We want different things - where to go to from here?

[ExpatConundrum]

I have been here for a while and though I mostly lurk, I have nc for this. I could really use an outside point of view and some impartial advice. This is quite long, sorry!

DH and I are both from the same European country. We moved to the UK 5 years ago when DH was sent here as an expat with his company. At the time we already had dd1 who was 9 months and is now almost 6. We now also have ds (3) and dd2 (12 weeks).

I never really wanted to come to the UK as I wanted to stay in my own country close to family. Important to know also is that I grew up in the UK as my parents moved here when I was a child. I have since studied in London and moved on to live in the US and Spain for a while.

DH grew up in a small town in our country and studied in the local university and until we moved 5 years ago had never loved abroad.

When we left our country I told him I was willing to go for 2 years as I felt it wasn't fair to stop him. After 2 years I conceded that we would stay until dd would start primary school in our country. That would be this September and we still haven't made plans to go back. He is not really interested and is not making an effort to look for work there. My career has in the meanwhile stopped, if not gone backwards, which wouldn't have happened in my home country.

Today he heard the news that his company may send him back for a few years. I am thrilled and know that once we return, I will not want to move again. He doesn't really want to and I believe he sees himself leading the expat life forever. The idea alone makes me feel deeply unhappy.

So where do we go from here? We clearly want different things from life. I don't want to be the person to stand in the way of his dreams. At the same time, I don't want to continue being somewhere I am not truly happy. Don't get me wrong, life in the UK as an expat is very privileged. We live in a beautiful house and our kids go to a great private school. But I don't actually care much about those things. I just want to enjoy spending time with my family. I want my kids to grow up knowing their cousins and extended family. I would happily live in a small house to enable that.

Sorry this is so long but I hope to get my head around what to do. Should I talk to him about this? If he doesn't want to settle at home, do I go alone? I do love my DH. He is a very good man and wants the best for us all. We just don't agree on what the 'best' is.

What do I do?

no-one?

Didn't want to read and run, I'm afraid I am of little help as have never been in your situation. Have you spoken to dh and asked him to stand in your shoes to see where you are coming from esp from the job point of view? Would he be as willing to be missing out on his career?

Maybe if you move back and he can see how much your families mean to dc he will rethink?

Hopefully someone who understands the situation better will be along soon

Sit down and talk to each other, where do you both want to be in another 5 years. Not point speculating til you know. Good luck

There are some things to consider becuase this is a case of more than one nation being involved.

If your husband is determined to stay in the Uk, is it possible he will negociate an extension with his current employer, or seek an alternative UK based job in order to stay put ? If so, is he likely to give you permission to take the children put of the country ? Is your home country a signatory to the Hague convention ?

If he is likely to be unwilling to allow the children to leave the country it is not a given that the courts would come down in your favour and allow you to take them to your home country.

Secondly, if he were willing, what impact would it have upon the children/paternal realtionship if they were to be living in a different nation to their father ? Would there be a risk that they would gain your family of orgin, but lose their own ?

It's not fair that you face this. You two had a deal that he appears to be welching on. But the truth of the matter is that without his approval to remove the kids from the Uk, you may have precious little choice in where your children and consequently where you live.

Any way you could sound him out on this front before the relationship fractures and negociations get trickier ?

There is an expat forum on MN - try them

I imagine this is a common problem. Have you and your DH really sat down and talked?

Have you spelt it out to him in a very clear way that "If I am to stay here, away from my family, I will be deeply, deeply unhappy."

If not then I think that's what you have to do. You have supported him. You gave him extra time. But now it's time to make yourself heard.

If he is adamant that he stays in the UK then its time to discuss whether another arrangement for your family is best.

I have a feeling that if you are clear about how important this is for you, he'll listen.

There is an expat forum on MN - try them

While there may be more "expertise" on the expat board, I'm glad this post is on a "mainstream" board.

So many people are unaware that emigration+children can limit thier choice of where to live in the longer term should their partner change previous agreements, or the parental relationship collapse.

I've known too many trapped women who had no idea until it was much too late that their options were going to be very very limited once they had kids overseas, or took their British born children abroad.

True enough Carpe. I had in mind the sort of long range plans that people often make when deciding to do the expat 'thing', more practical stuff, which might be unusual in other relationships.

I do get what you mean, and I think a post on the expat board signposting people here is a good idea.

However at the heart of this is a couple, who have children together, who want very different things. A sucessful outcome is going to depend on communication and negociation, both sides being better able to understand the perspective of the other, which is more "relationship" specific than "expat" specific.

No expat experience at all. To me it sounds like you need to have a really honest, calm conversation with DH. You each need to know where the other stands. Do either, or both, of you feel strongly enough to separate over this? What would that mean practically for your DC. How do your DC feel about moving home? Extended family is hugely important to me and mine are lucky enough to have it, but I'm noticing it matters markedly less to them as they hit pre-teens.

I really feel for you. Sorry not to be more help.

Near the end of your op you say "should I talk to him about this"?

Should you talk to him about this. Yes, massively.
Sounds like you have not told him much. Or only told him small stuff.
Now is the time to tell him your deepest feelings and fears. He needs to know, and you need to tell him.

Sorry for not having replied earlier. I am actually on holiday in my home country and little access to internet in the place I am staying.

I think for me being here, bumping into friends and family and just feeling like I can really relax is making me realise that this is where I want to be.

I have spoken to DH about this many times so he knows that I want to be back home. I think he is just hoping I will change my mind and go along with the expat thing forever. That just isn't going to happen though.

I will try to find time to sit down with him and really talk to him. He really is a good man and perhaps if he realised how important this is to me and that I can't change my feelings, we can work towards a solution.

Thanks for the boost. It was great to be able to write it down.

Hi, I've just spent four years as an expat in exactly the same situation you describe, and am now back in UK with children but without DP, who still didn't really hear what I was saying.

I think it really matters that you discuss it together. From my experience and from that of many of my mates, I think the working partner often doesn't understand the different experience of the SAH partner, and the additional strains of that in a foreign country. My mum mates & roots in the community mattered so much to me when our kids were small, - and to the kids as they got older - and this is a part of the expat experience which the partner at work sees little of. Its like seeing another dimension and this needs to be articulated really clearly, because at work, all the messages are around career paths, packages and the benefits of expat life partly because its seen as weak to talk about difficulties. We were in a very stressed expat situation, where still all the official messages, and informal chat at work, were upbeat, despite really clear signs that everyone was under massive stress from the external environment.

Good luck, but trust your intuition, and from my perspective it has made such a massive difference for my quality of life returning to my home country, though we're in a new area where we know no one, but I am so grateful just to be 'at home'.