loved (and felt it) and well looked after. She never liked any of my friends and always had something nasty to say about them, but never stopped me from seeing them.

She seemed to be very jealous of everyone, (including my junior school aged friends) and this impacted on me when she would vent. She effected my judgement of my dad for many many years, even though they were married until I was 17.

She held herself up as the paragon of all mothers, claimed herself to have a fantastic maternal instinct. Yet left my sister with my dad at the age of 13 to pursue a relationship with someone else. And only had very sporadic contact with her until my sister was a grown up. She kept me in very close contact at that point though.

She practically held me at her bosom from birth right up until last year when I went no contact as she had engulfed, smothered and single white femaled me to the point of me almost having a breakdown. She practically destroyed my relationship with my DSD through jealousy. Completely took over when my dds were born to the point it almost destroyed my marriage.

I strongly got the impression several times that if she could just live my life for me, give birth to my dds, sleep with my DH and be me she would not only do it better but do it justice and that my existence was completely wasted on me. In her opinion anyway.

Since I have gone no contact in July last year my life has just got better and better. My mental health is almost repaired (if it can ever be), my physical health is tonnes better, (hardly any migraines and IBS is a thing of the past), my marriage is fantastic, I get on better with my dds and DSD, I don't second guess myself all the time anymore, and best of all my time is my own, to do with as I please without having to answer to her. No guilt trips, no third degree, no 21 questions over where I am and who I'm with.

I've almost, (but not quite) forgotten what she was like. And now I'm wondering...could I have a relationship with her? Could I have contact with her without the guilt? Could my dds have a relationship with her without me feeling like I'm giving a little bit of myself over to her and losing some of my relationships with my dds everytime I see her?

I suppose that is the ideal, a nice normal, no strings attached relationship with my mother. Where she's not asking anything from me, and I'm not giving anything of myself away. Is that possible? Should I try? Will I be pulled back into her web of manipulation and guilt tripping? (Not to mention I really don't want any contact between my dds and her partner - he would give Ken Roache a run for his money).

My dad still nags me every time I see him to contact her, (they're divorced). The funny thing is my relationship with my dad has been fantastic since I went no contact with my mum, she used to slag him off so much.

I guess if it was going to be the way it was then I want no part in it. But if there's a chance that I may possibly be wrong and she's not a Narcissist, just a messed up insecure woman (my nan was a complete bitch to her all through her life) and we could possibly salvage a relationship, then I feel I have to try IYSWIM?

Would I be mad to try?

I don't think you'd be mad and I don't see what you're doing as minimisation but a healthy detachment and a reflection of maturity and increased confidence. Seeing her as a 'messed up insecure woman' puts in the category of any other oddly behaved stranger i.e. annoying but not something you take to heart. However, you would have to be very, very careful to limit her involvement in your new life and you'd have to be the one fully in control of contact at all times. Any hint of her returning to old tricks or the same feelings returning and down go the shutters.

It may never be a normal or relaxed relationship but you could find something that would work

Yes you would be mad, actually stark raving bonkers to try!!!. Nothing good will come of it if you do reopen this pandora's box that should remain closed. You need to re-examine your reasons why you are considering this at all in the first place.

Toxic dysfunction like you describe goes down the generations and I note her own mother was abusive to your mother as well. You have also been profoundly affected by your own mother's narcissism; it is to your credit indeed that you escaped and you would not dream of treating your own children the same.

You cannot afford to start minimising or self doubting your right judgment call now that you've managed to get her out of your life and probably not without difficulty.

She is not just a "messed up insecure woman" and even if she was (which she is not) it is not down to you to try and rescue and or save her. It is NOT your fault she is the way she is and I feel that your childhood was hell on earth.

Please for your sake do NOT re-enter the lions den that is the relationship with your narcissist mother!!.

Your mother is still a narcissist and has not changed fundamentally on any level. She still sees you fundamentally as an extension of her own self. That is what you will be again if you restart any sort of contact with her.

Look too at how much your life (and your own family's) is better without her in it; these people cast a wide and damaging shadow over everyone they come into contact with.

There is never a nice and normal relationship with a narcissistic mother. It will not happen so you need to rid yourself of that fantasy now and take off those rose tinted specs.

Its not possible to have a relationship with a narcissist and letting her back into your life at all will be a serious retrograde step on your part, it will undo every scrap of progress you have made. Its that serious.

Resist any pressure and or temptation to let her back in. Your Dad was her willing enabler and still seems to act as one with regards to her. Ignore him too.

