Setting boundaries and moving on from emotional abuse

[Lollypoppop]

The ea started with my sister in very early childhood. As the younger sibling I obviously threatened her autonomy and her way to get around that was to be a 'little mother' to me. She looked after me, guided me and dominated me for our whole childhoods. If I tried to get attention from our parents in any way then she would undermine me by telling me afterwards that I was just like 'my naughty little sister' and that worst of all I was selfish. I was probably being perfectly normally behaved but was brain washed into believing that my thoughts and feelings should always be supressed for the sake of others.
Fast forward a few decades and although on the surface I'm assertive and confident I have been repeatedly manipulated by anyone who gets close to me. Friends, boyfriends, workmates and the dc- everyone!
The problem now is that although I know I am going to be manipulated or exploited I just can't seem to figure out exactly where a boundary should be and therefore I can't stick to it, how can I when I don't know where it is?!
So how do I go about fixing this? I just can't seem to find a way! How do you recover from being the abusee?

I can only give you a personal take on this one but I believe you have to fundamentally stop seeking approval. To be manipulated you have to want people to like you. In modifying your behaviour so that they keep liking you, that's when you can be exploited. To become the type of person that doesn't need that approval so much the 'correction' involves behaving in a way that you will initially think is cold, selfish, difficult ... even unkind. 'No' becomes your default setting, your wishes trump everyone else's (up to and including DCs incidentally) and you filter all your actions through tests such as 'am I happy?' and 'is this what I really want?' You consciously (and it takes effort) make yourself the #1 person in your life.

It will feel unnatural at first, others will bridle at the change, and you may lose a few friends along the way but it's a price worth paying.

Just my take...

Practice. I would sit and think about what you accept and don't, remember every time your gut wrenched because she or someone else overstepped, or where you realised afterwards because you felt upset or unbalanced. Or the times you just wished you had behaved differently.

Practice saying no. Practice with small consequences. I think if it is something you are not used to you need to learn to turn it into a habit, and first you need to identify where your boundaries are.

However, she will not be used to you saying no or disagreeing with her, and will not like it, so be prepared for fallout. I think it will take lots of time too, it is not easy changing the way you automatically react to people, but baby steps.

I think cogito is right too, learn to improve your own self-validation and esteem, so that you are less reliant on wanting validation from others nad happier to listen to yourself and your needs. Look after you! There seem to be plenty of books on boundary setting out there too.

Lolly this is a major question for everyone who survives abuse and recognises that they have an ongoing problem because they default to victimised roles.
I have always believed that we give out a signal of some kind - and not just to potential abusers! I have made a number of women friends who have eventually revealed that they also have been subject to narc parenting/abused childhoods. Either it is far more common than we assume, or there is an internal beacon.

I really recommend looking at the Stately Homes thread and reading about other peoples experiences. If nothing else, it will reassure you that this is a problem many have to cope with.

For me, therapy taught me to look at why I react as I do. In understanding the "why", you develop the ability to question your reasoning. And with that, comes the ability to change the reasoning.
For instance, realising that being a people pleaser is rooted entirely in well learned lessons that keeping people happy keeps you safe, means you can pause before answering anything .....and ask yourself if you are agreeing because its right, or good for you, or because you will feel at risk (of losing the friendship/hurting the person/losing something) if you say no.
Usually, it turns out to be the fear

There are two other tips that may help.
The first is that you need to believe that it is OK to say 'no'. People worth having in your life are not there just because you always say yes. People that actually care about you will be just fine with hearing 'no, that doesn't work for me'
The second is to stop seeking approval for your decisions. That is really hard, and I found the best way was to have just one person (who will never abuse you, and who you trust utterly - I use my adult daughter) and when you feel a decision needs to be talked through (every single one for me, when I started)....only discuss it with that one person. Because you do not need validation from other people. What you think is right, is right for you. Truly!!

It is really hard to put that level of self-approval into place, but it is a key to changing how you feel about yourself, and the way you signal to others. The only thing which perfects it, is practice.

