forgiving an abusive ex

[masquerade]

I was 16 when I met dd's dad, 17 when she was born. He is 5 years older than me. The relationship was emotionally and mentally abusive with a couple of episodes of physical aggression. I even always knew I didn't really love him, obviously there were good times, but even then his OTT declarations of love and adoration used to highlight that I didn't feel quite the same - of course part of his abuse was to tell me I wasn't normal, wasn't capable of loving someone, and that was why he acted how he did. He had a drink problem and when he was drinking his behaviour was at it worst.

We split up when dd was 1, she's 10 now. We've been apart way longer than we were together and yet I still feel fairly traumatised by the relationship. Not to the extent that affects my daily life, I've buried it fairly well and no-one really knows the details of what went on. But I still avoid confrontation with him, I still get very emotional at any hint of it, and when we do argue its like being back there again. He still has the ability to make me question myself, to wonder if I am actually going mad. I'm an intelligent person, I had a degree and a good job now. I haven't had a serious relationship since him. I'm very happy on my own becauyse the thought of ending up back in that sort of situation is terrifying. When I hear other women talk about arguments with their partners I can't even comment because even though I logically know its normal for couples to argue all I see/hear is manipulation/control/abuse.

He is getting married soon to a woman I really like, dd really likes and seems to be a stable influence on him. I still find myself secretly wanting it not to go ahead, because if she leaves him for the same reasons I did then that will validate my feelings, because like I said I still sometimes doubt myself, doubt it was abuse, wonder if it was just me.

A few weeks ago during an unusually long period of contact (usually we exchange a couple of sentences when he comes for dd, this was a 10 minute conversation) he told me had got a new job. Its a position he's worked hard for and I congratulated him and told I was really pleased for him. Afterwards though I realised I wasn't pleased for him at all, I'm not annoyed that he's doing well but I'm definitely not happy for him, and this made me feel quite sad. I can't think of anyone else I wouldn't be pleased for if they got good news. It kind of made me wish I could just forgive him, not for him but for me.

I think I probably could forgive him if I let myself, I'm fairly forgiving in nature. But there are things holding me back - he's never admitted what went on in our relationship, if I forgive him it feels like I'm saying I was wrong. Also there's fear, that if he reverts to type it will hurt even more if I've forgiven him.

The last time we argued he said things about dd that made me worry he was going to treat her the way he treat me, but that was a couple years ago and things have mostly been okay since. At the time dd said to me she felt like he didn't really like her, and that he just wanted her to be perfect. But things seem okay at the moment.

So how do other people with having an ongoing 'relationship' with their abusive ex? Can he really have changed? Does it make me a horrible person to hope he hasn't, because that almost invalidates the experiences that still affect a lot more than I like to admit?!

Wiser heads will come along no doubt (considering I am still in the healing phase - something I recently discovered).

But I actually think you have forgiven him. Just writing this and your (although limited) contact for your daughters sake demonstrates that.

What you're not abe to do is to forget.

And that is actually a healthy protective reaction to what has happened.

Within that memory there is an unanswered question - "WHY". and thats what's really bugging you. You're looking for closer. and maybe you could ask him, but I'm beginning to understand that most abusers will never give you that.

So maybe this will help : It was never you masquerade it was him.

closure*

I think your mistake is to have an ongoing relationship with your ex. An abusive, manipulative bully is not a friend. I understand that you have to retain some kind of contact if there is a child involved but that should be as far as it goes. All the time he has access to you he is carrying on the same abusive behaviour. Might not feel like it outwardly but this part struck me .... Also there's fear, that if he reverts to type it will hurt even more if I've forgiven him. ... You avoid disagreements. You describe yourself as traumatised.

It may not be as overt as in the past but I think you're still being emotionally bullied. It's no coincidence that this 'unusually long period of contact' happens just as he's getting a new job and a new wife.... he's deliberately unsettling you, twisting the knife by saying 'look what a success I am', I'm quite sure of it. And I think that's preventing you from moving on ... to new relationships, to forgiveness if that's what you want, to living a life where you are truly independent.

