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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Trust is not a contraceptive.

18 replies

Offred · 08/01/2014 10:55

Really further to the thread about a gf who was being called 'careless' with her mini pill the other day.

I discussed it with my bf the last night and what became quickly apparent is a massive disparity in views.

My position is that every person is responsible for their own sexual health and fertility. In a new relationship you obviously don't know enough about your partner to make an accurate assessment of risks to sexual health or of pregnancy and that, should I choose to take a risk over either of those things the consequences are my responsibility.

Not wearing a condom equals a risk of pregnancy (and STIs). That risk may be acceptable to a man in certain circumstances such as if their partner is taking hormonal contraception and they have a high degree of trust both in that hormonal contraception and in their partner to take it effectively.

This I think initial choices extrapolate to more established relationships too in that they will determine regular practices.

In my current relationship we very quickly moved from condoms to depo because I found the risk of pregnancy using condoms in this particular situation unacceptable. Obviously I'm aware that left me with a risk of STI's but I'd never think of blaming my bf if it became apparent that I'd caught one or if I accidentally got pregnant because I'd made considered choices over both of those risks.

He however relies on trusting me to make a choice that protects him from pregnancy and trusting that I don't have any STIs. This is his usual attitude and he believes it is cynical to not trust your partner to take contraceptives that protect you both.

I don't think, from speaking to him, he understands the efficacy of different types of female contraceptive methods and that 'trusting' that you are protected from pregnancy because your partner says they are on contraception without taking any further interest in it is quite passive, an abdication of your responsibility to yourself and quite risky if you have very strong feelings about pregnancy/STIs.

Obviously there are occasional women who genuinely do deliberately mislead their partners over their contraceptive use in order to engineer a pregnancy. There is also a grey area where women are using contraceptives but less effectively than would be counted as perfect use maybe because to them contraceptives are not an absolute priority in their particular situations or because they are not aware they are not using them perfectly. Then there are women who are taking contraceptives in a way that counts as perfect use statistically - for example if I had my injection at 13 weeks, but may cause their partner worry if he knew.

If pregnancy results when a man chooses not to wear a condom I really feel he needs to take appropriate responsibility for that in that he knows he has not worn a condom and therefore pregnancy may result. I find the idea of being trapped into pregnancy very offensive, less so when it is by being deliberately mislead over contraception but much more so when the man has abdicated any responsibility for making an informed choice about his own fertility/sexual health and is relying only on trust.

Trust is lovely and necessary in a relationship but it is not a contraceptive and if you, male or female, choose to place your trust in your partner and take no precautions yourself you need to be prepared to accept an appropriate level of responsibility for ALL the results of that.

It has really made me think about how I'm going to educate my boys about contraception.

OP posts:
Tonandfeather · 08/01/2014 11:06

Yes but if you chose to use the depo and not condoms very quickly, YOU were trusting him not to have STIs too. You can use both after all and that seems the most sensible thing to do if you don't categorically know you're both clear of infection. It seems such a risky decision to me to make in a new relationship...

On your wider point I have no more sympathy for a man who fails to use a condom who's been told his partner is taking the responsibility for contraception. Contraception fails sometimes and besides, any man who definitely wants to prevent a pregnancy and would be unhappy if one resulted, should take responsibility to prevent it.

EirikurNoromaour · 08/01/2014 11:06

Quite agree.

gamerchick · 08/01/2014 11:11

You know what makes me cringe? Those who move on in a relationship.. sort out preventing pregnancy and ditch the condoms before both getting a full sexual health screen.

That's some scary shit right there.

Offred · 08/01/2014 11:13

Yes ton, that's what I'm saying really. I was more meaning that having thought about it and made a choice to take that risk, and it is a risk, I would consider it my fault that I'd caught an STI rather than feeling he had trapped me into one.

I meant that it is not so much the taking of the risk that is offensive to me but the lack of understanding that it is a risk that you are actively taking through inactivity and then subsequent blaming of the other person when there are negative consequences to your lack of interest.

OP posts:
Tonandfeather · 08/01/2014 11:19

I think I'd still feel entitled to blame someone who didn't manage their sexual health well enough to ensure they were disease and infection free though. Blame doesn't have to be unilateral does it?

Why didn't you both get checked out? It's easy enough and there's no stigma to it.

Offred · 08/01/2014 11:20

I suppose I don't feel I'm trusting him not to have an STI so much as looking at my perception of how likely it is and deciding to take the risk. I could make different choices, insist we had tests etc which would be perfectly reasonable and sensible and would reduce the risk but having not done so, if I have an STI from him, I'd accept that is the natural consequence of my choice to behave less than optimally. I wouldn't have a go at him about him having broken my trust.

