Am I making too much of this?

[Rocklover]

Hi, I'm new here (although have been lurking for a while) and really need some advice about my marriage as it is really getting me down. Have been with DH for 8 yrs, married for nearly 4, DD came along in Jan 2005. Since her birth DH has been a different person, he found it very hard to adjust and was very angry towards me for quite a long time (not physically though). During that time I became very low and have virtually no self confidence left, recently I left him for 3 weeks and we are now making a go of it.

Things were really great for the first month, now it all seems to be going down hill again. Although he is not shouting at me anymore he is constantly moody and plays on his pc games constantly, he doesn't usually shower more than twice a week and recently didn't clean his teeth for three days!! Sometimes he can be really lovey dovey and other times he doesn't even notice me (like yesterday, is on school hols and spent from 7am to 5pm on the pc).

He complains that we don't go out enough (neither of us drive at the moment), but then makes no effort to do so as he can't be bothered to get up. We'd planned a morning out in town with lunch somewhere nice, but he couldn't be arsed to get up so I took DD on my own. He has gone into town today and wouldn't take DD, it would be good for her to go out, but he hardly ever takes her out on his own (or with me for that matter).
Compared to most of the problems I have read about this seems small fry, but am really fed up! I have just been diagnosed with severe sciatica and am not allowed to pick up DD or do heavy housework and DH only helps if I ask and just tells me to leave the house a mess!!! I just feel I am fighting a losing battle every time I try to talk to him about the way I feel, it either starts an argument, he is noce to me for a few days, or he says I am paranoid/depressed etc.
I have previously thought that he maybe depressed and have asked him to go to the Drs, but he won't, however he is happy at work, it just seems to be at home he is unhappy/bored. I just don't think I love him anymore and it really scares me, he is not keen on having any more kids and I really do want more (although I know he would to keep me happy so to speak!). I just want a man who feels the same joy I do at having a gorgeous little girl, and would consider putting me first sometimes (have to ask for a lie-in at a w/end, as I am a SAHM and he works FT he says he is too tired most of the time, so I have to get up) is that so much to ask? I asked him yesterday what had been the best time of his life so far and he said his three yrs at uni, and my answer was every day that I have known DD! I am terrified we don't have a future.
Thank you so much for reading, sorry if it doesn't make much sense, really need some honest opinions. :(

I think he could be depressed. Some of this could have been my DH. The not caring about appearance and computer games. He's not bad now but he did find the pressure of having to provide for all of us just too much and started to withdraw. I think PC games do a lot of damage cause it's no treal and the players forget how to function in the real world. Wgat helped for my DH was getting active, he started walking home from work and goes to Badminton.
He is now much more positive but I think your DH will have to recognise this first. HTH

I think you need to sit him down and tell him what you are feeling.
Do you think you would benefit from going to relate.
You said you left him for 3 weeks,what brought you back together. Does he think that now your back he can slip back into his old ways.
I also think he needs to grow up and take on the responablity of being a husband and father.

We have had many serious heart to hearts, none of them seem to have made any difference. Things are slightly improved now that he no longer screams at me (this would happen at least 2/3 times a week before), but, things are still not right. We have discussed that we cannot ttc for baby 2 until at least Dec 2007 for financial reason etc, however, if I dare to let slip that I have been thinking about babies he hates it! He told me the other day that I was obssessive and if I carry on that way it is more likely that we will not have another child.

He is always saying he is bored/tired/ill whatever, but never can tell me what the problem is. Refuses point blank to ever go to the Drs, even for normal stuff. I just don't see another big "talk" (he hates it when I ask for this anyway) making any difference. Do you think that men in general have as much interest in their children as women? I know my Dad did. DH never notices in the morning if DD is awake, but I am so tuned into her that I don't even have to hear her to know she is awake.

Sounds like he's depressed to me. Take him to the doc for a chat.

If you made it clear that your relationship is at risk, would he not be a bit more enthusiastic about seeing his gp ?

