'Friendship' lost - I'm hurting and puzzled.

[cafesociety]

I've had a best friend for years, both of us single [I'm not looking for a relationship, she is]. She's had problems and health issues and I've tried to be there for her - and vice versa.

She has always been a bit 'snippy' - and is stubborn to the point of not doing the things she should to help her health issues etc., and a bit controlling. I put that down to her personality, we are all different and I am not perfect. I accepted her traits although it has been difficult at times. [I'm sure some traits of mine are annoying too].

A month ago she flew at me verbally over something trivial and ridiculous, she was abusive and yelled at me to get out of her flat. I did.

I've have watched her escalate [in the last 2-3 years] from being snappy to being abusive, everything I do seems wrong [the walking on eggshells stuff]. Her past mild amusement has turned into scorn, the odd observation about how I live my life [eg. I love reading, walking] is now criticism, when I help or give advise it is now classed as me being patronising. She is resentful of the fact I have a [grown] family.

This is going hand in hand with her meeting some new people, doing more stuff. When I've dared to ask why she is more snappy she says it is because she has 'found her voice', and is now more 'confident'. I see it as being rude and disrespectful and increasingly arrogant.

Also [intermittent] back pain she has is cited as a reason - fair enough, but my mother had cancer for 2 years but never took it out on me, not once.

I went back to her flat within half an hour to see if she was ok, and after a couple of weeks emailed to say I realised we had to have time and distance in the circumstances. Both times she was so angry I got another ear bashing, my words twisted, my intentions distorted, although she thinks we can meet up just sometimes in the future. I don't think we can, I don't think I can do it. It wouldn't work now but I feel unkind 'dumping' her. She has said some very hurtful things.

I had been feeling very low for a while with her constant sniping, mockery anyway [my self esteem is on the floor] and I've left her alone for 4 weeks - but I can't stop going over it all in my head, and trying to find reasons and make sense of a sudden end to a friendship like this.

Do people change personality? Or is it that stress means they can't keep up their image any more? I always felt she did things she didn't really want to sometimes, I felt I have been 'filling in' until something else came along - basically that she is a bit false and bottles up the truth, until it starts to seep out, and indeed burst out.

I'd love to stop thinking about it, I am busy and an independent person but it's on my mind, affecting my sleep. Excellent advice on here to others is helping me come to terms with the fact the friendship is dead now. Can anyone help me put a lid on this please and maybe interpret/explain what's gone on here, it's been very hurtful.

The problem here is how you can get over feeling unkind by walking away. Sounds as though she's a bit unstable and very unable to see anything from any other POV - so you will get no joy there. I have been down this road a couple of times - their behaviour just gradually gets worse. I could kick myself for all the time I've spent worrying over these situations. Think about it the other way - is she any kind of friend to you?

I have had a couple of very painful friendships where it has been watching someone change into another person like Jekyll and hide. Like their real self develops like a photo over time and exposure. And then you realise you're in deep and it's got past your tolerance level. You must accept that she will always see you as being at fault - that's just how a lot of people are (no-one likes to think they are the bad guy - that's why you are hurting).

Acinonyx that all makes complete sense, I've known I've been in too deep for a long time but adapted as I know life/people change as the years go by. She has her opinion of me and it isn't going to change, despite her saying I've been the best friend she's ever had and she won't find such support elsewhere. A bit ironic in the circumstances!

She is full of mixed messages and confusion, I think she is confused and having a bit of a crisis as no partner/prospect of children is appearing on the horizon. She is unstable sometimes yes.

Obviously there is a lovely side to her, which is getting buried under her angry side. Her new friends see that I'm sure. One of the last things I said was 'You wouldn't talk to anyone in the way you talk to me', fact. Her agitation and wrath at life is reserved for me, it seems.

What is throwing me is that my mother seemed to change personality when she was stressed out with my stepfather and a new baby and it had a deep effect on me [she never 'changed back', although she mellowed as the years went on].

Also my ex husband [we split amicably] seemed to change personality too when our sons were born, and he wanted to be single again!

Seems a bit of a recurring theme.....I'm doubting my judgment of people, which is usually pretty good.

It's not a 'sudden end'. You say yourself that she's always been a snippy, controlling PITA. She hasn't changed personality therefore, she's just more of the same. Friendships are funny things. Unlike intimate relationships with a partner few people feel they can end a friendship legitimately and cleanly. They seem to feel obliged to keep dragging things on long past the point of no return. Big waste of time.

Cognito you are saying that personality doesn't change, we just get 'more of who we are' as we get older? That makes sense.

