Dh owns property and we also have no will, anybody else in this situation?

[feelokaboutit]

I have told him what happens in the case of his dying before me intestate but he refuses to get involved in the discussion or do any research. First of all telling me that I had got my information off "bitches and cows" on the internet, then when I told him I had got it off a government website he made sarcastic comments wondering why I had been doing research in the first place. The fact of the matter is that if I die before him his life does not change in a practical way at all, but if the reverse happens, my life and the children's lives would have to change a lot.... What I can't understand is why, just for the sake of the children, he wouldn't at least inform himself.

Our relationship is not good and we are in counselling so there is a lot of mistrust between us, but I find that this issue really pulls me down emotionally...

I suppose one of my questions is whether I am being "greedy" and should really live in the present rather than worry about an intangible future??

If you make a will without him,he is going to wonder what is in yours,and it sounds like he might get worried.Which may just force him to write his.

Most people going through divorce who earn less than their other half take out life insurance and pay the premiums. You ought to. Also get a full time job to protect yourself.

Secondly is the house in jiont names? You need to find these things out. Is it held as tenants in common or joint tenants? If it is joint names joint tenants then when he dies his half comes to you - all of it 100% and only savings etc If he has severed the joint tenancy and it is tenants in comon or if the house is not in joint names then his half goes into his estate. Can you answer for us those issues so we can advise better?

Also make your own will as you may die after him and have loads to leave your children. Also wills can include guardianship arrangements whichi s only fair to the children to make now too if you were both dead.

It is very common that lenders require life insurance. Also does his job not provide life insurance? Wven my 20 something children have life insurance through work which means although they have little else if they die fairly large sums will be paid out.

Quite a lot of company pensions have some sort of death in service benefit. Mine paid out 3x annual salary plus a pension to my DH which assumed that I had reached full retirement age.

While I could specify my wishes the trustees didnt have to follow them (in case I decided to leave my pension to my fancy man!).

OP I think you may find that you are in a lot better position than you imagine in the event of your H's untimely demise. However, I dont recommend spicing up his coffee with hemlock just yet.

Have you asked him how he'll afford to pay for the childcare if you die now - if you were hit by a bus tomorrow would he be able to continue to hold down his job without hiring a nanny? Does he know how much they charge in london? Would he want to do all the cleaning etc you do now (nannies will not clean) or will he need to hire a cleaner as well? Price this up, suggest even if he doesn't want to insure his own life, he might want to insure yours... 'free' labour only is 'worthless' right up until the point you have to pay to replace it...

Oh and he's a knob, in the short term you should look at leaving him, not getting a will, you'll get at least 50% of everything and can then he can leave his share to whomever he wants...

If you're 43 and you think your marriage is over then for gods sake end it now, as you do indeed have 20+ years to earn yourself some financial security. Don't limp along "for the sake of the children" only to find yourself divorced, unemployed and with little or no capital at 55 or older.

I went back to work when I was 42/43ish OP. Started right back at the bottom part-time. I know it was easier nine years ago than now, but there are jobs out there and you don't have only to look at teaching assistant jobs. There is nothing more empowering than being paid with money you have earnt for which you are answerable to no-one. I look at some of the mums who turned up their noses nine years ago because they wouldn't do something as menial as I did. Nine years on I work full-time, have professional quals and an MBA. At 50+ (admittedly with a very happy marriage) I know whose shoes I would rather be in.

Just to say that i have recently sorted out my and DH's wills and some additional life assurance for him (I can't get life assurance due to medical condition, but have good death in service benefit from work). We own joint property and thats about it, fairly equal. I am just about to have second DC (fingers crossed in 5 weeks) and was just worried we weren't sorted out.

However, DH was really, really resistant to the idea, saying very similar things to your DH, accusing me of wanting him dead. I really feel that I had to bully him into it (which I hated), every discussion about it was a row, every mention left him furious and refusing to agree on things like executors or guardians for the DC, saying we needed one from each 'side', the phone call with the solicitor was tortuous with only me speaking really, and I feel like I have railroaded it through on him.

Now its all sorted, a couple of weeks later he said he is really glad its organised. I asked him why it was so difficult and he said he just fouund it too depressing to think about.

Perhaps OP its easier for me as finances are pretty equal, but is there any way you could push it through.

As a will writer, I can echo what Lambzig said.

No one really wants to make a will. Lots of people think that it's morbid, or bad luck or something, and there's always something more interesting to do, but it is just one of those things which really isn't that hard.

It takes a 30 minute phone call, and then 15 minutes to check over the draft, and it's done, and one thing less to worry about

I would certainly echo the thoughts of those who recommend getting full time work too as financial protection.

Also do put life insurance and pension proceedings into trust. All the life companies have free forms you can use. It means that when you die those it is in trust for get the money automatically and quicker and it is not included in the estate for inheritance tax. A lot of us are at risk that 40% of the value of our house is given to the state when we die (inheritance tax) if you are above the limit and this is a legal and common way to reduce that risk - consider house prices say in 50 years when you die in this regard not now and you might well be above inheritance tax limits.

