Moving from being the OW to being his girlfriend...

[beingmyself]

I've got my flameproof suit on and will start by saying I know being in an affair is a selfish and cruel thing to do. I did it. He did it. We decided we wanted to be together so after having an affair for several months we both left our spouses. He has moved out and so has my h.
We are not living together though and are not intending to for a while. We are also still secret and will remain so for some time.

Is anyone who has been there brave enough to come and talk to me about the highs and lows of finally getting to be together? I knew it would continue to be a rollercoaster and would really appreciate anyone who's willing to talk about it with me to do so here or to PM me!

Thanks

[beingmyself]

I've not ever been told in counselling I'm making/have made mistakes - the point is you figure out yourself whether you're making a mistake or not... Surely...

[mathanxiety]

MN is cheaper and quicker.

[Wellwobbly]

And how is that working for you, and the people around you, Beingmyself???

Hear, hear, Math - MN is gloriously refreshing, and the kicks up the arse are for free!

[Wellwobbly]

'Is that correct that qualified counsellors would not agree to see those having affairs?' - what I said is that any counsellor or therapist with any professional standards, would not see a person having an affair and their affair partner. That would be 'condoning a fantasy' and the OW/OM seems to be genuinely seen as irrelevant, a symbol at best (sorry OP)

They will see SPOUSES (ie the committed relationship) in which one person is having an affair, because an affair is 'a maladaptive way to cope with issues that develop during the course of a committed relationship or marriage ... or that arise from problems that one or both of the individuals brings to the marriage or relationship' (Rona Subotnik).
Again if they were skilled enough they would pick that up (the affair) quite quickly and stop the marital counselling (couples counselling is completely pointless if a third person is present diverting the emotional energy and commitment of one of the people present, including the deceit), and would arrange IC instead.

[beingmyself]

It's working really well wobby - thanks for asking :)

[FrancescaBell]

Still writing goady little posts I see OP? Even though you said you were leaving the thread days ago?

Life is long.

How things are 'working' when you're living in a secret bubble where you don't have to account for any of your real actions to others is, as I'm sure you'll realise, not the same as it might be when the penny drops or your actions over the past few months get discovered by those others.

Nor can this brief phase be compared with real life.

How anyone with any sensitivity can glibly write that counselling or anything else is 'working really well' for others who don't know the truth and have been left hurt and devastated by your actions, is impossible to fathom.

It might be working well for you (although I doubt it, given the insensitivity and goadiness of your posts) but it's unlikely it's working well for others who've been affected by your actions, which was the second part of the question.

[beingmyself]

It wasn't meant to be goady francesca. I was asked a direct question and was going to explain why but everytime I try and explain anything the responses back are always so predictable "he's lying to you", "his wife is the only victim and nothing is her responsibility", "you're both awful people", "you are terrible parents", he will go back to his wife" that I couldn't be bothered to elaborate without answering the direct question.

I still think we are making the best choice by taking things at our own pace this way - if anything the responses on mumsnet have only served to reinforce that view.

[FrancescaBell]

You wouldn't have put that smiley face if you weren't intending to be goady. It's just more of what you were doing up the thread to Littlepeapod. You appear to be very self-deluding, but fortunately you've been unable to delude the majority on this thread because your motivations are so transparent through what and how you write. I'm sure the people in your lives aren't as stupid as you seem to think they are either.

I'm sure you think you're making the best choice for you and your boyfriend. How you can think it's the best choice for others or that the posts on this thread reinforce your decision is again, unfathomable.

[beingmyself]

I don't think anyone in my life is stupid.

I do think it's the best choice for everyone in this situation. Every situation is unique as are individuals in it. I have genuinely made what I think is the best choice given the information I have available which is all anybody can do in any situation.

The thread was never meant to be about "do I tell how we or together or not?"

If I've been goady then genuine apologies. I just cannot bear the blanket statements on mumsnet which are made. When I was having an affair I was told "he will never leave his wife", now we have both left and are keeping our relationship under wraps for many reasons I am being given a lot of stick for that too, as well as being told he's lying to me blah blah blah.

It's got my back up and I probably haven't responded to that in the right way. Shame that most of the PMers haven't posted on the thread as there is an alternative view out there but many are so afraid of the backlash that they don't post it.

[Growlithe]

If you cannot bear what you read on Mumsnet about all this, why do you post on Mumsnet?

[Bogeyface]

Francesca

"I'm sure the people in your lives aren't as stupid as you seem to think they are either."

One of the things I said to my STBX when I was certain he was cheating and he insisted he wasnt (he was!) was "I am not as stupid as you would like me to be". I rather suspect that this is the same with the OP.

[LoserNoMore]

I've read this thread since it started but never posted. I just wanted to say that I think coming clean and telling everyone would be a brave step. Do you really want to start continue a relationship on such a lie? It's so hurtful being lied to continuously and I think it's a pretty shitty thing to keep up.

