Staying together for the sake of the children. EA husband.

[piper21]

I feel I need a support thread as there is no-one in rl I can talk to

DH and I are in a bad place. We have good phases and bad phases and now is a bad phase.

He is EA but I am also not without blame.

He is a wonderful father and spends a lot of time with the dcs. He really puts in effort and he also pulls his weight around the house.

But he is unhinged. He is very very intelligent and is an Alpha male type. He holds a very high opinion of himself and I think he has narcissistic personality disorder traits.

He loathes my family, especially my parents. He doesn't like many people except his group of friends from university. He is rude to people eg neighbours.

He holds many views that are unpalatable in the modern world. Eg he is anti gay marriage and gay culture. He doesn't want ds to have pink girly toys in case they 'give him wrong ideas'.

There is so much more to say.

I can't leave him as we have three very small dc. I couldn't manage on my own as it is exhausting dealing with them even with his help (he works from home so helps throughout the day). But more importantly I feel they need him. They adore him. He adores them. He provides discipline and firmness that I can't achieve. We would never agree an amicable divorce because he would want full custody. He would never accept even joint custody and I couldn't bear not to see them every day.

Is anyone else out there sticking together for the sake of the kids? If so please tell me how you manage.

If you've snapped after being spoken to and treated as you've described enough, that is not your "poor behaviour". That is him deliberately goading you until you swear at him, in which point he can merrily claim the moral highground and say you are in the wrong. And that is really doing a number on you - especially as you can write that you are "pushed and goaded" but still feel you ought to apologise

Could you try and get some proper legal advice? If he is abusive, it probably won't be that easy for him to just go for custody. The reason you are leaving/divorcing him would be abuse, I can't imagine that looks good during the custody case...

of course you can leave - he will not get full custody, not a chance.

He is not a good father, treating you like dirt is just horrific. You will be so much happier without him. I agree he is goading you in an attempt to get you to behave badly so he can shift all the blame onto you - pretty calculating and awful don't you think?

What would you say to your daughter in your situation - stay for the sake of the kids and put up with his abuse? You called him the c word because that is what he is - bad behaviour or you speaking the truth? I bet he says your bad behaviour is when you stand up to him and don't take his crap any more. I think that is bravery on your part which isn't bad.

Have you considered speaking to Woman's Aid?

That one detail about the prescription is telling OP. He's not mentally well is he?

I am totally on the side of trying to work things through if it is remotely possible when there are children concerned, But in this case - realistically, you may not feel strong enough for it now, ideally you need to get you and your kids away from him eventually.

The first thing is to contact WA as posters have said, they will be able to support you and also to put you in contact with lawyers who specialise in cases of abuse to give you advice. You might also go to your GP and share your concerns about his mental health. Tell the GP that he is emotionally abusive to you and you are concerned about the effect on yourself and your children. This will provide a record.

*lawyers to give you advice about your rights in divorce I should have said.

He does have some mental health issues. Episodes of anxiety which have left him bed bound. Very rare though. He is extremely anxious in day to day life esp where dcs are concerned, that's probably why he reacted as he did over the medicine being left out.

I am aware of trying to gather evidence of his awful behaviour - but what would I say to the gp? I don't need medical treatment as Im thankfully not depressed (stressed tired and sad perhaps).

Mil is a whole different thread. He has learnt EA from her. They are very close at the moment but when I first started seeing him it was very different and she would regularly threaten to cut off contact with him, wouldn't speak to him for weeks on end and was generally volatile and unpredictable. She definitely has mh issues of some kind, and H used to agree that she did, but now she can literally do no wrong. He speaks to her about twice a day.

I have just recently left my EA ex. He was father to 1 of my 4 children. Drilled it into me that he helped out greatly and that i would never cope without him.
Knowing, inside me somewhere, that i coped better before him.
I put everything down to him being mentally ill and tried helping him. Little did i know i was enabling him.

My mind kept bouncing between 'he is right' to 'this is wrong. He isnt normal'. This confusion went on for years and effected my health.

Which in turn, effected my dc.
I thought my kids were happy.
When i left him, that sane day - i seen the true happiness seep out from them.

