More I should do or am I being a mug?

[flyingfarfalla]

This is such a horrible thing to say but it has got to the stage where I feel like DP is just tagging along in my life and I am at a loss of how to support him or whether I can/should.

He doesn?t contribute financially (I work FT which is quite stressful but am very lucky to have it and that it pays well so we are financially secure), with childcare (he found it a bit much looking after our toddler when we moved abroad ? which I appreciated? so DS (now 4) is in nursery each day and DP picks him up at 3 and looks after him before I get home and help out with bath and bed) and with looking after the flat which he felt was preventing him from looking for work (so I got a live-in helper who does the cleaning, cooking and shopping). He also doesn?t contribute emotionally (I never get a birthday, Christmas, valentine or mothers day present but always try and make the effort with him).

The main thing though is that he just doesn?t seem to want to do anything at all ever. Honestly, if he was filling the time with a study course, with starting a business, with volunteering, with a hobby etc which made him happy (all of which I have said I would support) I would support that. But he just says he doesn?t know what to do. He says he doesn?t have a ?thing? which makes me a bit upset since I can?t see why me and DS can?t be his ?thing?. (Who really gets to do their thing anyway ? I would love to live in the country and faff around with crafts all day for example but I can?t and accept that).

He also says that he would really like to get a job so that I have to work less but makes little effort to do so (I think he has applied for about 4 in 2 years). He says he feels he can?t do things as well as me but I don?t put pressure on him to do so and I try and boost his confidence ? tell him he is a good dad, that he looks nice etc. He spends most of his time looking at cricket on his bb.

Realising he may well be down or even depressed, I have tried to talk to him and suggested counseling but he says he doesn?t want/need that. When I try and discuss the future and what he thinks we could do to make him and both of us happier/have better job prospects/moving again etc ? he says he doesn?t know and he doesn?t have any ideas.

I have rather lost patience now. This isn?t a partnership and I feel like I am living with another child (although one that has less energy) that I am losing respect for. I feel like I want to cry most mornings and feel let down and sometimes cross. If I tell him I am unhappy he just sighs and says that makes him feel bad so I try and be upbeat as much as I can. I?m trying to be a good partner but am not sure I can love with so little coming back still. It?s not that he is taking advantage by spending lots of money or going out loads (in fact I wish he would go out or get a hobby) it is more death of a relationship through passivity and ennui. Am I being pathetic?

[SolidGoldBrass]

He's a lazy, selfish tosser. Throw him out. He will either suddenly find a job or, more likely, another mug of a woman who will put up with anything not to be single.
You will barely notice that he's gone, except there will be less mess to clear up and a bit more money. Best of luck.

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

You may well feel sorry for him but does he show you the same consideration?. I do not think so and he has a cushy existance. Feeling sorry for him has also landed you in this mess.

Who is paying for this holiday he is taking with DS?. His family, or even worse, you?.

What are his family like and what do they think of him?.

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

You've paid!. He hit paydirt when he met you didn't he?.

Sorry but you're a mug to be putting up with this nonsense from him.

[Tottie24]

Sorry I haven't read all the posts but to me is sounds like he cant be bothered to do anything for himself, and no matter how hard you try he know that he doesn't need to do anything as you will sort, organise and do or get everything done for him.
He may well be depressed, but doesn't need to do anything about it as you are managing to carry on and your little one is fine in childcare and with you.
I don't think it has anything to do with living abroad more like that he is quite happy to freeload from you as you are more than capable of providing all support (on every level) for yourself and your little one and him and kind enough to tolerate him and his idleness.
Sorry if this sounds harsh but I have recently worked though something similar though i wasn't as financially successful as you are I was having to take all the responsibility despite asking and asking him to step up.
Perhaps you being so capable has emasculated him, but that is his problem and he needs to do something to make himself feel better and only he can do it. Good Luck ps I wish I was your husband!!

[Flibbedyjibbet]

If you didn't have to pay for childcare, domestic help (I.e he did it) you could work less I guess.

I don't understand how he can coast like this. In my world you either work or you are at home looking after children and keeping house.

I can only assume he is depressed. That said I would be so resentful at him doing nothing. Is it possible you are being too nice and too supportive?

[KatyTheCleaningLady]

Think in terms of tough love. If you push him out of his comfort zone, he will be forced to adapt. He may find someone else to coddle him, but then he won't be your burden.

[noobieteacher]

He is not a 'trailing spouse' if he's living on home turf. He chose to be there.

What do your parents think of the situation?

[noobieteacher]

You say you haven't planned a future together, could this be because it's a good way for him to get what he wants?

[LessMissAbs]

Do you think he would still stay with you if you didn't pay for him and made it a condition that he find paid work?

[dreamingbohemian]

I think there are a couple things going on here.

I think he should be investigated for anxiety rather than depression -- it sounds like he's always been like this, shutting down when the pressure is high (you said he did this when your DS was born). That sounds more like anxiety to me, but there are therapies and/or meds that can really help with this.

I think it would be okay to give him an ultimatum to go to counseling. If he woke up one day and was physically paralysed, you would make him go to the GP right? You can say: it does not seem healthy or normal for things to be like this, and I have exhausted all the options I can do myself, so we need professional input. If you're not willing to do this, that's fine, but I can't live like this anymore and I can't stay with you if you won't try to fix things.

But second, as an expat myself, I don't think his paralysis is all that uncommon. I would say more than half of the expat women I know here are in a similar boat. That's not a reason not to do anything, but I second the suggestion to read the Living Overseas threads and get some ideas for how to approach things.