So my suggestion is to fully cut this malign influence out of your life. Maintain contact for bare essentials only, don't have him in your home, don't engage in cosy chats or show any interest in his life, his new relationships, job or anything else. If there is a disagreement, put it in the hands of lawyer.

"The last time we argued he said things about dd that made me worry he was going to treat her the way he treat me, but that was a couple years ago and things have mostly been okay since"

'Mostly OK'... means that he keeps displaying unacceptable behaviour doesn't it? Originally, when he trapped you as a child, you felt you had to keep him sweet so that you weren't attacked. Now you feel you have to do the same thing to stop him attacking your DD. That's manipulation on his part. 'Mostly OK' probably means you're compromising, making allowances, and that is a recipe for stress, frustration and low self-esteem. If you stop being nice to this man and, as a result, think your DD is in danger either emotionally or physically then the proper course of action is court, police and so on.

Whatever the godly types say, I don't think forgiveness is appropriate here. Assertiveness and properly parting company will serve you and your DD better.

I would strongly recommend counselling. Because the issue isn't really about forgiving him but about your ability to move on and have other relationships.

You kind of need to go through a grieving process to get to the point of forgiveness. (NB not the same as acceptance or justification) You haven't done that yet.

I also recommend you read Why Does He Do That? by Lundy Bancroft. A lot of people recommend the Freedom Programme also for DV survivors, don't know much about it but seems worth mentioning.

I agree, 'burying' it is not going to work for you long term.

You need to understand who you are, why this man targeted you, and how far you have come SINCE.

In the end you won't care about what he did/didn't do. It's not forgiveness (unwarranted) it's not forgetting (impossible) it's getting yourself to a place where only you matters, and he doesn't.

Only counselling can do that. Do the Freedom Programme too. It's free, and very good.

Until you treat this, it won't go away.

i agree with jess definately... read that book, its a real eye opener n puts alot into perspective xx

Maybe I am misunderstanding the definition of forgiveness, but I don't think that you do have to forgive him for what he did to you, because it was terrible. What you do have to do is accept that it happened, that it's over now and move on in your own life. You don't have to have a personal relationship with him, only a businesslike one for the purpose of arranging things for DD. As she's getting older she could even take more responsibility for arrangements herself, with you only stepping in if something happens that she doesn't feel she can handle.

Maybe one day in the future at her wedding or something you might have to come into contact with him for longer but again you don't have to greet him like an old friend, it's ok to just be cold and polite towards him.

You can hold rigid boundaries - as you have to with an abuser - but you can privately 'forgive'. In fact, I'd recommend 'forgiving' as, without it, you hold the abuser to your chest - and you have enough to deal with without that. As the saying goes, unforgiveness hurts you, not the culprit.

But then, forgiveness is a h-u-g-e issue. imo forgiveness doesn't (necessarily) mean being outwardly friendly and 'letting bygones be bygones'. It depends on the crime - forgiveness doesn't mean sanctioning someone's behaviour. Forgiveness to me means letting the abuser go - but what is letting go? I like to think of it as cutting a rope and letting the offender/abuser float off down the river without you. But that takes work imo. You can't deny, have to process, the trauma and rage - which, imo, is an ongoing process. Using 'forgiveness' as a denial tool when trauma is still bubbling away is dangerous: you can cut them loose but don't deny what they did and the awful effect it has had on you.

I fear I am not making much sense (but trying to!). He's not your pal - or your responsibility, as it happens. You don't have to be friends, you don't have to care about him (why should you??!). I would also be very wary of my child spending time with someone who clearly abuses anyone and everyone - eg his own child is not off limits, which is par for the course for an abuser ime.

and of course you're not happy he's sailing on with life without any discernible payback for what he's done. Give yourself a break! We all have an inbuilt justice monitor.

masquerade I know how you feel about not wanting him to have changed because it invalidates what happened to you. It really bothers me when other people say how 'normal' XH is and how they can't imagine him saying or doing the things I tell them about.