Please, please do not think you cannot do this on your own. There is plenty of support.
When i left my first physical abusive relationship - i had private nurseries allocated through social services so i could concentrate on my health, to help me become the parent i wanted to be.

It can be done. It is a lot easier than living like how you are. Although, i know fron personal experience (twice), that it really doesnt feel like that at the time.

For me, the positive results came instantly. Which made me stronger, and more determined.
Most importantly - it made me realise that i could do it!
It takes a lot to believe in your own ability when you have had someone drag you down constantly.

Your children will pick up on it - even if you think they are oblivious and happy. They know!
My kids are aged between 3-10 and they were more aware than i thought they were.

Lot's of people suffer from anxiety, not many go ape-shit over a prescription medicine left on a microwave to the point of lecturing for 30 mins & demanding an apology. That's not healthy.

Tell the GP the truth - that he is highly anxious, has had bed-bound episodes of anxiety in the past, can be 'un-hinged' as you put it, and is emotionally abusive.

You don't need to request medical treatment, just ask her 'advice' as it were, the point being to get that logged on your notes. If his mental health deteriorates at any point, which is quite possible, it will be advantage to already have it flagged with the GP.

Mil is a whole different thread. He has learnt EA from her. They are very close at the moment but when I first started seeing him it was very different and she would regularly threaten to cut off contact with him, wouldn't speak to him for weeks on end and was generally volatile and unpredictable. She definitely has mh issues of some kind, and H used to agree that she did, but now she can literally do no wrong. He speaks to her about twice a day.

And this is the point - that children learn EA patterns from their parents: either as the abuser or victim. That is why posters have stressed the importance of getting your children away from him. It's the only way to break the pattern of abuse being passed on.

OP, he really does sound like my exh, down to nasty controlling mil too who could do no wrong (with mh issues too) and exh on the phone with her multiple times a day...

You really are not stuck, you do have the option to leave. I left dh at a time when I was working ft, he was not working, he had mh issues (which do not excuse or justify the abuse - does not mean you have to put up with it), and we have 2 small dcs. I had left a medical trail with the gp, that was very important (not about me, but about attempting to get help for exh and then discussing the dv issues with gp).

DCs now live with me 100% of the time and exh only has supervised access. Just because your DH is not working at the moment, does not mean that he is a good father and will end up having DCs even 50/50. But you do need to get legal advice.

Mil is a whole different thread. He has learnt EA from her.

This is the legacy that your children have to look forward to if you stay and assist in modelling such a poor example of a relationship. If you leave, you give them a different message. That it's not normal and it's not ok to treat someone like he treats you.

It's not going to happen today, nor tomorrow nor perhaps even that soon. Bu please, start reaching out for RL help to exit this abusive relationship.

Start with talking to your friends and telling them the truth instead of covering for him, and make a call to Women's Aid.

Staying for thé sake of the children is harming them.

Getting out for the sake of the children is THE ONLY option you have.

You think you're trapped? You're not. The only person/thing stopping you getting up and saving your dc is you.

You are thé only hope they have.

There is never an excuse to stay with someone who abuses others.

Hi piper

I am so shocked to read this. It's horrible. You poor thing. Please do start learning about emotional abuse, talk to your GP, women's aid. You are allowed to start taking control.

In the meantime I would be forming an escape plan,,putting money away if you can, photocopies of any proof of his assets, hiding passports, all the usual stuff. And keep a diary of episodes,of EA, so you can be sure that they happened and when they happened.

Good luck,please keep posting.

please don't say it's 'for the sake of the children'. it's for your sake, your fear you won't cope, you feeling you want his help with the children etc. it's not 'for' them and is obviously no good for them.

you must own your own decisions and it's wrong to pretend you are doing this for your poor children. you can read here how awfully people who grew up feeling their mum sacrificed herself for them have suffered.

And you know what, staying for the sake of the children is so much harder than being on your own. My house without the ex is calm, happy, tidy, chilled and full of visitors who enjoy coming here. Before it was tense and unhappy, and I was a complete and utter nervous wreck. And above all my daughter is so much happier and free to be herself without the fear of an aggressive father breathing down her neck all the time.

I second FrancesHB's suggestion to keep a diary of the incidents of EA. Keeping a diary was the most useful thing to get me out of my mess. Feel free to pm me if you want more details.