Finally, have you looked into what would happen if you do split? You're not married, would he be able to stay in the country? Just wondering if he knows how dire the situation could get if you do split up.

[dreamingbohemian]

Also, I'm not sure about you going to counseling. It's just you once again seeing something that needs to be done him going to counselling and taking it on yourself so now you're the one who will go.

I think just having another conversation about how unhappy you are with all this is not enough frankly. I agree with AF that it's ultimatum time.

[noobieteacher]

Dreaming, she is the expat, they live in his couuntry of birth, dcs born in the uk.

[dreamingbohemian]

No they live in a country closer to his country, not in his actual homeland.

[flyingfarfalla]

yes, we are both expats. I am from UK where met DP and had DS there. we moved to Asia which is closer to his family in Australia but still a flight away. I'm not sure what his family think and I don't know if he talks to them about it. his parents are quite old now. mine feel bad for me I think but also don't want to intervene since they feel not their place. I think he does love me and want to be with me and would stay if gave ultimatum but whether he could rise to ultimatum is another matter. seems like I am not being unfair if I try that though and also ask again re speaking to GP. if we did split, I would go home and he also has European passport so free to work and live there but i need to feel I have really done everything to help him first since would be pretty drastic...mainly for him and DS.

[cleopatrasasp]

OP, you sound lovely and I think you're wasting your time with this man.

He doesn't work.
He doesn't take care of your home or your child.
He doesn't do even basic emotional support.
He doesn't care enough to buy you presents or even cards.
He is pretty boring in the bedroom department.
He hasn't asked you to marry him.
He leeches off you financially.

This man is not depressed, he is a lazy timewaster. I know people with painful chronic illnesses that are housebound that do more than him and have more fire and ambition in them despite the hand they've been dealt with in life. Please stop enabling this manchild, you really deserve someone better.

[noobieteacher]

The thing that concerns me is that as he is the main carer (not) he might be able to obstruct the dcs return to the uk. In the uk, stability for children is the key factor in decisions where there is a dispute over access and residence. It would depend on the law in Australia.

[QuintessentialOldDear]

This relationship is insane. He would not stay with you if he had to work, or do chores. You know this, and that's why you are not pushing more.

[cleopatrasasp]

They're not in Australia, they're in Asia noobieteacher but your concerns are still valid and they'd crossed my mind as well.

[Lazyjaney]

By the description I'd say the OP was in India, Singapore, Malaysia or Hong Kong. It's actually very difficult for non-locals to get work in those countries outside of the corporate expat job structures, if they are even allowed to work at all (what does his Visa allow, OP?)

I also think most of the posters on this thread haven't got a clue about what being a "trailing spouse" is like. It's hard enough going to another European country with a foreign language, never mind one that is Asian to boot. Kids make thing harder, not easier as your freedom of action is hugely reduced, all those "difficult hours" casual jobs are out. The old saw about the "3 A's" - alcohol, adultery and ennui - are all too prevalent in my observation.

Also, if the sexes were reversed on this thread, I suspect the reaction and advice would be radically different, I wonder what the "dump the lazy bastard" lot would be advising then? There would be no talk of "cuntlodgers" I suspect, and a lot more about understanding, time, your fault OP for dragging your spouse to further your ambition, how dare you give ultimatums to the mother of your child, etc etc.

Just something to consider....

I also haven't seen the penny drop yet about who probably gets to look after the child after separation.

[QuintessentialOldDear]

They are not married though....

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

Hi flyingfarfalla,

re your comments in quote marks:-
"I think he does love me and want to be with me and would stay if gave ultimatum but whether he could rise to ultimatum is another matter"

You think (!) he loves you?. He shows you hardly any emotional support whatsoever. He certainly likes the set up you have because it suits him no end. An ultimatum would probably not change anything and it can be only issued once. This bloke is the Little Emperor and you are kowtowing to him at great cost to yourself.

Re this part of your comment:-
"seems like I am not being unfair if I try that though and also ask again re speaking to GP. if we did split, I would go home and he also has European passport so free to work and live there but i need to feel I have really done everything to help him first since would be pretty drastic...mainly for him and DS".

DS could do far better as well in terms of having decent male role models. What about you in all this, honestly what more can you do?. Why do you have this innate need to have tried everything before you walk away?.

What did you learn about relationship when growing up?.

What does he bring to this and what do you get out of this so called relationship now?. That needs a lot of thought on your part.

[Squitten]

So this guy just sits about all day, every day doing nothing at all?! And you are paying for hired help to look after the kids and the home while he sits there doing nothing?!

I can't believe you even have to ask whether this is a reasonable arrangement. He sounds like a pet dog...

[QuintessentialOldDear]

Very nice role model for a little boy, this man child is. You are raising him to be the King on the hill where men sit around and do nothing and women work their arses off. Thing about this, at least.

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

The only good to have come out of their relationship is their son. These two should not be together at all to my mind. Plodding along just causes more resentment and hate to build.

Even if this couple were in the UK which they are not, my counsel to OP would be the same. OP feels sorry for him but there's the impression here that OPs man has taken full advantage of her kindnesses and has milked this for all he is worth.

[noobieteacher]

Oops, got that wrong again. Regardless where they are, he is main carer and dcs are living under the laws of the country of residence. I am not a legal expert but I think it would help you OP to find out what the worst case scenario might be .