I feel I've given her too much leeway in the past and been too wary of nipping insults etc. in the bud [just want a peaceful life] so haven't done myself many favours.

I don't have time to waste, it has often been the case that I enjoy a day better when I'm on my own than in her company, although it's a bit lonely. But to be able to relax and not feel worried is definitely the best option, on my own or not.

I know I have to let go, it just bothers me. 13 years down the pan.

cafesociety

This person may come back into your life at some point, it sounds like she has used you throughout.

This was no healthy friendship at all and perhaps even a subconscious continuation of how your ex and your mother have behaved towards you.

Be cautious of the types of friendships you form. You may have surrounded yourself with people who are not good for you, because this is what has felt "comfortable" to you in the past. If you believe deep down that you don't deserve good friends, you may be with people who belittle you or treat you poorly.

The first thing you need to do is stop and objectively look at your friendships. Do your friends make you feel bad? Some of the things toxic friends do include:
•Act in a verbally abusive manner. They put you down or call you names.
•Criticize you constantly.
•Make it all about them. You aren't allowed to voice an opinion on what to do or where to go. When you try to get them to listen to an issue of yours, they shrug you off.
•Call you only when they need something. When you need something, they aren't around.

To combat this, try distancing yourself from these people and seek out others instead. Don't isolate yourself. It will take a while, but in a short time you will see that being around positive people will change your outlook and lift your self-esteem.

Building self-esteem takes time, and you may find that you slip back into negative behaviors from time to time. Don't let these deter you from continually building your self-esteem, however. You deserve good friends. Learn how to find them, and be one, and your self-esteem will benefit.

hmm yes I can relate to this - I recently ended a friendship due to her constant putdowns, speaking to me like I was dirt, laughing at my decisions because it wasn't how she would do it... I could go on.

She then posted vile untruths about me on a public forum and I decided that it wasn't worth continuing the friendship so broke off contact. She tried emailing me (as I wouldn't take her call) with a load of old tosh about how I'd got the wrong end of the stick. The problem was she'd lied to me so much over the years (clearly thought I was an idiot who couldn't' see past her lies) that I actually didn't care anymore. I didn't care if it was a lie and I didn't care if it was me getting the wrong end of the stick. I was done.

She tried recently to make contact by sending me something in the post that belonged to me - I just laughed and kept it as a souvenir to remind me why I no longer wish to have her in my life. I actually felt embarrassed for her that she was trying to get my attention in any way possible.

She is a needy drama queen, who craves attention.

I haven't missed her or her ridiculous dramas, one bit. That was a 10 year friendship down the drain.

OP I think you need to decide if the friendship is worth continuing, from what you've written, I'd say not - good advice above from AtillatheMeerkat

Attila yes, I have a feeling she wants me on the back burner, and I do not want that. I've had enough.

One of things she threw at me was that she felt 'used' by me, and she wished I wasn't so 'dependent' on her! I thought at the time that she was talking about her, not me.

I have no need to 'use' anyone, have own home, [a few] friends, family, car, income etc. and very independent. Have lived on my own for years, done up numerous properties on my own [sometimes employing tradesmen my sons know], go to cinemas, eat out, take days out, and holiday on my own. Whereas she can't do these things on her own and isn't happy when I do, wondering why I don't include her in everything - and can be clingy sometimes.

And yes I do tolerate being pushed and pulled around as it is familiar to me - I always tried to appease my mother, to try and 'find' her again, make her like me again.

I've noticed in ay sort of relationship that when I stand up for myself, have an opinion, that's when all hell is let loose!

I have just started a self esteem CBT course, but very early days....not learned any skills yet.

Crack on with those self esteem courses.

You had a mother who treated you shabbily and set up your life expectations so that you took a partner and a friend who treat you like crap.

Learn to change yourself so that you don't accept put downs or shit from people and stand up for yourself from the start.

People like this put you down because you accept it and they can. Say no. They aren't friends.

Yes, basic personality doesn't change. I get slated a lot on here for saying that people shouldn't necessarily let others off the hook just because they have some kind of illness (makes me a heartless cow apparently :) ) but this is a case in point. You feel sorry for her so you've let behaviour go that, in someone else, you probably wouldn't have tolerated. If you're a people-pleaser more generally and don't like conflict because of your upbringing, she'll have taken advantage of you. Chances are that illness or no illness, she'd be exactly the same and use you as an Aunt Sally. Glad you're having CBT to address self-esteem.

Robot it seems you have had a similar experience, but the lies must have been very hurtful to see and indeed inexcusable.