OP posts:
Offred · 08/01/2014 11:22

It's not particularly easy tbh as I'm a single mum with four kids and they don't like you bringing the children to the drop in. It is a bit of a bullshit excuse tbh I know. I'm pretty confident I'm clean as was tested in pg and he's my only sexual partner since the father and I split.

OP posts:
Offred · 08/01/2014 11:23

He's had one partner (ONS) since he was last tested and says he used a condom. But yy, I am aware it would be optimal to be tested.

OP posts:
Tonandfeather · 08/01/2014 11:24

I would.

Just because you maybe took a reckless decision doesn't absolve him of the responsibility to manage his own health and the risk of infecting another person. Same goes for him in reverse.

I wouldn't take those risks and never have since the 80s and don't really understand people who do.

gamerchick · 08/01/2014 11:25

It's pretty obvious you've never been stung by an sti. If you had you wouldn't be so blasé about it.

Offred · 08/01/2014 11:38

Well yes, but 'twas not really my point. How you negotiate risks is a personal choice people make. I was angling after the point that how you assess and negotiate the consequences of those risks matters rather than criticising the taking of them in the first place. Having a sexual relationship at all creates a risk of STIs and pg.

OP posts:
Offred · 08/01/2014 11:39

Not thinking about it at all then being mad about consequences is not a good way to be.

OP posts:
Tonandfeather · 08/01/2014 11:46

Don't follow your reasoning on this. If someone gave me a disease either knowingly or unknowingly yes I would partially blame myself for not taking steps to protect myself against it but I would also blame the guy for deliberately infecting me or being so passive about the risk of doing so. This is more of a big deal than pregnancy too because there are no positives to a sex disease and because of the biology it's gendered in a way that disease isn't.

ALittleStranger · 08/01/2014 13:03

Offred your attitude towards STIs is a little bit at odds with your emphasis on personal responsibility. You don't have to leave it to trust and the gods. There are tests both you and your partner could take to ensure you are STI free.

Pregnancy is another matter because there is no 100% safe option. PIV requires a tolerance for a margin of error. For me, the safety provided by the combined pill is security enough and every partner that I've ditched condoms with has been happy to rely on that. Which does essentially mean that they are using trust as a contraceptive. As I said on the other thread, I would be insulted if a partner started assuming that I was too flakey to take the pill correctly, or was trying to trick them into pregnancy.

A far bigger problem IME is men making assumptions about contraception rather than relying on trust. A lot of men seem to assume that all women are pilled up all the time. Men do not routinely ask to use condoms in addition of the pill. They have, however, routinely asked to use withdrawal in place of condoms.

Offred · 08/01/2014 14:18

I'm not trusting it to the gods tbh. I've been fully tested whilst in an exclusive relationship with my ex husband. He's only slept one time, with a condom, with one other person. Therefore I made a judgment that it was unlikely either of us had anything.

Even with testing there is still a risk of false negatives, you can never completely exclude the risk. Neither of us have any symptoms of any STIs, I am aware you don't always have them, and since I started sleeping with him I have been tested for chlamydia, but not full screening, when I had some symptoms which turned out to be a normal but AB resistant UTI.

That's hardly leaving it to the Gods IMO.

OP posts:
ElephantsAndMiasmas · 08/01/2014 14:33

I totally get your point. The difference between your attitude and his is that you are being an adult and looking after yourself (as far as you want to, having thought about it) and he is being a kid - expecting someone else to look after him and do the thinking.

"He however relies on trusting me to make a choice that protects him from pregnancy and trusting that I don't have any STIs. This is his usual attitude and he believes it is cynical to not trust your partner to take contraceptives that protect you both." Clearly he doesn't actually mean this, because the two positions are in conflict. If YOU believed it was cynical not to trust your partner to take contraceptives that protect you both, you'd be up the duff by now, presumably? So what he really means is, it would be cynical for him to do so, which to me sounds like a bullshit excuse for laziness.

He has done a calculation too, depend upon it. He has worked out that the worst consequence for him of unprotected sex would be an STI (for which he envisages a quick trip to the GP), or a baby that he would then expect you to bring up and he would ignore henceforth. Otherwise he wouldn't be so blase, sorry.

Oh and to the poster who said: "You don't have to leave it to trust and the gods. There are tests both you and your partner could take to ensure you are STI free. Pregnancy is another matter because there is no 100% safe option." Just how can that be? If condoms can break and you can get pregnant, condoms can break and you can get STIs.

ElephantsAndMiasmas · 08/01/2014 14:35

Ah sorry, you may have meant - to ensure they are currently STI free, in which case true (presuming the tests are 100% accurate?)

Custardo · 08/01/2014 14:35

I agree.

I put it down to innate laziness. I really do think men just leave it to us, which is why - when that thread was about, I was shocked at the responses

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