Why do I just attract toxic friends?

[HerLordship]

How do I go about finding decent ones?

I've recently bought a book about different types of toxic friend, and I can honestly say that every friend I have fits well into one or more of the categories.

My friends do things such as:

Always being too busy to see me despite having plenty of time to see other people. Cancelling plans in favour of other people. Telling me they are ill and then going out with other people

Expect unlimited support from me when they're having a bad time, expecting me to be outraged if anyone crosses them and to 'side' with them. Not giving me any support when I need it, and 'siding' with anyone except me. Recent example is a friend who has been very needy recently and who I've offered a lot of support to. The other day she was round here after school with her DD and my DD said a girl who isn't very pleasant in their class had hit her that day. Friend just sat there and said nothing, yet it if was her daughter that had been hit she would expect me to be outraged.

Behaving like a frenemy; nasty comments, cutting comments, little digs. Talking to me sometimes and not at others.

I probably have 10 friends and like I said they all seem to fit into categories in my book about toxic friends. I can't think that any bring anything to my life, they all just seem to use me.

[colditz]

YourLordship, you do seem to attracted more than yr fair share of tossers. Please please stop trying to be friendly with people who don't reciprocate. I ditched my drama llama friend, I downgraded her to an acquaintance, you can too!

[colditz]

And there is a special place in hell for girls whoso were spiteful at school ... But you have to wonder what her home life was like, to have learned behavior like that.

[LadyBigtoes]

Lordship I have to say you are doing incredibly well on this thread to take all these comments on board, it can't be easy to hear them (I hope that doesn't sound patronising). You sound like you really want to change this now and so I'm sure you can.

[springyhop]

sorry, but imo you can ill afford to be feeling sorry for other people (eg your sadist school friend) right now as you are carrying a great deal of pain yourself. The friends you are attracting are a mirror of how damaged you are. Between you and me, there's nothing wrong with being damaged - you hardly asked for it, did you? It happened to you, you were a child with no possible means to protect yourself. but you can learn to protect yourself now but, because of your history, it won't come naturally and you will have to learn it. re a professional, a therapist, for the long haul (it's worth it btw).

[2rebecca]

I was bullied and went through a difficult patch at school. I think I was more swotty and geeky than other girls and tried to hard to fit in and be like them rather than sorting out where i wanted to go in life and to do what I enjoyed doing. University helped where i met women who were more like me. I also learned that trying to please people doesn't work. The best way to make friends is to do stuff you enjoy doing and have plenty of hobbies and interests and meet like minded people through those. You tried with the netball, but maybe gave up rather than standing up for yourself with the team captain or trying a different team. You do need to stand up for yourself with bullies and see their unpleasant behaviour as their problem not yours, also as a new member maybe she was shouting because you were doing stuff wrong and you were oversensitive to criticism.
I also learned that most people especially girls are quite insecure at school and feel other people have more friends than them. Early teenage girls are quite nasty and I agree that moving on and not dwelling on this is important now. I also think it's better to have no friends rather than nasty ones and that as people get older we often don't have friends in the same way we had them as children as work and family take up so much of our time.
I think seeing a psychologist may help if you have difficulty being confident and difficulty stopping wanting everyone to like you. It sounds as though you need to start valuing yourself more. I think you also need to accept that most people are the centre of their own universes and very few people put their friends first in their life when they are adults.
I'd stop looking for friends for the sake of having friends. I'd rather be alone getting on with something I enjoy than listen to a self obsessed person moan just so I can say i have a friend. It sounds as though you have a supportive husband, stop looking for friends for a while and do stuff to build up your confidence.
Cat's Eye by margaret Atwood describes a friendship with a girl much like your "friend" at school. This may help. In general people who treat other people badly don't end up with a happy life and are best avoided.
I think your previous experiences are colouring your expectation now and making you over sensitive and attracting bullies

[HerLordship]

Thanks everyone for the comments and wise words!

I have a FB friend who pops up on chat to me each day and I usually lamely spend ages interacting with her whilst she talks about herself. She says something about herself and I'll acknowledge what she says, talk about it for a bit, and as soon as I mention anything about myself she ignores what I've said and carries on talking about herself. Anyway, this morning she did just that again, I chatted for 5 minutes, realised the conversation was going the same way as per normal, so after another time of her ignoring something about me, I just went offline and didn't reply any further. She often does this herself, if the conversation gets round to me in any way, so if she says anything I shall say that something cropped up and I didn't think she'd mind as she herself does it.