If you dare to question a narcissist or request things like healthy boundaries (they're allergic to boundaries) and honesty, you're going to become public enemy number one. The "Mr. or Ms. Wonderful" mask immediately comes off, and there is no level they will not stoop to in order to "punish" you. They have myriad ways of attempting this; some are covert, and some are open and obvious. The narcissist has a seemingly inexhaustible obsession for making people who cross them "pay". Once they set their sights on you, you're a permanent enemy, and their seething spite will feel as intense years down the road as it did when it first began. The length of time they can keep up the full intensity of their hatred for you and their campaign to exact revenge is absolutely dumbfounding to non-narcissistic people.

More Here: www.lightshouse.org/things-narcissists-do.html#ixzz2rUdnSFpk

Don't get in touch. If not for your own sake, then for your DDs, your DSD and your DH. She has previously poisoned your relationships with them, don't give her the opportunity to do it again. After this many years, she won't change.

What Atilla said. You need to come to terms with not having a nurturing mother, grieve that (non-existent) mother even. Your own mother will not meet that need - it's pure fantasy. Pat yourself on your back for making a successful escape & get on with your life. Ignore people who may be trying to get you to make up - they have their own agends and may even be subject to third party pressure from her. If you are really wobbling, the best approach is to do nothing now & set a date in the future, say 3 months, when you're going to review the situation. I would put money on this feeling passing & in 3 months you'll be thinking "thank God I didn't contact her in January!"

What would you gain from having a relationship with her when everything has come together for you since you cut contact.

I worry that because you feel more together now, you feel able to be able to change her? Maybe you feel strong enough to accept her as she is but your strength has been allowed to grow because you aren't in contact so she can't grind you down.

In this case, NO.

You've only been NC with her for a short time, since last summer. It is nowhere near long enough to truly break free.

There is a very, very high chance she would try to re-establish the same sort of interaction, in fact I'd say it's inevitable. You're very deeply conditioned to respond to her pattern of interaction and it will take some years to break it completely. Since summer is far too soon.

Also, she won't have stopped the nastiness about others and being around that is draining, unpleasant and leaves a bad taste.

You have far better relations with the other people in your life now. Reestablishing contact with her will gradually and subtly put those improvements at risk.

I think you need at least several years, 6 or so, and then to think very carefully. That length of time gives you much more time to establish your own boundaries securely, because she hasn't respected them at all has she? She hasn't treated you like your own, respect-worthy person but as a rather inferior offspring whom she could do so much better than.

Don't judge her by who she is (whether a narcissist or just a messed-up insecure woman) but the damage she has done to you and others. You can love her from the distance of No Contact whilst protecting yourself and your children. It might even be the best thing for her too as I imagine behaving that way causes her huge stress and misery.

I am sure you will be told if she makes the massive changes to her life that will enable to you to re-establish contact. For all I know you are already hearing of some signs but you should be absolutely sure you and your children will be emotionally safe first before going in.

On balance I'd say keep away for now but review your decision periodically. You will know better than us if that is wise.

I can see why you want to. You yearn for a normal mother/daughter relationship, and why shouldnt you? We all deserve that.

Sadly this woman has proved over and over that she is incapable of giving you that. She made you physically ill, she almost destroyed your marriage, she damaged your relationship with your father, she tried to replace you in your DD's lives. This is not a woman who will ever be able to understand what she has done to you. She will always be right, ALWAYS.

You have had a year free and are now feeling that she must have learned her lesson. She wont have learned a thing. She wont have spent the last year looking at herself and her behaviour and desperate to make amends. She will have spent it justifying everything she did by making you out to be evil. In her mind you must be evil as otherwise you wouldnt have cut her off. In the mind of a toxic person you cutting them off isnt a just act to protect yourself, or a punishment for their behaviour, it is total justification for anything you have accused them of. "She says I tried to take over with her kids, but you can see what she is like when she cut me off, I was just trying to protect them" and so on......

I think that counselling would help you grieve for the mother you never had, and deal with the mother you actually have. Then, and only with they support of a counsellor or therapist, would it be time to consider contacting her again. But tbh, I would stay the hell away. Does your sister have any contact with her?

"ps
The only circs to consider getting in touch would be if you received communication from her acknowledging your feelings, apologising and spelling out the action she was taking to remedy her issues. You cannot change her or force her to change, remember that. If she would rather lose her entire family than take on board the effects of her behaviour, her isolation from you is her choice."

And how does someone do that when they have no contact??

Leverette "You're entering the danger period where you're at risk of minimising the damage and using rose tinted glasses, because you're now in a better place as a direct result of cutting her out of your lives."

That really is brilliantly worded advice.