Well it really hit the fan last night, I tried to talk to him gently about the problem, but again he started going on about not wanting to talk about stuff and to leave him alone. Me being me tried to push it a bit and he ended up storming off. This morning I was so upset and fed up I decided we had to talk and have it out, firstly he "forgot" to make an appt with the Drs which made me mad anyway. The crux of the problem is that we are moving into my Mum and Dad's house as our house is a bit expensive for us and he says he now doesn't want to go which is why he feels low. He basically said that it is becuase of me, as a SAHM, we didn't have enough money and I should have got a job.
This all sounds perfectly reasonable except I went to uni last yr with him strongly encouraging me, and then at Christmas he suggested we move to Lincoln with my parents to get a massive house. So he told me to leave uni to do this, which I agreed to, then he promptly changed his mind! The main reason I didn't get a FT job was because he said that with childcare it would hardly be worth the effort, if he had been honest and said we couldn't survive, then I'd have done it no questions asked.
To cut a massively long story short, I lost it this morning as he said he was so stressed at the moment he couldn'tcope with thinking about our relationship. I feel really disgusted with myself as all my frustration came out and Iscreamed and slammed doors etc. I demanded that he tell me how the hell we would ever sort things out if he won't talk to me? I said he was scared to say what he really wanted, so he told me to get out, call my parents to come get me (I can't drive) and get out. He is now in bed asleep and I am waiting to be picked up, I feel like everything is my fault and I will hate myself for the rest of my life.

you never know, thismight be the best thing for a while. You need to get away from each other and just both calm down. THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT. DO NOT BLAME YOURSELF.

You sound tome as if you have bent over backwards to accomadate him, without thinking of what you need and want. Perhaps now is the time to do that.

this sounds alot like my dp, although not in respect to the way he is with dd, luckily he does enjoy spending time with her and does take her out with him, but in every other way you could be describing my dp. sometimes i find it incredibly difficult to cope with his general attitude to life and to us. i know he loves me but sometimes i don't feel it, and i find it almost impossible to feel affection for him.

i tend to follow the marge simpson school of constant nagging in the way i deal with him, he's a man who never really grew up so if he chooses to act like a child i treat him like one, 'get out of bed', 'go have a shower', 'bring out the bin', 'we need to do the shopping now'etc, etc. it's exhausting and i sometimes have to pick my battles to avoid WW3 but for the most part it works, partly because he knows damn well what i'm doing, we've joked about it on occasion. i'm not saying i wouldn't prefer him to bound out of bed in the mornings and show me a bit more consieration but we muddle through and it seems to work.

it helps that í've made it clear that i will leave unless he makes some effort, he knows i'm not afraid of taking dd and going if things reach that point and he does his best not to let things get that bad

HTH

oops, so sorry, posted before i read the whole thread rocklover

so sorry you can't work things out but if he is so completely incapable of sorting things out with you maybe it will be less painful in the long run just to end it.

Thanks for your replies, I just can't seem to get it out of my head that this is all my fault. I feel so awful that it has come to this! TBH we have had really major probs since DD was born and for a long time now I have felt like a single parent, but, he always has a way of confsing me and making everything seem like my fault. I know that both of us need to take responsibility for the problems we are having, but if we can't talk properly how can that happen?
I am so ashamed that I screamed at him, it was like something broke inside me and I couldn't hold all the anger and hurt back anymore. I feel like I finally sunk to his level. But I guess he does have a right to blame me because I didn't get a FT job, now I will have to and even that will be difficult as my CV was wiped off the computer when it went in for repairs, so I have to start over!!

Why should he blame you for not getting a FT job? Did you know there were financial problems and wilfully say "sorry mate, I'm staying at home?" That certainly doesn't seem to be the case from your posts, which read more like:

• he encouraged you to go to uni
• then he decided you needed to live in a big house so told you to leave uni and move
• then he announced you couldn't afford to live in a big house and would have to move in with your parents
• therefore, it's your fault.

Eh?!

At the very least, this is not a person I would want in control of the family finances, has he ever clearly explained what the financial problems are? Could he be hiding debts? Could he feel bad for failing to provide for you all as a husband/father should? (I mean he may feel that was his job, you know what I mean).

Anyway you look at it, this is not your fault, and definitely not your fault alone.

I don't think it is all your fault, you snapped because you have been pushed to the limit. If someone isn't willing to communicate with you then it makes it hard to make a relationship work.
Do you think that he may feel that he has failed by you moving in with your parents,maybe he thinks they will judge him for this.
Maybe some space is what you need. At some point he will have to tell you how he feels it is not fair to keep someone second guessing what the other person wants.
Good luck and keep posting.

I think a lot of men feel they have to play second fiddle to their kids when they have them and some really don't like it. WHen you said the best times you had were every day you have known DD he could have felt upset cos you didn't say when you first met him.

I have known women that so fall in love with their baby that they kinda fall out of love with their hubby. Is this you? Men find it so difficult to articulate their feelings and lash out rather than appear weak.

Did you both plan to have DD?

Tribpot makes very good point about the finances. Do you know everthing about your financial situation or does he 'handle' everything?

don't you dare let him make you feel like you did a damn thing wrong! he's caused enough damage without you trying to take the blame for this too. as for screaming at him.... if only you could see the way dp and i are sometimes, screaming isn't the end of the world, it's a fantastic release in most ways and at least you told him exactly how you felt at least once before it was over. he deserves alot more than that!

