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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

I'm starting to feel like this is a deal breaker

43 replies

AudreyJunior · 09/04/2013 10:11

DH and I have been together for 13 years and married for 10. We have two small DCs.

DH has always had a temper. When driving he occasionally loses his temper with others on the road and when that happens, he drives very aggressively and dangerously. It frightens me, and he knows it, but he tells me I've no right to comment because I can't drive myself.

He gets inappropriately angry around DC2 for some reason. The other day DC1 told me 'Mommy, I love you because you don't shout at DC2' which fairly stopped me in my tracks. DC1 is nearly 3, DC2 is 14 months.

We've had a month or so of bad sleep with DC2, due to all four canines erupting at once. Last night at 11pm DH went downstairs to get him a bottle of milk (he'd been too tired to drink his bedtime bottle so was hardly being unreasonable to want one!) and I heard a lot of noise. This morning I found that he had punched through the kitchen lightswitch (it's a button rather than a switch) and it was completely shattered.

We've discussed his temper many, many times. Last time he agreed to arrange anger management counselling for himself but he never did. He just doesn't think he has a problem at all. But I'm starting to think that I can't let him stay. He's great with the kids otherwise and they're mad about him but I don't want them growing up afraid of his temper. My mother had a terrible temper and it was horrible to live with.

Am I overreacting? It's hard to trust myself when he thinks what he's doing is fine.

OP posts:
KatyTheCleaningLady · 09/04/2013 10:23

You are not over reacting.

He must recognise the problem and seek help, and you have to be willing to force an ultimatum.

Dahlen · 09/04/2013 10:29

Does he lose his temper in front of anyone else, or is it just you and the DC?

AnyFucker · 09/04/2013 10:33

You have been under reacting so far, love

Yes, it's a dealbreaker

Please protect your children now, prioritising your relationship with a violent man is not the answer

Ask him to leave

Original poster
AudreyJunior · 09/04/2013 10:34

Me, the kids, other drivers. Never in work, with friends or in front of my family and almost never in front of his family; in fact, once when his siblings heard him shout, they were shocked as they didn't realise he had a temper at all.

OP posts:
AttilaTheMeerkat · 09/04/2013 10:39

No you are not overreacting at all; far from it. There is probably more you have not written of either.

These men never enter AM counselling; he is probably saving all his bile for you and your children. They never think that they thesmelves have a problem. Also punching domestic items is an indicator too of domestic abuse. Does he ever break "his" things?. Probably not.

There are an awful lot of red flags attached to your H and perhaps your own childhood experiences at the hands of your own angry mother led you to being with such a person now; after all we learn about relationships first and foremost from our parents. You were probably taught to keep quiet and act as peacemaker.

Listen to what your eldest is telling you; children are so very perceptive here. Is this really the environment you want them to be growing up with?. An angry man like your H is not at all great with the children and he is being vile to your youngest. Am sure too that they are both afraid of him.

What do you want to teach your children about relationships here?. Both of you are currently imparting damaging lessons to them.

Would suggest you call Womens Aid today and talk this through with them.

BirdStrike · 09/04/2013 10:40

Then it's not an anger management problem then is it? If it was he would also lose his temper at work and in front of friends and family. He chooses to be violent with you, your DCs and other drivers.

Please get out of the relationship before he starts hitting you or your DC instead of light switches.

Dahlen · 09/04/2013 10:41

I was worried you were going to say that. He does not have an anger management problem. If he did, he would lose his temper indiscriminately with everyone. He loses it in front of you and the DC because he wants to and he knows you can't/won't fight back.

Car drivers are not going to respond to him either. Road rage incidents are actually very rare, as he knows. However, driving aggressively is one of the hallmarks of an abusive personality.

This is about feeling entitled to achieve his own way with threats. It's not about anger at all. Anger is simply the medium he uses to get what he wants.

The fact that your child has said "I love you because you don't shout at DC2" is obviously a major wake-up call for you - and it should be.

I know this is going to require some major rethinking on your part, which is going to be difficult. Googling abusive relationships would be a good place to start. Don't assume that because your H hasn't descended into violence aimed at you he isn't abusive. He is. Sad

Good luck.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 09/04/2013 10:42

What do you get out of this relationship now?.

DonkeysDontRideBicycles · 09/04/2013 10:42

Tell him you would like him to address flying off the handle before he punches a person not a light switch. It could be seen as intimidation, threatened aggression. You wouldn't risk an unstable dog around your DCs would you?

Was this irritation with DC2? With you for not getting the milk? Was he just tired and cross? Sounds a disproportionate response. Work stress, broken nights, small DCs, we all have crosses to bear but don't erupt. How is his blood pressure? Does he take steroids?

Even if he thinks he has it under control what example does he set your DCs, get angry, blow up, lash out?

Time to get serious.

Original poster
AudreyJunior · 09/04/2013 11:15

I think he doesn't get angry with anyone else because they don't push him. In work, he's mostly left to his own devices as long as the work gets done, which it does. Our families don't ask anything of him except that he turn up at occasions and be reasonably sociable, which he's fine with. And friends aren't likely to pick fights with him.

I impose more on him. I try and change his behaviour; get him to tidy up after himself, or do things faster to get out of the house on time, or whatever. He most emphatically doesn't want to do things any other way or at any other speed but his own, so he gets angry (I'm not the only one with an angry parent; he got this trait from his dad).

I assume it's the same with the kids, that he doesn't like that they won't do things his way. DC2 is a livewire and about as cooperative as any other small toddler. I don't know why DC1 didn't have quite the same effect on him; possibly it's because she's a girl and DC2 is a boy, I don't know.

