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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Should I stay for the kids?

15 replies

Tottie24 · 05/08/2013 21:27

I'm a married mother of 3, ds is 5, dd 4, dd 2. We married nearly 8 years ago, I've always wanted a large family, and prior to marrying worked really hard to try and enable affordability for me to have a large family and not work for a while. We both have our own businesses, but things have been a real struggle over the last 5 years financially, so I juggle raising the children and working mainly in the evenings and during nap times as I really want to just be a stay at home mum not to mention childcare costs, though over the age of 1 the children have done 1-2 days a week, though I also have done some childminding to help offset the crèche cost.

I desperately wanted a 4th child to complete the family, I watch the children and feel that we just need one more to balance the family, I hate seeing one child left out most of the time, even if they aren't bothered just now.
Husband says no.... Won't have a conversation about it, I have asked why not, his sleep. I know there should be compromise but without discussion how can there be?

I have worried and stressed about our financial situation, I have had to borrow money, take out loans, re mortgage, (I had bought 2 properties before meeting husband that I let) he has watched me re evaluate and re calculate spending of my business, our outgoings, I have had many sleepless nights, he has always told me he earns good money but when I asked him what he earns he never knew/gave an answer.

Anyway recently children and business has become too much and before I costs me my health I have decided I have to sell so I asked him in march what his net profit is, I continued asking and finally he told me at the end of July, it is less than 5figures. I was pretty shocked as I had no idea as well as doing all the cleaning 90% of the cooking most of the shopping and was the primary care provider for the children that I also provided just over 75% of the income though being treated as a stay at home wife.

Then last week I had to look for something and came some old accounts of his from 6 and 7 years ago and so I had a look and they were similar to this years, I feel so hurt that he could watch me agonise over out finances without saying anything, the fact that he has earns so little for so long and not bothered to try anything about it. He did say though that he thought it was a fine amount for a single man. He feels that enjoying his work is hugely important, what he earns and the consequences of such bear no consideration.

So I asked home why he married me knowing what I wanted from my life, he said he didn't think it through. I now just feel that my world has fallen around me, I won't ever be able to have the family or be the stay at home mum that I so desperately set out for. Should I accept this to keep the family together? He is a nice man on the surface agrees with most things, says what he thinks you want to hear but takes no responsibility to help make it happen. I feel like I have made such a mess of my life as I haven't achieved anything that I had set out to that had been really important to me. I'm pretty miserable and just don't know what to do, sometimes I feel really cheated other time think I'm behaving like a spoilt brat, what do you think?

OP posts:
bigbuttons · 05/08/2013 21:32

Heavens only you know the answer to this. you need to sit with your dh and do some serious talking. Good luck.

AKissIsNotAContract · 05/08/2013 21:38

Is there more to this? You want to leave him because you'll never reach your goal of being a SAHM but won't that goal be even harder to reach if you're a single mum?

Why don't you role reverse and he do more of the childcare as your business is more successful?

ImTooHecsyForYourParty · 05/08/2013 21:39

I think that you should consider finding a good couples counsellor and talking it through.

It would be foolish to bring another child into a difficult financial situation and unforgivable to bring a child into the world that was not wanted by both parents, but there is a need for the two of you to sit down together and really listen to each other and sometimes that needs a third person to help you.

Tottie24 · 05/08/2013 22:41

Thank you for your support and responses, I think I will try and see if he will have some counselling with me as he isn't a good communicator. I do try and get him to talk, I ask him questions normally he says dont know or he hasn't thought about it, if I leave it for a few weeks and ask again he would have forgotten to consider it which I find frustrating as I feel he doesn't really give us much thought.
I agree another baby would be disastrous, which I am really struggling to come to terms with., I wish I could be happy and content with the 3 beautifully healthy amazing children we have, I know I should be, but don't understand why I'm not, maybe I just need time to readjust my vision of my life.

Dh doesn't want to be at home with the kids, though ordinarily a patient gentle man, he really struggles with the children, he is pretty grumpy and intolerant of them and doesn't really enjoy time with them.