He really sounds depressed rocklover ...
I know that many men get depressed after a baby comes into the picture for many reasons (a kind of PND for blokes).
Sometimes I guess it is the fact that the mum has transferred her love to the baby and he feels out of the picture.
For some I believe it must be the whole overwhelming thing of being 'husband and provider' for these two people who depend on him so much ...
I know that although my husband didn't get depressed as such (that was my domain lol) he definitely put himself under a lot of pressure to 'provide' and so got us into debt without me knowing so that it could look like he was providing for us IYSWIM? It nearly ended our marriage.
My friend's husband is going through a belated reaction to fatherhood now she is pregnant with their third child ...
I know many mumsnetters have had terrible times with awful husbands etc and it is easy for us all to say 'He's a bastard' etc ... but I think it must be just as massive an adjustment for some men as it is for most women ...
I hope you manage to find a way through this (it sounds like you have a lot of support from your parents, which is great)

I think its good you lost it- he sounds as if he's been acting selfishly since your dd was born. Hopefully he'll take a look at himself and either seek treatment for depression (if it is that) or stop behaving like a selfish arse (if it isn't).

You may find a PT job is an option, but he needs to talk to you, not sulk. He does sound like he's having trouble adjusting but he has a little girl he's responsible for now and needs to sort himself out really, not blame you for the way he's feeling because you haven't got a ft job.

by saying I think it's good you lost it, I mean because he may now have to start thinking about what he actually wants rather than just blaming you. It might shock him into wising up a bit. Try to find some time to relax while you're at your parents.

hi Rl,

sounds like your dh is suffering from a combination of depression and NFA

New Father Arseholeness, as many have said some men do feel left out or fearful of the new responsibility they face when a child enters the relationship, they are used to the total attention of their woman and now although the child is theirs and they love them they also feel a kind of strange almost resentment at the change in the dynamics between them and their partner...and they usually react immaturely (mine had an early mid-life crisis!)

This is not your fault.... he is unhappy and directing his pain at you..

You do really need to talk to him about whats going on and your future, but it's probably best to wait a while and let things settle, don't make any rash judgements or decisions just take it easy and try to be as calm as you can (its not easy I know!)you are doing really well he is being an arse please DONT BLAME YOURSELF I did that for a while but one day I realised it wasn't me, it was him!...you both need to work together but he needs to do his part.

Hang in there babexx

We are much more sympathic to Mums who suffer PND but it seems we have little sympathy for Men going through a similar thing. I know they don't have the hormones running riot but Ghosty puts it very well, it is an enormous pressure Men/Fathers are under especially if they are the main breadwinner. The problem is not that he feels this way more that he can't or won't talk about it and lashes out instead.

I think the reason we are sympathetic to women with PND is that they have a mental illness and are unable to act rationally or help themselves.

New fathers, on the other hand, are not subject to hormonal changes or the enormous effect of pregnancy and giving birth. They are grown ups who are fully in charge of their actions. If they find the adjustment stressful, they are perfectly capable of thinking about it and trying to work it out. If they can be bothered. Rather than going into a massive self-pitying sulk and lashing out at their vulnerable babies or vulnerable wives/partners.

Yes, but depression is a mental illness that can be triggered by anything and birth of a new baby is certainly a trigger. I think it's a bit harsh to say that 'they are perfectly capable of thinking about it and trying to work it out. If they can be bothered'. If you are depressed then you are not perfectly capable of thinking about it an trying to work it out.

Men should be encouraged to express their feelings and it should be recognised that they are as likely to suffer from depression as any woman. I have suffered depression prior to having any baby and I can tell you it is a real and terrifying illness. Because PND can be explain in part to hormones doesn't make it any more valid than your bog standard depression.

Drosophila, I agree that he may be depressed and that he does need to talk, however every time I try to encourage him he just gets upset and we end up arguing. When I ask him what's wrong he says he doesn't know, or that he feels unwell and when asked how he feels unwell, he doesn't know that either. We have discussed possible depression, but he won't go to the Drs as he says he will not take pills and he is not keen on counselling. He comes from a violent and strange family, which I feel has caused him problems dealing with his emotions. He is supposed to be coming over to my parents today (already planned before argument) and is still happy to do so, he is going along the lines that this is just another argument and not serious. He feels that because he has only been this bad (this time) for a week that I should put up and shut up. He says he loves me and DD, but since Thurs when we left he has not phoned once, even to tell me waht time he is coming over, love eh?

How about you speaking to your GP and get advice on how to deal with him or maybe contact \link{http://www.mind.org.uk/About+Mind/Mindinfoline.htm\MIND).

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