Attila, he's never broken anything in anger before that I know of so I don't know if he'd break his own stuff. As for what I'm getting out of the relationship, bugger all, to be honest. He has absolutely no understanding of the concept of emotional support. When I had PND I woke him one night to tell him that I'd been mentally listing all the pills in the house and I was worried about my mental state and he didn't say anything - he said later he didn't know what to say so just went to sleep.

OP posts:
TakingTheStairs · 09/04/2013 11:19

Audrey Listen to yourself
I impose more on him. I try and change his behaviour; get him to tidy up after himself, or do things faster to get out of the house on time, or whatever.

You're making excuses for him. Don't. He is a bad tempered bully and a nasty person.

DonkeysDontRideBicycles · 09/04/2013 11:28

OP if your DD has noticed H behaving differently with DS and she is not yet 3 this is not you overreacting.

Dahlen · 09/04/2013 11:30

What you say is imposing more on him is actually stuff that you shouldn't have to impose at all.

I bet you get accused of nagging as well. Hmm No woman would have to nag if her man carried out what is usually a perfectly reasonable request (such as please don't leave your socks on the bedroom floor) in the first place. It's not nagging; it's ignorance. Turn it around.

Being in a relationship is supposed to be beneficial to both parties and if you love someone you want to make their life easy. You don''t expect someone you love and respect to have to pick up after you, nor as a loving parent do you expect children to change their basic personality or act as perfectly behaved adults. And all this should be freely done, not done under sufferance or reacted to with displays of anger.

I don't want to get into a discussion about PND. It's a very real illness and in many cases can be mind-crushingly awful. However, in cases the mother is not suffering from hormonal-based PND at all - she's suffering a normal emotional reaction to being overwhelmed by responsibility and having a shit partner who not only fails to help but actually worsens the problem with their own behaviour. Was there an element of that in your situation do you think?

Dahlen · 09/04/2013 11:31

In some cases that should read - missing word there, sorry.

TKKW · 09/04/2013 11:37

Hi Audrey, i had to reply to this one.

omg, this sounds very unhealthy for you and your two children. It will build and build until he does put a fist through a wall in front of you or your children or he chucks something around a room and someone is caught in the "crossfire".

who know when that time will come but in the meanwhile, you'll witness more of the same. i mean its not normal to routinely go ape sh*t because you can't find your keys, glasses or wallet in the morning or whatever. its very weird to smash the light switch in. i mean, who does that?

You must not be able to relax, poor thing. it will cause more harm to your children's emotional wellbeing and erode your confidence if you continue.

i dont have any practical advice - could you talk to him and tell him that its really damaging his relationships with you.

i am a big fan of counselling although i know the private route is expensive.

i think you need to tell him it cant go on like this and set a time limit.

hope things are ok.

AnyFucker · 09/04/2013 11:38

Imposing on him ?

You have an expectation that he contributes to what should be a partnership. You would be one hell of a Stepford Wife if you didn't. Is that what he wants ?

Buy him a blow up doll, stick it in the corner of the room with tape over it's mouth, a broom in it's hand and leave him

TKKW · 09/04/2013 11:40

sorry, just saw he refused to attend a counsellor. wow, he likes to get gis own way by intimidating then, doesn't he?

yes, you need to think about calling time unless there is an improvement.

hopkinette · 09/04/2013 11:43

The fact that he hasn't voluntarily removed himself from your children's environment as a matter of urgency suggests to me that he doesn't think he has a problem. He thinks he's justified in raging and shouting. As long as he thinks he's in the right, he won't stop. I think you need to get rid of him.

mummytime · 09/04/2013 11:46

Please phone Women's aid.

Do not go to counselling with him, it will be harmful for you even if he agrees to go. Counselling without him, could be very helpful though.

I can't believe there is a job where people don't make demands on an employee, and do not impose deadlines. So don't fool yourself, he is just being angry with you because he chooses to be. DO NOT blame yourself.

dingit · 09/04/2013 11:53

i will probably get shouted down, but if he has never laid a finger on you or the dc, you are perfectly safe. Would you rather he punched the light switch or you. My dh undergoes a personality transformation in the car, and is vile tempered as soon as he is behind the wheel. He has also kicked objects in temper, usually when diying, and wrecked his golf trolley after playing badly. We have been married 20 years, and i am irritated by his temper, not frightened by him.

StitchAteMySleep · 09/04/2013 11:55

You need to consider leaving and soon.

His dad was abusive to him (when you have a vile temper and you take it out on your kids that is what it is).

He is now repeating history and being abusive to your baby. Shouting at your 14 month old for being a toddler is abusive.

Your 3 year old is aware and is scared enough to talk to you about it.

It will escalate as your ds gets older.

He is refusing to get help which means he wants to carry on abusing his family (because he manages to control himself for others).

You need to protect your children from him, remove them from the situation.

Phone Women's Aid 0808 2000 247.

I have 2 kids the same age as yours, if my DH ever behaved like that he would be out on his ear.

TKKW · 09/04/2013 12:01

dingit, yes, your view is one that will be shared by very few people. do you have kids?

MushroomSoup · 09/04/2013 12:02

Dingit she might be perfectly safe but this is no way for the OP and her DCs to live.

TKKW · 09/04/2013 12:02

actually, shouldn't have asked that dingit.

dingit · 09/04/2013 12:04

yep. i agree though, if she is frightened by him, they need to sort it out. It worries me how many people on mn tell the op to ask their dh to leave. Surely that is a last resort.