Thank you for more interesting messages.

H and I saw counsellor again today and this time I talked more about the possibility of having a will and the reasons for it. Basically h said to leave well enough alone (ie. organising a will is tempting fate) and that the law provides well enough for dependents even in the case of their being no will. Also that by wanting a will I want all of any assets. It is true that asking for this makes me feel greedy and that in general our relationship is on very difficult ground so maybe he is right when he says I should leave all of that and just get on with my / our life.

With regards to the life insurance he says if I want to go ahead and do it I can but he is not going to get involved.

All of this is within the context of our 17 year relationship which has been difficult for a long time though it seems to be reaching a crisis point. I think h and I really do not understand each other. He works very hard and money is tight so talking about insurance policies seems strange to him... What I don't like is feeling so secondary in any proceeding which not having my name on the property and there not being a will etc... makes me feel. Kind of invisible and powerless for some reason.

There is a lot more to our relationship and the issues between us which would be too long to go into here. One of his main gripes against me is my untidiness but I feel that even if I turned into a minimalistic monk, he will never forgive me for this. He is also resentful that I have talked about him on here (in the past) and to friends.... (when we have gone through really difficult patches). I feel there is no longer anywhere to go within our relationship. I have done my fair share of damage, spending too much in the past though that time is over and there were reasons for it. I find him bossy, blaming and bad tempered (on a bad day) but he is also very hard working and can be more light-hearted. This is brief synopsis, I suppose there is a lot more to us than this paragraph could portray!!

By "leave all of that" he means, any talk/thought of wills. He says that there is always something I have been worried / obsessed about (which is true) and that now I am obsessing about this and should stop basically.

He is trying to control you and put you down and belittle you.
Do you think he loves you deep down?
I knew a relationship like this,not mine,and actually the husband and wife loved each other and both knew that about the other.
The marriage rumbled on,and they did stay together.And things improved,probably once the man got a little more incapacitated and didnt have much choice but to rely on the woman,So he mellowed.
Not saying that this would necessarily happen in your case.

Ok, I found myself in exactly the situation you envisage with the exception that I work.

H died leaving no will and no insurance to pay off mortgage and the house was in his name.

I inherited the first 250k which in fact was mostly in equity in the property; after the cash assests were totalled up and his debts paid off there was a few thousand left. However, if H had taken insurance to cover the mortgage in event of his death I would have had to attend court to prove that as his spouse, I already owned half the house thus reducing the equity by half so that it would not get bound into trust for the children, enabling me then to chose if we sold up and moved on. As I had always worked and given him money, this wouldn't have been too difficult, but would have increased solicitors fees for the probate to more than the £10,000 it cost.

Register an interest in the property with the land registry now as a matter of course, I had done this,not knowing my H would die suddenly, and the solicitor said it was a good thing.

Its over two years since H died and I didn't pay the mortgage for 11 months with little hassle from the mortgage company; eventually they requested tacking on the missed payments to the existing mortgage and I have continued to pay it, though it is still in my Hs name as I have yet to sort it out. As I was made executor of his estate, I can liquidate property as an asset at any time - all mortgage company care about is getting their money

At the least (a) take out life insurance on his life and put the policy in trust for your and (b) register your matrimonial interset in the home (I think you are married so can do this) which is in his name so that he cannotm ortgage it or sell it without your consent. That is a public notice to the world that you have a right in it. I think it is something ilke form F or G and is probably on the Land Registry website and can be downloaded. You just fill it in and send it off to the Land Registry.

You can also make your own will of course which might be sensible even if at the moment you have nothing to leave as you might win the lottery next week or you and he might die together and you want guardians for the children to be appointed. Make sure you know all about the family finances, perhaps seek a job for financial protection - if you earned 10x what he did as I did in my marriage I bet he would not be behaving as he is.

Yes that's a good point Xenia, whilst its v v v unlikely if you died simultaneously if you're younger than him you'd be presumed to have died second, so your will would come into force.

Am somewhat bemused that any rational adult actually believes that the act of making a will can bring Malign Fate down on them. Actually wouldn't it make more sense to believe that not making a will would bring Fate down on you? Otherwise it wouldn't be so malign, would it?

Anyway, basically, it sounds like your not so DH is making a power struggle out of the issue (or thinks you are and is determined not to give in to it), rather than that he genuinely believes he'll die sooner for having signed that piece of paper.

I was 18 when I wrote my first will. It just felt sensible, not tempting fate. We all are sure we will die. It's the one certainty in life.

I suspect this is more about the counselling, very bad marriage and his fear all this legal stuff will mean he gets much less of what he sees as his money on divorce or he fears she is preparing to divorce and he doesn't want that.