Can't add to the good advice about forgiving/forgetting, but I think you are already half way there by congratulating him and 'pretending' to be pleased for him - fake it til you make it sort of thing! Perhaps you can try to be pleased for him because of the implications on your DD (more money for him to spend on her, him feeling better about himself and so happier to be around etc) Make sure that she knows you are looking out for her and that she can talk to you about anything that happens when she's not with you. That's all you can do for now.

I don't think you can ever forget!

Even if it was possible, I don't think it's healthy to 'forget'. Trauma wipes out a lot of it but it's all still there...

I'm really not sure, too, about bigging up an abuser father. It was difficult for me to achieve it but I was positive about positive things about my kids' dad but I didn't fake it, painting a lala picture. He was a gruesome nightmare and I wasn't going to pretend otherwise. I didn't launch into details of his real nature but I didn't pretend either.

Thankyou so much for your replies. It means a lot that people just believe me, without question, when I say the relationship was abusive.

springytats
But then, forgiveness is a h-u-g-e issue. imo forgiveness doesn't (necessarily) mean being outwardly friendly and 'letting bygones be bygones'. It depends on the crime - forgiveness doesn't mean sanctioning someone's behaviour. Forgiveness to me means letting the abuser go - but what is letting go? I like to think of it as cutting a rope and letting the offender/abuser float off down the river without you. But that takes work imo. You can't deny, have to process, the trauma and rage - which, imo, is an ongoing process. Using 'forgiveness' as a denial tool when trauma is still bubbling away is dangerous: you can cut them loose but don't deny what they did and the awful effect it has had on you.

That makes a lot of sense. Yes what I want is to let go, and yes that is very very hard because I don't know how to let go without letting down my barriers and making myself more vulnerable.

I think those who mentioned counselling are probably right, I don't talk about it really. I have had a couple of counselling sessions after a traumatic event at work and was amazed at how much better I felt for just getting my feelings out and being told its okay. I will have a look at that book.

Anyway, I've had a sharp reminder that he is that person this weekend. Dd came home upset because he had called her a 'nasty little shit', accused her of lying and told her she was miserable. What had she done to provoke this reaction? Felt unwell at a child's party (a member of his gf's family). She says he seemed a bit annoyed at her when they were there, but this happened on the way home. His gf wasn't at the party but her mum was and was kind to dd. Dd says he's never mean to her when gf is there, and she also said "and then when we got to Nana's (my mum's, she was being dropped off there) he acted like nothing had happened".

I am so angry at him for being so horrible to my lovely little girl. I don't know what to do. I asked dd what she wants to do, if she wanted me to speak to him about it. She's unsure. I told her she didn't have to see him if she didn't want to, but she does want to, because he is her dad, she just wants him to be nice to her. She suggested she might like to see him just once a month. She also mentioned maybe we should ring "child abuse" and see if they will stop him.

Its so hard though, if he was a normal person I wouldn't be encouraging dd to just decide she doesn't want to see him, because I wouldn't want to risk her to becoming a teenager who moves between her parents when she isn't getting her own way all of the time. In an ideal world we would present a united front. But that is never going to happen is it. When we last had an issue like this I decided I would never try and excuse his behaviour to dd (e.g I won't ask her if maybe she was unreasonable, I won't suggest maybe he was tired and grumpy etc) because I don't want her to think I condone it.

I agree with Cog (as usual). I have begun to feel less acrimonious towards my x, and part of the reason for that is that he is complying with court order(s) now. Not out of respect for me but respect for the law I guess. So, it's not a cordial relationship because there is no relationship to speak of. I sent him an email recently and I worked hard on communicating nothing but the message itself. But at the same time, not making it needlessly cold. I hope that that makes sense. I feel nothing for him now. Somebody asked me recently if I thought he would get married, have more children. I shrugged. I guess I was the one who put him at a distance from me, so now he has become like some total randomer. Almost.

I agree with springytats, I may no longer be chewed up over his abuse of me, but he wouldn't know that really because I haven't relaxed my boundaries.

If your DD does want to phone somewhere like Childline about this, then I wouldn't stop her. It will get recorded somewhere and they may be able to give her some good advice. It will also be somewhere she maybe able to phone if he is "nasty" when she is at his.