My 'friend' is 'mummy and daddy's little princess', in that they still pay for her holidays [she has a good salary] and tolerate her outbursts of temper [quite a volatile family]. But not everyone in the world is going to indulge her so much. I believe this makes an adult feel 'special'. [Does 'volatile' mean 'dysfunctional' btw]?

The 'dramas' have been increasing lately, as her high expectations of life are not being met.

And also the point you make about people thinking we are daft - my 'friend' has been to uni, I haven't and I've always felt she thinks she is more clever than I am. It comes over in her 'talking down' to people who haven't been to uni and thinking [and telling me] they are stupid. They aren't. Instead I have life experience, read loads, am willing to ask for help and to learn from others/take courses etc. I can see things unfold and develop and identify behaviours, but find it difficult to resolve conflict and certain situations.

I am taking on board the advice on here and appreciate the time it takes to read and reply to me, thanks all.

My mother was quite unstable and her mood and friendliness could turn in a second. It's left me with a life-long inability to judge whether or not I should be putting up with someone's behavior or not - after all - we have to put up with our parent's behavior as we have no choice and anyway we crave their love and attention. I often doubt my judgement in these situations which is why I get in too deep. Sounds like you are just the same!

EQ2 I stupidly thought having a friendship was easier and had less chances of failing than a relationship....simpler. No sexual element, no house/finance/children elements to complicate it.

I see how naïve I have been. I should have acted on my instincts when I heard and saw certain things I was not happy about....and not thought it would all be ok as I wasn't in a relationship with this person.

I didn't think friends manipulated and controlled, no others before have done so. I've lost touch with people through circumstances not through any behaviours or conflicts. Well I've learnt now haven't I, I feel like a mug.

Acinonyx
My mother taught me that my instincts, about people, situations, events etc. were wrong. It was me at fault, never the other person. If I tried to resolve/talk through anything she would say it was me 'starting again'. Very effective at shutting me up, giving me self doubt and giving the other person's feelings priority over anything I may be rightly feeling!

...hey ho. The compensation is that I get respect from my sons and daughters in law and feel [mostly] safe in their company, so I must have got it right somewhere along the line! I don't do relationships or friendships that well though.......

Thanks for everyones input, it is helping.

New friends and new surroundings can make us look at established patterns and think, I feel so much better and brighter, X or Y must have been holding me back! Sometimes it is more likely we are on our best behaviour putting in more effort.

It's not on for her to justify tearing a strip off you as her 'finding her voice'. Princesses have no right to expect eeveryone to pander to them. Perhaps having the luxury of a bigger social circle these days she thinks she can jettison the older faithful friend without taking your feelings into account.

Four weeks on and she probably feels quite put out you've yet to jump when she cracks the whip now. Onwards and upwards!

Donkey yes, I am not into gigs, hen nights, corporate meals out like her new workmates....but I was happy to be company on empty weekends, for conversation, drives and walks, the odd quiet meal out and listening. We all have different roles I think. I thought that was ok.

One of the last things that hurt was her saying 'I'm not interested in your books, OK'. And 'Why do you have to talk all the time?'

Well surely if you don't see anyone for a week/fortnight you have a catch up and want to know what been going on for the other person too? Therefore you both have a conversation?

And I have always been an avid reader, and just say what the 'book of the week' is, and I might tell a little snippet from it, something of interest. Of interest to only me apparently....That statement attacked who I am and the soul of me. I take care not to bore her/or anyone but to say something funny or what could be of use in a pub quiz!

I can't do anything right and am fed up. Yes you're right, there is no one to dance to her tune now [be a punch bag], she must be livid.

You are not a mug you have been conditioned.

Use your new help and support to rewire your internal settings.

EQ2 I need to acquire new knowledge and skills, and also find something to compensate for the loss I feel. I am looking into local activities, maybe to volunteer somehow and looking up old friends.

I hope the course will help, and that I won't get into a similar situation again. I do feel daft for putting up with stuff, but I did try and talk it out a few times to resolve insults etc. and just got 'If you don't like it you know what to do'. Which isn't a very mature response imo. And I feel daft that I didn't realise she was so pissed off.

.....I have noticed that in the last 2-3 days my urge to comfort eat has subsided [has been a bit of a problem for about 2-3 years, but been trying to exercise more].....a good thing for sure.

You have to be very careful when people use their health condition as an excuse to be nasty or out of order. The same for friends who are going through a tough time in life, eg lost their partners etc. People use all sort of excuses to allow themselves to be rude, thoughtless and disrespectful. And that's manipulative behaviour.

