And so it starts...

[BusyCee]

...the pre-Father-and-step-mother-visit-anxiety. Not really sure why I'm posting, except that I posted on this issue in AIBU a couple of months ago and got some different perspectives. I'm not really expecting and answers, because I think I just need to sort out in my own head what I think and find peace with it.

So, in summary. DF left my DM for not-very-dear-at-all-step-mother when I was 3.5. Relationship has rumbled on, not brilliantly ever, sometimes dreadfully, but always casting a shadow over me. I've had some shocking self-esteem ishooos which I think stem directly from the way DF and StepM behaved. I've spent many, many, many hrs talking this through with professionals, and finally feel that I properly understand the dynamics in the relationship now. But I still can't quite bring myself not to, well, really dislike spending time with them. I've thought it through, and I think the reasons are;

A) they don't actually LIKE me, OH or the children. They have an ideal they want to achieve of a 'perfect' family, and expect me/us to conform to it. When we don't its pursed lips, anger and confused/wounded expressions all round
B) as I now have 2 DCs I can't understand how they did what the did, inflicting so much hurt, with nary a backward glance. Not to out myself, but they were both in professions where you might have thought they'd be aware of the damage they were causing and at least tried to mitigate some of it
C) now I have DCs I know how bloody hard my DM must have had it on her own with 2 children. They don't seem to recognise this at all - and exhibit a sense of entitlement to a presence my life that I find utterly incomprehensible. No humility or gratitude toward the hard yards she out in at all, and a general sense they've air-brushed their absence and the problems they caused from history.

Why don't I go NC? Because I think my DCs should know their family - so not just DF and StepM, but step-siblings, cousins etc. Also conscious I may at some stage find a way to accept all this and don't want to burn bridges although I'm now in my late 30s so not entirely sure this will come to pass

So. They arrive for 2 nights next week. And I'm already feeling the anger bubble up, and anticipating when and how they'll piss me off. Such fun...

Sorry this is an essay. Not sure what I expect from y'all. I may just temporarily update this as an outlet. Feel free to ignore me...

Whoops. Meant to put this in relationships - have asked for it to be moved

Cant you go NC with them but still see extended family?

or at least, don't have them stay in your house and not so close to Christmas

They don't behave like family, and tbh, it doesn't sound like your dc will miss out on anything if you do go NC.

If you carry on this charade (not meant to sound critical), in 10+ years, your dc will share your anger as to why these people visit when they're not interested.

What do you think your dc will gain out of this relationship?

If it was me, I'd cut contact now. Ring up, cancel next week, then send a letter detailing why you don't want to see them anymore. (I say I would, but in reality, I wouldn't have the guts

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

Thankfully they're not staying here. I think they find me hard going at the moment - and I understand why, I'm not entirely a barrel of laughs in their company - and so stay at B&B. I've drastically reduced calls/visits etc in the last 3yrs, but haven't had the cahunas to go the full NC....although have seriously contemplated.

I've thought of another reason I don't like being around them; we're just culturally different. I grew up with so little 'good quality' contact with them, and reduced the time I spent with them to virtually nil in my 20s, that we have little in common. Views, expectation, styles, traditions, manner of being - all different, so there are inevitable misunderstandings and ranklings some of which may be unintentional.

To be fair, they do keep in trying to insinuate themselves, so it's I obvs important up them to some degree.

I had a relationship with a guy back when I was 30(ish) and you could honestly be his sister, BusyCee.

His father and step-mother were both medical people, and completely indifferent to the carnage they had wreaked on a small boy and girl (and their mother) when they chose to be together. And lots of pursed lips, oh yes!

(I thought his father was a complete knob, tbh.)

I don't know what the answer is but I would sympathize with you massively decreasing contact, and still seeing the other relatives if you choose to. You need to get in control of this.

The weekend is looming so let's just try and deal with that first.

Firstly it's two days. They will arrive after breakfast and leave before bedtime. So not even 20 hours. Hold onto that thought.

Why not try and spend this time on the back foot, observing their behaviour as GP's that you want them to be.

For example could you organise a visit somewhere to see Santa? When they arrive just say it would be something the DC's would love to do with them. Let them take the lead - and observe how they interact, love and cherish your DC. Or not. It will help you decide what sort of relationship you feel you want to take forward.

Suggest lots of kid focused things, don't let them stew sat staring around your house while you sit there feeling judged. You need to earn being a grandparent in a kids life. Sunday can be about playing catch in the park or pushing them on the swings.

