ex staying too long at pick ups

[downday]

my ex husband picks up my children on the weekends and a day during the week, and on pick up and dropping them off, he takes ages putting whatever stuff they had away, getting them organised (despite me having everything ready) and generally saying hello. this would be fine but we are not on good terms and i think he is doing it on purpose - i have told him lots of times that i want him just to come, pick them up, drop them off and thats it, no more. and every single time he comes he asks to go to the loo - he does a number 2 every single time and it leaves the worst smell ever, and this is the only time i get to have a bath and its really starting to pee me off. i know this sounds really trivial - but its upsetting, and we had an argument this morning because i said 'can you not go in your own house' and he said i was 'denying him the right to go to the toilet!'
the thing is he lives ten minutes away! surely he can go in his own house? i do not mind - but it is every single time.

am i being really unreasonable? in some ways, i think i am. but in another light, he should just be respecting me and literally coming to deal with the children and being on his way. please someone put me in my place and tell me to get over this. im left on my own again today upset because of the interactions we had over pick up.

[CuriousMama]

Tears are a control tool

I agree he'll get nasty, sorry to say this but he will.

[ThingsThatMakeYouGoHmmm]

Probably crying because he wasn't getting his own way

I know that sounds mean :( .. be prepared for him to start getting nasty, just in case.. he sounds like he is trying to get you to feel sorry for him .. in a controlling way.

[pictish]

OP - he is basically telling you that you have no right to decide not to have him in the house. He is trying to emotionally blackmail you into giving in to him, making out that to not give in makes you a hard hearted and unreasonable person.

You're not.

The tears are to make you toe the line and stop all this silly standing up to him business. Just watch, as you continue to refuse him free reign to dump in your toilet, and put the baby to bed, the tears will dry up and he will become nasty.

Your insistance on controlling your own environment will infuriate him.

[DontmindifIdo]

He has no respect for you. doesn't matter what he says, his actions show he doesn't actually care about your feelings. Hold on to that, if he doesn't give a shit about your feelings, why should you care about his?

[WongaDotMom]

Tell him the bathroom is otherwise engaged

[QuintessentialShadows]

Do be careful when he is providing written evidence by text about how much he is trying, and how much he loves you. When it does go down the legal route, he will be able to provide these text and emails to show his lawyer and court how reasonable he is and how unreasonable you are.

You need to be able to provide the same type of written text/email evidence that shows the situation as it really is. With him being abusive, controlling, disrespecting you, not listening, etc.

[skyebluesapphire]

When I was hoping to reconcile with STBXH after he walked out, he was seeing DD 4yo twice a week and coming in for tea. I made it quite plain that would all end if it was totally over . I got accused of blackmailing him but I said no, you need to face the reality of separation.....

When he was putting DD to bed it was very confusing for her and every morning she would ask if he was still here which then upset me. Once she saw him driving away after drop off, she settled much quicker and knew that he was gone.

[perfectstorm]

Agree with QuintessentialShadows on his creating a favourable "paper" (text) trail, sadly.

I think a calm, measured email, describing his behaviour and focusing entirely on how negatively it impacts the kids, and then suggesting a neutral venue going forward to reduce the emotional intensity and thus the stress for them might be wise. If you are totally child oriented and insist that he is not to continue to bring the dynamics between you into handovers for the sake of the children, he can't continue to talk about "respect".

What he is doing is shitty to you, but worse for the kids. He's making a dogs dinner out of what should be simple. I agree; insist on neutral settings in future, a cafe or a relative's house (witness is useful in the latter case, as is your ability to leave promptly no matter what he does, as all the kit he needs is in that house).

[Lovingfreedom]

I actually disagree with the favourable light stuff...He is trying to scare and/or manipulate you with this. It will have no bearing on a court case. All you have to be careful about is that you don't react abusively yourself (which you wouldn't) and that you allow him reasonable access. You don't have any obligation, legal, moral or otherwise to respond to any communication from your ex about feelings, emotions or anything else. You not letting him in the house will never look bad in a court because it's your home and not his. Neither will you denying him use of the bathroom.

I'd advise that you try to ignore these long texts and emails. IME it's the only way to deal with them. I used to get these by the bucketload from my ex, masquerading as caring about me, only wanting the best, blah blah blah. I gave up responding to anything other than logistics and legal matters.