I do like this friend, but I'm not prepared to listen to her talking 'at' me anymore, and I'm going to start valuing my time more and 'giving' less to her!

[colditz]

Well done! I think you might feel better about yourself, yes? Because she tried to use you, but you didn't let her, you logged off because your time is precious and you deserve it more than she does!

[HerLordship]

Thanks :)

I'm just a bit anxious I'm going to alienate people by not doing as they say, but I guess I need to make these changes

[colditz]

I NEVER do what people say, never ever. Nobody hates me for it. I have a nice friend who occasionally tries to nag me into doing something with her that I would hate, such as going to an exercise class, and I say, really pretentiously, "But DAHHHHHHLING that sounds hideous, I'd much rather throw myself off a bridge. Is that what you want? Is it? Go with Sarah, she likes getting hot and bad tempered, I don't. Yuk yuk yuk. No."

And guess what? She has to live with it, because I am not fucking going to the gym with her. She either lives with it or she can lie on the floor and have a full scale tantrum, but I don't do things I don't want to do unless I am getting paid. The end.

[springyhop]

oh absolutely! You've got it in one colditz

well done HerLordship! Jolly well BRAVO

[springyhop]

the bottom line is....

FUCK EM

If they can't stick with you then forget it. they can go fuck off to the far side of fuck and then fuck off some more

I'm not being as aggressive as I sound (just using a well-worn MN phrase!) but this is the bottom line. If people can't even hang around to talk about what's important to you ffs then FUCK EM. They're not worth the breath.

You, meanwhile, are worth a great deal. The sooner you get that, the sooner people will start respecting you and valuing your friendship - and the takers will fuck off to the far side etc. because there's nothing in it for them. BRAVO, I say - it's good to get rid of them as soon as. Good to know from the off what they're about - ie me, me, me

[BettyBlueBlue]

So much of what you say resonates with my experience of friends. I realised only recently that the three friends whom I always considered my "secure base" in life, were not really friends at all. Just people I knew for a long time.

It was a hard realisation and I'm still grieving their loss, but I learned my lesson. The problem is that I should have never considered them "good" friends, just old friends.

We tend to idealise friendship so much, always expecting to have a high level of fulfillment from them. I maybe we did for a while, but when things start to rot in the bond, it's best to let go.

I, like you, also feel that my friends never fully support me or endorse me. And when there's a group, you bet I'll be the one who's left out or criticised. I think a lot of it has to do with being an independent thinker, being your own person, never following the crowd blindly.

My heart goes out to you when I read your story of bullying in secondary school, the toddler group mums and the netball team.

I've had a bad experience of bullying as an adult at work, and even though I managed to move on from it, the psychological scar took very long to heal.

One excellent book I'm reading at the moment for women to learn to set boundaries and avoid the psychological predators in life is "Women who run with the Wolves" by Clarissa Pinkola Estes.

I'd be interested to know which book you read on toxic friends. I'd like to read it too.

[HerLordship]

Thanks again everyone! Feeling much more positive today, even though FB chatty woman seems to be sulking. Oh well, she can get on with it as I'm not going to be her listening service again.

BettyBlueBlue, so sorry to hear you've had similar friends experiences. I'm the same in groups, the person that's left out or criticised, and I think you've raised a good point in that it's probably to do with us being our own person. I'm out at the moment and posting via my phone but I'll post later with the title and auther of the book I've been reading.

[BettyBlueBlue]

Good luck, HerLorship! You sound like a nice, decent person. Don't lose faith in in those qualities you have or yourself as a human being. Lose faith in everybody else if you must, but never in you.

One other thing your OP got me thinking about, when I was very young, I was shy, very shy, not confident in any way. I was plain looking and didn't say much. I wasn't much of a threat to anybody. So everybody seemed to like more so to speak.

As I grew older, I started to look after my appearance, went to university, worked and studied abroad. Married, had two kids.