As time goes on, I'm convinced that most, if not all, friendships have a due date. You know when you've reached yours with a friend, it's a just a matter of what to do next. You might decide to still be superficially in touch or drop the friendship altogether, and move on to other things.

Whatever her reasons to have changed her behaviour towards you, it is clear that she's losing respect and taking you for granted. I would disengage from this person as much as possible, give her a few chances to correct her behaviour, and if there is no change on her part, try to move on, and call it a day with this friend.

Of all human relationships, I find friendship probably the most disappointing one at this point in my life. We have all this expectations, and dreams of togetherness, support and understanding, and at the end of the day, they're no better than family or partners. Even worse sometimes as the expectation was so high.

In my case, all my life I've heard and believed in the so called "friendship never ends" platitudes, and I ended up very sad and disappointed. Now I enjoy the present with my current friends. If it lasts for a long time, great. If it doesn't, well, that's life.

Your friends don't have to like the same things you do, but that doesn't give them the 'right' to be rude about them - I'm sure you're not rude to her about her liking for hen nights [shudder] and gigs. If she can't show you basic respect, she's not worthy to be your friend.

nero I had noticed there was always trouble/she caused a row when she had a health/work/emotional issue, like she felt the world had to stop and no one else had possibly had what she had or suffered in the same way. And trivialised other peoples problems and difficulties.

Yes I have always found it hard to make friends only to lose them as they move away, cease the phone calls, find new partner etc. Makes me feel very dispensable. But I agree that's life and it changes, people change. The stupid row just surprised me in it's swiftness and aggression.

This friend had promised that she was more reliable and wouldn't let me down.....another thing for me to be wary of in future. I expect she meant well but couldn't keep it up. I should have taken it with a pinch of salt, she was telling me what she gauged I needed to hear I expect.

I am going to move on and be philosophical about it, human beings are pretty damn complex after all.

Walk no I wasn't rude about what she does and likes - many things I don't like. She initially led me to believe she was a quiet and introverted person with quiet pastimes - and yet she really is very sociable, needs people desperately and is quite the extrovert. I have been quite bemused at how she has changed her life and her interests as the years go by to suit whoever she is friendly with at the time.

I just couldn't do that.

There's a lot of it about....
My problem is in spotting them before I overinvest in the relationship...I'm getting better at it though!

Sorry you've had a bad experience too cutting. I also had a lot invested in this friendship as I find it hard to make friends and am not in a position to meet a lot of people.

Have to have hope though....nice people are out there. Trouble is they usually have all the friends they need anyway.

Sorry to hear about your experience, OP. Sounds like this woman was a bit of a fair-weather friend who you mistook for a closer/lifelong friend.

It's very upsetting when you come to realise that no, the friendship didn't mean as much to them as it did to you, or perhaps that their definitions of what friendship meant were looser or more superficial than yours.

That can be a painful realisation and the process of disengagement can be very hard, particularly when, as others have said on the thread, there also seems to be no "reason" to end a friendship like there is to end a relationship, as you can have lots of friends at the same time.

I have just made the decision to end a decade-long friendship after the person I thought was my closest friend failed to support me after my dad died. I had been increasing unhappy with the friendship over the past year, but when you have a close and longstanding connection with someone, it's hard to break that link.

Perhaps I will allow my friend into my life at some point again in the future on a more superficial level, but for now it is too painful as I just remember what I wanted from the friendship which didn't match up to my expectations.

Perhaps you should ask yourself what you get from the friendship now. Does being with this person energise you or drain your energy? Do they support and help you at times, and do their good points outweigh their bad overall? Only you can answer these questions, but if the overall effect is of a more negative than positive experience for you, then maybe it is time to move on.

Danger she has been dragging me down for a good 2 years now, so much so I ended up telling my GP how low I was when I had to go for a meds review recently. I have felt drained after seeing her on a weekend, needing the week to recover then starting to dread seeing her again.

A lot of her comments in recent months have been quite nasty and I've reeled from them. Also if someone had upset me she would not support me.

And yes it is difficult....a marriage or a relationship failing, a bereavement, losing a beloved cat or dog and others empathise, a lot, and rightly so.
However if someone has no partner in life, lives alone, has few friends and loses a close friend it is a painful and significant loss too.

Sorry you've had to make the break too Danger, sometimes we are left with no alternative...and that's probably what they want anyway. Sad.

Did you post about this "friend" last month, cafesociety - under another name? There was some very good advice given on that thread too.