I rumbled ex, he continued to lie. If he had just have had the balls to come clean straight away I'd have had a bit more respect for him. He only lied for a short time but it was enough to show him up for the spineless person he really is. Lying gets you nowhere IMO.

[chamonixlover]

I do think it's the best choice for everyone in this situation.

Are you speaking yet again on behalf of your husband, children, boyfriend, his wife, their children? Do you really mean that?

[beingmyself]

Yes chamonix - I am speaking on behalf of them by saying that cause I do believe it's the best thing in this situation given the individuals involved and the situation.

Just as other posters are speaking on behalf of everyone by saying we should be completely honest.

Everyone is making an assumption and in this case I do think me and my partner are best paced to decide. I really really really don't think his ex would want to know and I don't think mine would either. The kids are all so young I think it would do them no good. I know you won't believe it but I have looked at it from all sides.

Also have been doing a lot more of putting myself in the ex's shoes and being more empathetic to some of the hinges she is saying and doing. The thread has been very useful at helping me with that.

[MaryRose]

I've read this post with interest. I myself had an affair, first husband was physically and emotionally abusive, I wanted out, I met someone else. I'm not excusing having an affair even though my first marriage was abusive BUT what I did do is front up straight away and admit to it. Why on earth do you think it's better to lie beingmyself? I'm sorry but that sounds cowardly and self serving to me. I'd think more of you if you bit the bullet and told the truth. And also I do think you are ridiculously naive asking for advice on how going from the OW to girlfriend is going to be on here. Honestly, grow up, you made your bed so lie in it and stop whingeing. Sorry to be so blunt!!!

[FrancescaBell]

It's a moot point whether your ex would like to know. By the sounds of it, he might have his own affair to hide. If he hasn't asked you any questions about whether there's someone else and you haven't either, at most you're lying to eachother by omission.

You can't have the first clue about whether your partner's wife would want to know.

You don't know her.

I'd be surprised if she hadn't asked her husband straight away if there was someone else though. In all your justifications on this thread, you've never once said 'his wife hasn't asked if there's another woman, so this leads us to think she doesn't want to know'. Your partner lied to her didn't he? Perhaps he lied to you too, claiming she didn't ask that question? Or maybe you're lying to yourself by not asking him too much about the questions his wife has asked and the lies he has told her?

As a few others have said too, whose feelings and interests are you both protecting by lying to your parents and all your friends?

Apart from your own?

[Bogeyface]

Lets not bullshit here.

It is not in "everyone's" best interests. Its in YOUR best interest and you have managed to square it in your head by convincing yourself that no one else would want to know.

Who the hell are you to decide that? Who the hell is your "partner" to decide that? Neither of you really care what she needs or wants, so the fact that you seem to be able to say, hand on heart, that you are doing the right thing for her staggers me!

It is self delusion at its absolute finest!

[mathanxiety]

When you decide 'what is best' for so many other people you are arrogantly controlling the situation, and not doing so in the best interests of anyone but yourself. You and your honey are trying to gain an advantage here and what you choose is chosen with only your own interests in mind.

I would not like to be you when the shit hits the fan but of course you have deluded yourself that nobody will find out or suspect anything until it's too late and you have your custody arrangement wrapped up, or your poor mope of a husband goes through mediation and a financial settlement without being animated by anger or the humiliation of being cuckolded.

What you are doing is ugly. When (not if) the truth is uncovered you will have some very angry and hurt people to deal with, including your children and his.

[MaryRose]

The fact is beingmyself the truth will come out and then you'll wish you had the guts to front up originally. I don't judge you for having an affair but I do think you need to man up and tell the truth. Your ex may be wondering what the he'll happened. When I left my abusive XH for my new partner numerous do gooders told me I should have kept it quiet and 'got together' a few months down the line. Bullshit. I'm glad I told the truth. It won't be easy for you whatever happens and it does sound a bit like you think you are living out some wonderfully romantic secret. I've been with the man I had an affair with for 8 years now, married for 6. XH and I are now friends and he has got engaged to his long term partner. So it can work out but you need to start facing up to reality first if this relationship stands any chance

[DameEdnasBridesmaid]

beingmyself I think you should do what feels right for you and your DC's. That's what everyone else will be doing in this situation. That's what all the posters here are doing, just saying what they think is right from their own experience or opinions.

You have my admiration keep coming back on here to try and explain.

[LittlePeaPod]

As the sayings goes.....

"Every lie is two lies ? the lie we tell others and the lie we tell ourselves to justify it."

Or

"Worse than telling a lie is spending the rest of your life staying true to a lie."

[DameEdnasBridesmaid]

tell the truth unless to do so will hurt or injure others

[LittlePeaPod]

In this situations they will be hurt even further not only by the affair but by the deceit that's going on when it all comes out! Lying will not stop the hurt or injury.. It will just make it worse and much more painful!

[DameEdnasBridesmaid]

Not according to some posters on the thread, some wished they'd never found out and others didn't want to know.

So clearly it doesn't make it worse for everyone.