I think a lot of people don't like you to change or challenge their views of you. I know for sure now that I've done quite a lot with my life considering where I started, and lot of people might compete or perceive me as more of a threat to their egos because of that. Women friends, though really lovely, can be competitive and insecure at times. You need to watch out for those, and keep them at bay where possible.

All best :)

[HerLordship]

I often think jealousy has a lot to answer for in female friendships, Betty. It sounds like the people that don't like you are jealous of you. You sound like a lovely person whose done lots of good things in life. Some people can't handle others having or doing things they haven't got or done.

I think the ex friend that I tried to phase out is definitely jealous of me. Lots of nasty little digs and snidey comments. I think most frenemy-types are just jealous.

[Pancakeflipper]

You have to like yourself. Recognise your strongpoints and embrace them. Recognise the weak points and accept them and try to improve them. Then you will start to be the real you. The fake people pleaser (who in all honesty is painful to be around and not much fun) will disappear. You'll start slowly by making friendships on a 1:1 basis and enjoy them because they are real equal friendships.

Inner happiness/contentment radiates outwards. Those people are attractive to others. They seem fun, caring and not fake.

I have obviously eaten several self help books. Take small steps but become the real you.

[HerLordship]

Thank you pancake! Great advice! Hope you don't mind me asking, but which books have you read?

[Pancakeflipper]

None - I worked it our myself. But lots say that type of thing.
I firmly believe you need to like yourself first. It still can feel lonely and still hurt but it gets better and better. And then you handle the nastiness better. It doesn't sting as much.

I was bullied for 2 yrs in secondary school. When I stopped wanting the bullies to like me, for me to be their friend, I went off and was lonely for months then 2 other girls found me, who had kind hearts and couldn't give a stuff what others thought about then. They were more busy with having fun and couldn't be fake if they tried.

I think I got to age when I thought "well this is me. I like this bit. Others like this bit. I don't like this bit so going to sort that but I will be truer to myself". My good points outweigh my crap points.

Don't worry about them, they aren't worth it, sort yourself our then the rest will fall into step. And any let downs - you will deal with more positively.

[BettyBlueBlue]

I think jealousy has a lot to do with friends turning into frenemies, Herlordship.

I always found it really hard to believe that anyone could be jealous of me, since, as I said, I came into this world as the typical "ugly duckling". But now I realise jealousy might have been a element in the equation.

I think it's important to develop a strong sense of self to keep jealousy at bay. If you come across as a bit insecure, unconfident, that's when the predators pounce at you.

As Pancake said, you become stronger by recognising your strong points, accepting your weak ones. And also, try to learn a lesson from every single experience in life to become stronger.

[HerLordship]

I think the best tack is to just not care about whether people like me or not isn't it? I find I often care loads about whether people like me or not, then it has the opposite effect! A friend and I had words about a week ago, well not words really I just didn't agree with her, basically she wanted me to be there for her and hang on her every word but wasn't prepared to return the favour. Now I feel like she's ignoring me. I've been making an effort with her but she's being quite cold and off, so think I shall just stop bothering and let her come to me if she wants to be friends.

[Pancakeflipper]

Stop focusing on others. Honestly people are more wrapped up in themselves than looking at and judging you.
Concentrate on you. Don't sink under what you think your crap points are, balance them with good points.

[2rebecca]

I think if you are assertive then people who just want a sounding board not a friendship will go elsewhere. That's OK, they were never friends anyway. As long as you're not being needlessly abrupt when people are being nice then I wouldn't worry. If people are cool let them be, they may just be busy with other stuff, most of us have busy lives.

[HerLordship]

Good points, pancake and rebecca!

[Grinkly]

I had an alcoholic parent and have always been desperate to be liked and respected (presumably because my parent certainly wasn't and I didn't want to be like them).

Now, older and wiser, and with an understanding why being liked was so important to me, I am no longer so desperate and am much more at ease with people.

[brettgirl2]

People probably see me as confident, when I first meet someone I start by assessing whether or not I like THEM rather than their opinion of me. If they don't like me that's fine their decision, and there are plenty more people out there. OP your friends are a nasty load of bitches and as for the ones who sat looking uncomfortable while that vile drunk woman mouthed off omg!!!

Please believe you deserve to meet some nice people.