Its a long road, but I think you are already moving along at a pace, Lolly. Your post shows a lot of self awareness, and a lot of understanding about root causes. That is more than half the battle

Major cross posts.
Cogito always has good advice in these areas. Calming makes a lot of sense.
You can probably see a theme emerging from all of us, OP

Thanks for your posts, sorry I've not been back sooner to respond.
There's loads of good advice there, it really is about making me the no. 1 person in my own life. It feels scary just to think that, but I know I have to make it a habit.
Seeking approval isn't exactly my issue, it's more avoiding disapproval. It's a subtle but significant difference and definitely is more about not making any demand of another person and never asking for anything. In order to avoid this disapproval (for being selfish or demanding) I will just 'close down' on my own emotions and feelings- not exactly a healthy option. I carry lots of resentment as my logical brain knows it's not equitable yet the child in me prevents me from speaking out. The scary thing is that there is a bit of a backlog of unexpressed anger and resentment that's built up over all these years and what might happen if I let it out? It needs to be a controlled explosion!

Thinking about it, I even feel uncomfortable when someone gives me a present (even for my birthday) and awful though it is to admit some of the clearest memories from my wedding day are resentment that I was left alone on the morning. My sis and mum were both 'too busy/stressed' to be with me when I was getting ready. When I asked if I could have something to eat for lunch I was treated as though I was being a complete diva! I felt guilty all day that people were doing things for me and there is a definite feeling of shame when I think about that. I've never worked that out before- weird.

Embrace disapproval :) Or another way of looking at it is to work on being assertive. I have a very outspoken friend who, as a result, is occasionally on the receiving end of some nasty behaviour from others. When I talked to her about this the other day she said 'You can't say the things I say and expect no comebacks.' In other words, you have to match assertive behaviour with a thick skin.... disapproval comes with the territory. Approval-seeking has to be shelved.

So what if there's a controlled explosion of anger? Sounds like it's long overdue and needs to happen. No more Mr Nice Guy.

My tip to go from 'suppressed rage' to 'assertive complaint' is to begin the sentence with the words 'I'm not happy with this'. It succinctly lets others know how you're feeling, sets the tone, sets the expectation, and forms a bridge making it easier to say WHY you're not happy.

'I'm not happy with this... your service is lousy and I want to see the manager'

'I'm not happy with this.... get off your backside and start shifting yourself round the house. I'm not your servant'

'I'm not happy with this.... I ask for some company/food while I'm getting ready for my wedding and you make a big song and dance about it.'

This classic book on Assertiveness gives you a very good framework for how you should calmly state your needs. The consequence of getting what you ask for is feeling guilty so you have to work on that too.

The book suggests role play to practise the new skills. Start with small matters and move up to big ones like dealing with DSis or DM.

Good luck OP - this is the start of something liberating!

Cogito, I really like the phrase 'im not happy with this' it sounds assertive but not inflammatory.
Lemon, Thanks for the book recommendation, I think role play will be very useful as I'm already quite good at thinking what I should say (instead of what I do say) but I need to get over the anxiety of getting the words out of my mouth! There's a lot of anxiety about the other person's reaction too so if I could role play different reactions too I think it would be useful.
Dh might be disappointed when he realises this isn't the kind of role play he would have preferred!

"The Book of No:250 Ways to Say It" is a book that I have found to be helpful. It gives situations and brief explanations of "what is really going on here" and then a script for saying no to that situation. It could provide a good source for practice material.

My counselor drummed into me the idea of "that was then, this is now". So the dynamics from childhood are not really relevant, as childhood is long gone. That helped me be ok with breaking the mould so to speak and actually feel the freedom to use my own brain and finally see and develop the true me, my identity (also known as stop being invisible in my own life).

You may also benefit from some study of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (complex)...the complex designation pertains to recovery from long term childhood stress. Sorry I do not have a source to link right now; I will try to bbl).

I also have issues with my sister and have achieved NC recently (it took about 5 years). I simply could not heal/recover while still being engulfed by her in the childhood dynamic. She picked up and carried on the standard when mother died. She denies any aspect of her behavior and dismisses everyone else's point of view (denies me my truth).

Yes, the decades do go by, I am 51.
Thanks for posting.