OP posts:
mcmooncup · 05/08/2013 22:47

Hmmm he sounds like he is not really 'in' this family......is that a fair assessment?

Needsomeperspective2 · 05/08/2013 22:51

From reading your post it doesn't seem to me you have much of a partnership as it is. You seem to live very separate lives, you taking care of yourself and the kis with your income and him looking after himself with his. If there have been times if financial worry, why haven't you ever worked out a combined income / expenditure. What does he mean, it's a fine salary for a single man? He's not single!! Personally, I think life is too short to stay in a marriage just for the kids, but I would try everything to make the marriage work first, like counselling. Putting a 4th child to one side, what do you get from the marriage? Do you still Kev your husband? These should be the guiding questions, I would say.

AKissIsNotAContract · 05/08/2013 22:51

Dh doesn't want to be at home with the kids, though ordinarily a patient gentle man, he really struggles with the children, he is pretty grumpy and intolerant of them and doesn't really enjoy time with them.

That doesn't sound good :(
You seem very capable, running a successful business and doing all the childcare while he's not bringing much to the relationship.

Cabrinha · 05/08/2013 22:57

Ouch - harsh for your kids to say you feel like you haven't achieved what you wanted to?
It seems unfair to complain about his earnings - sounds like he didn't lie, and I am surprised you didn't know - how did you work out your household finances?!
I also think you can't complain about there being no discussion - sometimes, having another child is just a no for one partner. There isn't anything to discuss - you just don't want one.
You seem to be really set on what YOU want - not him, or your family. You have this idea that one is left out with three... four isn't going to change that. What is you have DD3, and the girls leave the boy out? Or DC4 is a loner, or spends all their time with a friend? I'm one of 5, and only 2 were close to each other as children and played much together. Think you need to drop your assumptions!

I think having a fourth if you are in difficult financial situation is crazy.

As for your H... Forget the fourth child and your disappointment in his earnings for a minute. Do you love him? It sounds pretty harsh to talk about leaving him because he doesn't earn enough for YOUR dreams.

YvyB · 05/08/2013 23:12

For what it's worth (which might be nothing whatsoever!), I think it's probably time for you to come to terms with the fact that life often doesnt give you what you want. If you keep trying to list, plan and control what you want, you're bound to be frustrated and disappointed. Just because you WANT something doesnt mean that you have the right to have it. It doesnt even mean that having it is the right thing for you.

Like you, I wanted children. Sadly dd died, a year later I had ds but exh left whilst I was pregnant so that was the end of my dreams of a big family. Like you, I also work with children which brings me great pleasure. I can't expand my biological family but I have so enjoyed the company of the several thousand children I have taught over the last 2 decades. Think about developing your child minding. It could be so rewarding for you.

Having been a single parent I would say think things through carefully and be absolutely certain that there is no alternative before you commit yourself and your dcs to that life. If your dh is cruel and abusive and threatens your welfare then yes, leave. But if it's just a case that you're not singing exactly the same song right now I really would urge you to explore different ways of coming to terms with and accepting your differences. The best thing you can give your dcs is a stable, loving home, not another sibling...

Tottie24 · 06/08/2013 11:49

Thank you Cabrinha, I appreciate your response, when I said I dont feel like i have achieved what I had wanted re children, I have always wanted to have been part of a big family and wanted this for my children, this is not meant to be any reflection on the beautiful children I already have. I think that I crave a big family partly because I lost my father when I was 20, I have one brother who doesn't speak with our mother, but also I remember being envious of friend's with lots of siblings, loving spending time at their houses, I crave the hustle and bustle of a hectic household.

I think I could understand that 'no is no without any discussion' if it had always been that way, but initially he promised me I could have all the children I wanted, and i feel to change track without discussion is not fair.

