Upstairs neighbour is in a very abusive relationship- what should I do?

[dyslexicdespot]

I will try to keep this short. We live in the bottom floor of a split level Victorian house, she lives upstairs with her two young children and her partner. The house is very badly insulated so we hear everything that goes on upstairs.

DH and I phoned the Police a few months ago because we thought that her partner was killing her. We could hear what sounded like a body being thrown about and hit. My neighbour was screaming and begging him to stop and to leave. The police came just as she was running out of the house with her children. She told them that nothing was wrong and they asked him to leave and cool off.

They all came back a few hours later and the fighting continued. I want to stress that I have never heard anyone be so violent and say such horrible things to another person. The children were crying and begging him to stop. We phoned the Police again, non emergency number this time, but they never came by.

Since then, some of our other neighbours phoned the Police on this family as well, during another violent fight. My upstairs neighbour has made it very clear to me that she was very angry that we had phoned the police, and that she thought we had were the people that had phoned them the second time.

They had another very bad fight yesterday. I started slamming some pots about, just to let them know that I could hear them. A few minutes later my upstairs neighbour knocked on my door with her youngest child. She was very upset, crying and shaking.

She asked me to tell her if I had a problem with her and to stop interfering and phoning the police and making things harder for her. I kept on asking her if she wanted to come in and if she was OK. Then she went back upstairs and they fought all afternoon.

I really am not sure how to deal with this. I feel bad for slamming the pots around instead of doing something to help her, but I am not sure how to help her! I can't sit around and do nothing. Any advice would be appreciated!

(I am about to put my DS to bed, so I might not be able to respond until he is asleep)

It sounds bloody awful for all involved (except possibly her bloke)

Is it rented or owned? You could possibly get somewhere by complaining to the landlord/landlady/HA or whatever, but I don't know if this would make things better or worse.

She clearly needs help...and so do the children. In fact I think I would contact social services because she can make her own mind up, but they can't - so I'd be more concerned for the kids iyswim.

NSPCC or SS would possibly be able to suggest a better course of action for you in any case...worth ringing them I think.

Don't interfere again...not in person. Probably won't help much - also are you safe yourself, if he turned on you?

I think you should explicitly explain that he is committing a crime and that you have to call the p

Sadly although the last government detailed a proposal for 3rd parties to be able to report DV this has not yet been adopted as law. There is no way a 3rd party can instigate a prosecution for domestic violence however i think you can inform the police on the basis that there is a disturbance of the peace.

the problem is obviously that you feel guilty that her situation is made worse by the Police's involvement however, this is obviously frequent, loud and violent and children are involved I would involving children's services..these children are at risk and even if she is entitled to put herself in danger we all have a responsibility to protect the children. you can contact them directly or via the NSPCC. you don;t have to be identified as the reporter.

If she confronts you you can also say that it is not only you who have been in touch with the police...the more they are aware that others are concerned the safer the children will be.

sorry you are in this position. Glad you aren;t just keeping your head down

Oops

Call the police when it happens because it is your duty as another human being and a witness to crime. That it affects you and your family and you are worried about her and her children and that despite this you hope she knows that you will always be there for her to come to anytime if she needs to.

You should direct her to women's aid, offer to come with her if she wants or mind the children, explain she can do it secretly and safely, they will support without putting pressure on her to leave before she is ready.

Also tell her that you are sympathetic but she needs to take action for her children or you'll have to I.e. call social services. If she can't or won't accept the help then I think you do what you've said, call the police and social services each time.

Yes, when a crime is committed you must phone the police. I phoned the police to my neighbours once and they weren't pleased, but I said I would do it again if I heard noises like that ie what sounded like one young man attempting to murder another.

I don't think you can help as such. A friend was in a very similar position to what you describe, the abused woman deleted her from FB, ignored her in the street etc when my friend started raising the issue of the abuse. That lady didn't have kids though.

Maybe SS is your next stop, as a child protection measure. Sounds awful, things like that always make me feel sick.

I've done this btw with my neighbour. Eventually they split up but she has now got back with him and moved out and I have no idea how things are going, I suspect not well.

I would call the police and ask to speak to officer from the protecting vulnerable persons unit (pvpu). explain what has been happening and your concerns for her and the children. they can put a "flag" against the address so if there are further calls during any incidents, the call is a priority. pvpu can put a referral through to children's services too.

Phone the police EVERY time but don't give your name if that helps. No child should have to live in a violent household. SS will become involved if there are regular DV reports, regardless of what your neighbour says.

I think fool was slightly wrong about third party reports. If the police attend and there is evidence of a crime (a mark or bruise for example) then they can arrest and prosecute regardless of what she says.

SS. The lady may decide are wants to put up with the but the kids need help.

Thank you so much, very good advice.

We rent privately and her flat is a council flat. He has never approach anyone in my family.