If you feel satisfied that they enrich the lives of their GC decide what relationship you want to forge and take forward. If they just aren't prepared to be commited GP's then I would think about NC.

What does your DP think?

Thanks all, for listening

Annoyingly, StepM is rather good with DCs. I don't like her manner with them, which ricochets me back to some of the experiences and feelings I had as a child (although my DCs are far more secure and stable than I was, so I think some of the things that wounded me pass them by. Or maybe I was just more sensitive). She does interact with them when we're together, though.

She and I have no relationship when we're not physically together, though. We may talk on the phone if there's a specific reason that DF can engineer to make us talk but otherwise not at all. Just being around her puts my hackles up.

DF has developed a weird habit of managing the dynamic between her and I. He obviously wants us to get on, so 'forces' some contact as above, but when there's conflict (as there was about 3yrs ago, which prompted me to reduce contact) he won't allow us talk to each other directly. I suspect he's terrified we'll have some sort if nuclear row that ends all contact. Which is possible. The difficulty is that he then filters communication, manipulates it and soft-soaps it, which in reality puts us further apart. Sadly I know he is really hurt by the paucity of the relationship, but because he/they either can't or won't deal with the reality, and insist on performing these bizarre displays of fancy ('it's all ok! And always has been! We're all one big happy family! Look how many DCs and GDCs we've got! Isn't it a whirl!!') he/they actually put more rather than less distance between us.

Also, as this goes on, I realise that behind all the relationship angst, I just don't actually like then all that much. I'm not sure that I'd be friends with then if they weren't family, IYSWIM.

In banging in again. This happened frequently with my therapists (that sound so precious...). Going over a d over the same hurts and slights without finding resolution. I'm reassuring myself that this may be a process if some sort, rather than a tedious and pointless cycle. Or maybe it's not...!

Thanks for letting me rant

Jolly - DP varies. Agrees with me that they're bloody odd, and can thoughtless and hurtful. Was v supportive during 'The Unpleasantness' of 3years ago. Often counsels not to play their game, but just do and say what we want.

OTOH, thinks its good for DCs to have contact with them (they're the only GPs around). And has recently suggested we use then to look after DCs while we go away. Over my dead body....

Is your mum still alive, OP?

Your DF is carrying a lot of guilt, by the sounds of it, and your SM is biting her tongue not to have it out.

Do you get to spend much time with your DF alone? Really talk and tell him how hard all of this has been to accept. Does he know about your counselling?

Could DH go out with step mum and DC's for a bit to let you talk. I think he'd listen if you started by saying you were considering closing down the relationship. It sounds to me like your SM plays the tune and pulls your DF's strings. He is dancing between the two of you to create a façade of happiness.

As long as they keep convincing themselves that relations are good and everything in the garden is rosy it minimizes the effects of their selfish behaviour all those years ago.

Imperial - at risk of outing myself (again), no. DM died suddenly about 8yrs ago. Life carries on, doesn't it, but I still miss her terribly. As you'd expect it feels an injustice that they get to be part of my life, enjoy the DCs etc, and she doesn't

Jolly - he and I have spoken about this before, on a couple of occasions. Each time I get braver and am more honest, but to be honest I don't really know what I want from the whole situation, so other than venting years of anger and hurt at him, I'm not sure what I can say that's constructive. Again, to be fair to him he made an effort to visit me on his own about 18mnths ago, and we talked then. I tried to get him to talk to me about his perspective, as I thought that would help me gain some balance, but he just said it was all such a long time ago he doesn't really remember....which infuriated me as it seemed another example of his cavalier attitude. For me these were formative experiences which shaped my shitty self esteem, and he can barely remember!! I'm sure there's a healthy dose of self protection in his poor memory (as you say; guilt), but it does rather fan the flames.

He asked what I wanted the relationship to be like, and I don't really know. I suppose I want less contact with them, for them to be more grateful and less entitled, for them to start playing by my rules instead of enforcing their own - but how do you say all that, or expect someone to understand when their agenda is entirely different?

I'm drip feeding, I know, but there's years of hurt here. It's possible there isn't a definitive answer, but that we'll keep making the best of it for years to come.

Thank you again for reading and your thoughts. It feels good to get it down without adapting for the audience, IYSWIM!

Busy Please don't forget that you are ALLOWED not to like them! Blood isn't thicker than water - people just say that to make excuses for shoddy behaviour by family members.

If you don't like them, you don't like them. I really don't think that your DC will suffer from not having a relationship with them.

Sometimes, people in life have to pay the price for their actions. It shouldn't be you having to pay for their actions.