I don't know what he wants any more, I have asked and asked, as for a long time I have felt as though I am in limbo waiting for him to decide what he wants so I can work around that as a base for my plans wrt where we are going next, but he doesnt know, I have been waiting for him to work something out for over 2 years, I have tried to ask questions to try and help him decide, ie does he want to be employed or self employed, works shifts or reg hrs he just doesnt know, but it has come to a point that I cant just wait and wonder and plan for any eventuality, I need to know what I am doing for myself and the children. We are currently located in abroad, visiting uk for the summer holidays, my husband works in abroad for the winter and UK for the summers. we do agree on wanting the children to be educated in the uk.

I really don't know if I do love him anymore, i do still like him but I am hurt, that he thinks it is ok to ignore our problems and leave it to me to burden. The issue for me isn't so much his low income, it is more to do with him not doing trying to do anything about it.

OP posts:
Tottie24 · 06/08/2013 12:03

Dear Yvyb
I am so sorry to hear of your loss, I feel that my problems are rather inconsequential with what many people have to deal and for that I feel guilty questioning and being dissatisfied (for want of a better word) with that I have.

Part of me feels as though as my husband isn't really abusive I should just put up and shut up, but I am also concerned that his temper wont improve and his frustration with the children could become less controlled, the other evening he returned from work while I was bathing the children, after eating he came to help, he tried to dry DD1 but she said she wanted me to do it so he pushed her towards me and she fell flat on her face. I am certain he didn't mean to push her that hard, but he did. there are times that I worry about him being around them, but other times he is an excellent father. For me if staying for his is the best for the children then I would without doubt but I am just not certain if things will get better with him or worse, I have often thought that perhaps baby and toddler stage just isn't really interesting for men and that once they are older he will enjoy them more, I just don't know. I am defiantly considering doing something with children, childminding, teaching, just don't know what?

OP posts:
Tottie24 · 06/08/2013 12:11

Dear mcmooncup, needsomeperspective2, and akissisnotacontract,
I do feel that he isn't really 'in' this family. I have asked him to try and be more involved, take more responsibility even before any children came along, but nothing really comes of it, eg if I asked his to take responsibility of our bank account to check if there is enough money for the mortgage every month he will do if for a month or so then just seems to forget. I think it is because it is of no interest to him. I just don't know how I can get him to remember/think or consider anything outside his work or hobbies. Any suggestions would be really appreciated.

OP posts:
ImperialBlether · 06/08/2013 12:23

So your husband earns £9,999 or less and you hadn't realised? Do you not share bank accounts or take on certain bills?

Three children is a big family nowadays! Most people have to make the difficult decision whether or not to have another child and finance usually plays a part in that decision. Most people can't afford four children; it's just that it take some time to adjust to changed expectations.

YvyB · 06/08/2013 12:39

Hi Tottie. Don't feel guilty about having an ideal. I'm just suggesting that when an ideal becomes more of a focus that the reality you already have, it's bound to lead to frustration and disappointment - primarily for you - and the more time you spend dwelling on what you haven't got (and let's face it, there are no guarrantees about pregnancy and even if your dh was as enthusiastic as you, you still might not have another dc), the less time you have to enjoy the situation that you do have.

It seems to me as if there are 2 separate issues here. The additional child is one, your relationship with your dh is the other. If you already know things could be improved with your dh, isn't that the logical place to begin? After all, if there are stresses already showig with 3dcs, another is unlikely to improve things. Only once you've really focussed on trying to make that the best relationship that you can will you know if it's a marriage you want to keep.

Meanwhile, why not look in to working with children a bit more seriously? You could start with volunteering to help with organisations. I ran a youth group and helped at a cub pack before I went in to teaching. It will give you some wider interests in your own right too which might be a healthy distraction from the dh/dc4 worries you're focussing on right now.

I'm absolutely not suggesting that you just put up and shut up if your dh's behaviour to you and your dcs is unacceptable and damaging though.

Tottie24 · 07/08/2013 20:09

Thank you YvyB
I have heard your advice and will definatly do some volunteering with some kids groups or in schools. I'm feeling calmer now, I am going to focus on selling business and house and moving back to uk and I have started looking into doing things with children. I have been trying now for 6 years to help my husband work out what he may want to do over here but I now feel that there is only so much I can do so I am going to leave him to work out his own direction and see what happens. Thnank you again for careing xx

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