My replies are always very short and factual. My ex eventually said to me 'I get the feeling that whatever I say, you don't care'....the penny had dropped. Now it wasn't that all these messages and hurtful things didn't upset me...I just stopped letting him know it did...and, well I still get them from time to time...but much less often and now, they really don't affect me anywhere near as much.

I think that some of the advice you are getting here to write calm and reasonable emails explaining yourself are fine when you are dealing with a calm and reasonable person. In your case though, you are dealing with someone controlling...therefore reasoning does not work. What does work is just short and informative...this is how it is. You don't want him in the house. There's no need to explain why. It's up to you and he doesn't come in. You are not obliged to react to his so-called care or love....that's up to him to sort out. Don't worry about looking bad in his eyes...he's someone who shits in your house to wind you up and ignores your requests and suggestions....is his opinion really valuable?

[downday]

Thanks...I don't really understand the whole court case stuff and I agree that its important for me not to react in a bad way myself. Ur right that its hard to ever reason with him. So many people seem to have come thru this its amazing. Its so hard to just keep pulling myself away from him, and to be honest I'm heart scared of trying to sort out stuff like christmas.

[cestlavielife]

downday, my ex tried all these tricks too. down to needing toilet. eventually i just said no. he has understood now he cant come over the threshold.

"so i sent one back saying he was naive about what respect is and saying he has done more than disagree, and that he needs to find out what goes on in the real world when people separate." oh dear that is engaging with him - hard as it is you only need to text him factual sentences, not try and explain your feelings or his.

dont tell him what you feeling or what he shoulod be feeling.

just ignore anything about feelings, dont tell him your feelings,
do tell him factual matters like "dd has a cold she had calpol at 4 pm. next dose due at 8 "

[cestlavielife]

christmas - propose now hat you want to suggest re contact in an email -

eg i suggest i drop the kids off at your mum's at xx pm on xmas day.

i will pick them up at 6 pm.

etc .

yes sort out the divorce/finances etc

[cestlavielife]

remember his feelings = his problem.
he can take them to his therapist/friends/mum/dadsnet to moan .

(you get to bring yours here - dont share them with him...)

[Lovingfreedom]

Agree with cestlavielife don't tell him your feelings and don't tell him what he needs/how he should behave/anything like that.
In fact, don't tell him anything that doesn't involve a time, place or essential exchange of factual information. No explantations needed.
Even if he sends long emails about his feelings. Ignore all but the essential logistical/factual stuff.

[AnnIonicIsoTronic]

Haven't read the thread - but I have to at the idea that doing a turd in someone's toilet is 'working on your relationship'. Surely its emphasising all the downsides, if anything!!

[downday]

Lol I gueSs him leaving smelly turds is not exactley romanticising me back is it. Ok I get it I will just give him the low down about what needs done on a practical sense with dd and keep all feelings and shoulds shouldnts out. We all went to my mums for dinner last year at christmas does that mean this year she has to go to his mums which is what would have been happening if we were together? I can't bear the thought of spending any of christmas without her but I know it will have to be. How does everyone else deal with it?

[Lovingfreedom]

Christmas probably easiest is to alternate years. When you don't have your DD on Xmas Day, celebrate yourself with her on Xmas Eve instead and if you can find somewhere to go yourself on Xmas Day...it's just a day, though. You will find a way to celebrate and enjoy being with your DD.

[downday]

I can't bear the thought of not being with her on christmas day I'm serious...its going to be soooo hard. I guess ill have her early in the morning and I could always ask to have her after the dinner say around 4.30ish. Its awful thought. Maybe I could go help the homeless or something!

[recall]

I've heard of them doing the poo thing before

[MrsTomHardy]

I always have my ds on xmas day....he has him boxing day and its been that way for 9 years and it wont be changing.....he left and hes an arsehole so i always have birthdays and xmas day...end of.

[Bonsoir]

Don't let him in the house!

[downday]

That's great u have them mrstom. Knowing dh he would never in a million years settle for me having her every year

[skyebluesapphire]

apologies, confusing my threads - your XH may not have walked out on you, so please ignore my comments....... I have posted on the same issue a couple of times this morning...

[cestlavielife]

op he lives nearby - so you can split xmas day this year if needs be.

dont stress it too much. it is one day. how old are dc ?

re skyblue's - did op's h "choose to have an affair and walk out on your family" ? if so why is he wanting to work on your relationship?