I think I will call children services tomorrow. They fight constantly and he is so incredibly vicious. I just wish that I could communicate to her that I am not trying to make her life harder, but that I simply can't sit around and ignore the fact that a human being is getting beaten up next door to me.

Thanks again for all the advice. I will definitely call the police anytime I think she is being hurt.

I am never able to speak to her alone. I only ever see her if we pass each other in our shared hallway and he is always with her.

I thought that I could write her a letter with the names and numbers of various organisations that could help her. I would also be able to explain to her that while I mean her no harm I will always phone the police. We this be a good idea?

levi yes you are right if there is physical evidence...but not if there isn't....same as Gp or A and E reporting DV if a story does not fit the injury and they suspect abuse.

i would n't pass her a letter....if he gets hold of it it might be a disaster. Is there a communal hallway fit for a Women's aid poster? (you can print them form their website)

We do have a communal hallway but it is only shared by our flats. He would see it and he would know that we had posted it.

You have done the right thing. One day, when this woman is safe and not dead, she will be glad you didn't stand by and do nothing. Her self-esteem will be in shreds and while she doesn't know it now, the act of saying it's not okay, and someone has noticed and cared, will have made a difference. To her and her kids. Kids in homes with DV don't know what is and isn't okay. The act of an enlightened witness noticing and trying to help can make a huge difference.

What I suggest you do:

• Don't send a letter that he can see. That sounds dangerous for her.
• Keep a diary. Dates of incidents, what you hear, what you see. Could be useful for any divorce proceedings (if they're married), custody battles, police or SS investigations.
• Record it, if possible. Do you have a voice memo app on your phone or something you could use?
• Call the police every time. If she objects again, explain that this is a crime and while she is afraid to do anything about it, you are unable to stand by and do not have a choice.
• Report to SS, directly or via the NSPCC. There are kids involved who do not have a choice. Someone needs to act on their behalf.
• Is it possible to speak to her while he's out? Could you invite her over and offer use of your phone to call Women's Aid for some advice?

You don't want to be one of those people who end up on TV saying: "Well, we knew he was violent and we always worried about them but we didn't bother telling anyone." You did the right thing calling the police, you really did. They can indeed prosecute if they see fit. The quality of response to DV victims can vary rather - ideally they should be removing him from the property rather than just telling him to cool off.

Those kids will one day look back and thank you. Please feel proud of yourself for giving a shit and not turning the other way like so many do.

If you know other neighbours are also calling the police can you talk to them and both agree to always call if you hear trouble? The more calls the better.

Do what you feel is right.

She is telling you that you are making things worse because she is not yet willing to hold him responsible for his own actions, so she has to blame somebody else. In this case, you, and I would wager, herself.

She is in denial, and you can't help her with that.

However, you can and should call the police and social services, as there are lives, and children's wellbeing, at stake here.

It is good that you are taking an interest.
I would call the police each time you hear anything untoward. In the area where I work social care are informed each time there is a police call where there are children in the house/ family, even if they aren't there at the time of the incident. Domestic violence is taken very seriously here. It does not necessarily need the woman's cooperation either. The police and Social care are very experienced in dealing with this and I doubt they would be fobbed off where there have been frequent calls to the police. It would be investigated.
It is scary when there is the risk that they may confront you but it needs to be dealt with by the appropriate agencies. Those children are at risk, not least of severe emotional harm but what if it all went quiet during one such episode and you hadn't acted.
Sorry that you are in this situation but I feel you have a duty to act.

Thank you so much for all of the helpful advice. I agree that I have a duty to act, but I was unsure how to act.

She came down stairs last night while I was putting DS to bed and apologised to my DH for speaking to me when she was upset. She wanted me to know that she was not mad at me. He explained to her that we felt that we had to phone the Police when we hear violent arguments. She said that she understood that, but that it was very hard for her.

I work from home so I will try and have a word with her after her partner has left the house. I will call the NSPCC right now. Thanks again for helping!

I think that you need to explain to your neighbour that it is intolerable for you to live with neighbours who fight violently, and repeatedly, within earshot of you and your DC. Stop making it about her and make it about you so that she cannot ask you to stop helping her.

I just got off the phone with NSPCC, they will contact children's services.

I agree with you Bonsoir and broken, I don't want to be exposed to her partners violence, and I certainly do not want DS to grow up hearing people abuse each other. I will explain that to her if I see her alone at some point.

I will be sure to update if anything happens.

thanks again!

I forgot to add that I will start to record and keep a logg their fights.

Well done. She's terrified and not thinking clearly. You have done the right thing.

Well done.

Although I was incredulous at the time, the fact that a neighbour knocked on my door and asked me if I wanted him to call the police is something that really helped me several months later, once I had left the relationship. That memory helped me to come to terms with the fact that yes, it really had been that bad, bad enough for others to notice, and that I was right to leave.

And it is good to hear that NSPCC may now act to protect the children involved. You've done the right thing.