You seem to see at some level that although there are things you have done which you are not proud of, you would most likely not do them if you were not in the same room as this man.

Your behaviour does not absolve him of any of the blame.

If you can't leave yet, set yourself a deadline (be aware that the longer you stay, the harder he will make it to leave, for example by grinding you down to the extent that he can claim concerns about your mental health) and double up on contraception to make sure he doesn't tie you in further that way.

Then make plans, gather information, practise firm discipline (you may be having problems with this because he is subtly undermining you, though), talk to WA, talk to a solicitor who understands DA, get a counsellor if possible (there's a reason to go to the GP) and keep posting here or on the EA thread so that you don't sink into denial.

Thanks for all the replies. This thread is the first time I've ever articulated my marriage problems and it's so good to - for a change - have people confirm that H's behaviour is not normal

I am a long time mnetter and have read many a EA thread and thought that sounds like my situation except H is even worse and with mil in the mix it's all a nightmare.

I feel like I have no allies and Im in this house with two enemies (when mil is here - which is very often).

Charlotte - I have begun a vague log of incidents but only the major ones. The day to day behaviour eg ignoring me so I have to repeat myself, not saying good morning or goodbye when leaving the house, general cold-shouldering etc isn't logged. When my parents visit he barely speaks to them and hides in his office. They are nice, kind people who've never had an argument with anyone in their lives and I think they are genuinely confused about H's behaviour.

Pinkpeony - when you talk about leaving a medical trail with the gp, I assume your ex was violent? Mine is not at all physically violent and never would be. Still not clear on what exactly I would say to our gp (who knows about H's anxiety as he's prescribed drugs for him).

Living with EA or NPD can cause a lot of different medical problems, so I think it's enough just to go and talk about your situation.

My STBXH was never violent (very manipulative, but violence would've been beneath him), but I told the GP about what it was like living with him. I had some minor symptoms of stress, but that was just a pretext.

TBH, although he listened attentively, the GP's advice wasn't much use to me.

What was useful was a few months later when I was able to write to him and ask him for a letter to say that he believed I could be in a DV relationship. I then took that to a solicitor so that I could access legal aid to leave him.

OP, do you have a female GP at your practice? I would see a woman if you can.

He doesn't have to be physically abusive to justify telling the GP, emotional abuse is a legitimate problem.

Just think, if you left him, you could leave anything you liked, whenever you liked, on top of the microwave without fear of a good telling-off and an enforced apology for something you're not actually sorry about.

Speaking from experience in both physical and emotional abuse - id say the emotional is a lot more damaging. Id bet a lot of others would agree.

Going to the doctors is a good idea. You can also log things with WA. They would also be able to help you rationalise things and see things clearly.

I logged at the doctors without even realising. Him making me go to see if i was psychotic and things. It will all be brought up and used against him.

Piper21
please please please leave now. My ex couldn't stand the children when they were young but liked to boast about his wonderful 4 children. I put up with his behaviour planning to leave when they left home, it all came to a head, long story short, he poisoned them against me, manipulated them and they left to live with him. I have lost the evil monster but in doing so have also lost my dear children. Get out/away now please. The pain of losing your babies is harder than being a lone parent. sending you strength x

Piper21 - when I started discussing with my GP, he wasn't violent (that came later) but he was verbally abusive and EA and was acting very erratically - leaving DCs in dangerous situations - waking me up multiple times in the night so I couldn't get one decent night of sleep before going to work, isolating himself and us socially, etc. It was helpful to have for the record some incidents where DCs were in danger with him as his judgment/responsibility impaired. And I kept a very detailed log of every nasty name he called me every day, events like him trying to wrest my phone away from me to check my messages, shouting and screaming at me in front of DCs, terrified DCs saying I should call the police, etc. I ended up handing over the whole diary to a solicitor and it formed the basis of my case against him (corroborated by medical records).

A log is good - but don't stick around just for the sake of compiling one.

I agree with the other posters that of course you have to leave - you've seen how your H was shaped by the way he was parented, so how can you expect your dcs to be immune?

EA is tricky if it comes to a residence dispute, so in terms of a timeframe, I would think seriously about trying to get out - with the dcs - before you return to work. But do talk to Women's Aid, as they can give you loads of practical advice.